Critique on this kit

[Paul Adams]

Thinking of replacing my DVD player, DTS/DD amp and widescreen CRT TV with the following kit:

Pioneer DV-370 DVD player (multi-region, DTS/DD, SCART & component out)
http://www.pioneer.co.uk/uk/product_...onomy_id=62-84

Pioneer VSX-D714 A/V amp (DTS/DD, coaxial in, optical in, S-video in, component in)
http://www.pioneer.co.uk/uk/product_...onomy_id=62-98

Sharp LC30HV4E 30" LCD TV (1280x768 WXGA, RGB SCART, composite, 15-pin D-sub, component)
http://www.sharp.co.uk/products/product.asp?id=652


Connections:
- DVD player to amp via component & coaxial cables
- cable TV box to amp via SCART RGB
- amp to TV via component cables


"What Video and Widescreen TV" seemed to think the LCD TV is rather nice when reviewed, and I can get it delivered for under (the equivalent of) £1,900, so the price comment isn't really applicable.
http://www.homecinemachoice.com/cgi-...?reviewid=4207


Does anyone have any of the above kit and can comment on its performance?

[Rave]

I shall research the kit in a minute Paul, but I can tell you straight away that the amp is most unlikely to have scart RGB inputs, and even if it does it's unlikely to be able to convert them to component. Remember component /= RGB. Component is very similar to S-Video in fact, it just has two channels for the chrominance information rather than one.

Rich :¬)

[Zak33]

I look forward to Rave's study, cos A: he knows stuff, B: he needs to get out more and C: I might get one of those Pioneers DVD's too

[Paul Adams]

Originally Posted by Rave

I shall research the kit in a minute Paul, but I can tell you straight away that the amp is most unlikely to have scart RGB inputs, and even if it does it's unlikely to be able to convert them to component. Remember component /= RGB. Component is very similar to S-Video in fact, it just has two channels for the chrominance information rather than one.

Rich :¬)

Cheers, sorry I made a boo-boo on the original post - SCART from STB into amp via s-video (or possibly s-video straight in without need for a converter - I don't have my STB yet to know what outputs it has).

The amp definitely does NOT have SCART inputs, I was looking at component output from DVD and input into amp & TV as I was led to believe this is the best picture quality (per TV review)?

[Rave]

Well, the best quality would be to have a digital connection between the DVD player and the TV. The only reason to go via the amp is for ease of switching, if you don't mind juggling a couple of remotes then I wouldn't bother using the video switching capabilities of the amp. As per Zak's post, I don't need to get out more, I need to actually do some work but I shall come back later with some more detail. In the meantime have a look at the Samsung DVD-HD745 and 945 for some DVD players equipped with digital outputs. The 945 has a built in Faroudja upscaler, and so theoretically should look absolutely spiffing on your flashy LCD TV.

Rich :¬)

[Zak33]

RAVE ...get back to work

[Aaron]

If you can link something directly, it's usually best to do so. At home, I connect my DVD/digital TV/console directly into the TV for video.

As for your selection, I think it's generally good. Pioneer DVDs really can't be beaten at any sensible price-range. They come out top of almost every single group test I've seen and they come with some excellent features. A believe that the next model up includes DVD-A and SACD support too (though you'll need a receiver with 6-channel component in audio to enjoy it).

Personally, I'd be tempted to look at Yamaha's range of receivers. They might not match up with your DVD player so well but they're excellent - especially with films.

I don't know much about the TV so I can't really comment.

[Zak33]

ooh. Aaron too...he knows lots too...cheers Aaron

[Paul Adams]

Originally Posted by Rave

Well, the best quality would be to have a digital connection between the DVD player and the TV.

Yep, but I can't seem to find a LCD TV I like that is:
- a decent size
- has DVI input and component inputs
- isn't too expensive

Original plan was to connect the PC to the DVI port and use the component inputs for the DVD player - I brought the amp into the equation just today

Originally Posted by Rave

The only reason to go via the amp is for ease of switching, if you don't mind juggling a couple of remotes then I wouldn't bother using the video switching capabilities of the amp.

My current setup is:
- Toshiba SD2100E (I think) DVD player (chipped)
- Sherwood DD/DTS amp
- Panasonic 28" widescreen CRT

DVD is connected to amp via coaxial and TV via RGB SCART (ext1).
VCR is connected to TV directly via non-RGB SCART (ext2).
(VCR is just to get PAL-G signal into PAL-I TV - or I get no sound.)

So yes, it's just about ease of switching video & audio sources together really - and having nice shiny, matching silver units
All the above kit would be relegated to my bedroom.

Originally Posted by Rave

In the meantime have a look at the Samsung DVD-HD745 and 945 for some DVD players equipped with digital outputs. The 945 has a built in Faroudja upscaler, and so theoretically should look absolutely spiffing on your flashy LCD TV.

Even though the TV doesn't have a digital input?
[Note to self - look up "upscaling" as I've seen that referred to a few times now and don't know what it is]


Thanks too, Aaron, for the input - doubt I'd be bothered about super audio discs though, I've not even bothered with the DV470 as it only really appears to give DivX playback and optical out as extras over the DV370.

So should I be looking at an LCD with DVI & SCART inputs, a DVI-output DVD player and use SCART for the STB, and hook up the coaxial from the DVD player to a regular receiver amp as I do now?

Are there any (DVI-out) DVD players with super-super-low layer-change time? That's always bugged me about watching DVDs.
I have DD and DTS discs, so any potential player must support those.


Edit:
Are LG any good for big LCD screens?
RZ-30LZ50 (doesn't appear to exist on the UK site) has component, SCART (2), s-video and DVI-i inputs.
Text is Swedish, but it mentions that "Faroudja" thingy as well as progressive scan.

[Howard]

Link the DVD's video output straight to your TV via Svideo/SCART/Component. That will allow for the best quality.

Link the DVD's audio to the amp via COAX or OPTICAL.

Pioneer stuff is very good so I'm sure you won't hvae any regrets buying that kit.


What speakers will you be using?

[Rave]

Originally Posted by Paul Adams

Yep, but I can't seem to find a LCD TV I like that is:
- a decent size
- has DVI input and component inputs
- isn't too expensive

Sorry, I wasn't paying attention earlier, I thought that one had DVI rather than D-Sub. What you need by the looks of things is the LC-32GA4E which also goes for a smidge over £1900 (in the U.K. at least).

Original plan was to connect the PC to the DVI port and use the component inputs for the DVD player

Yeah, but as I say the ideal solution is to connect the DVD via DVI, as that will give you optimum picture quality. You could of course use your PC to play the DVDs.

- I brought the amp into the equation just today

I would forego a little convenience for the extra picture quality you'll get from hooking it up direct. It seems silly to me to hamper the performance of £2500 worth of home cinema kit by forcing the video through a digital --> analogue --> digital conversion process. Your choice though ultimately......

[Note to self - look up "upscaling" as I've seen that referred to a few times now and don't know what it is]

Upscaling is a generic term for increasing the theoretical resolution of a video signal. Back in the old days of CRT video projectors being the ultimate, the really serious guys would use upscalers with their £5000 Selecos and Barcos because otherwise the scan lines on PAL/NTSC video would be intrusively visible on their big projector screens. Nowadays the process can (and presumably usually is) done digitally. Some sort of upscaling is basically always necessary when using Plasma/LCD screens, as DVDs are encoded at 480x720 (for NTSC) and 576x720 (for PAL) and most plasma/LCD screens are 800x600 resolution or greater. If you fed the Sharp a DVI signal of 480x720 it would have to rescale it to display it properly; I'm not sure if there's any benefit to doing it in the player, but having seen how rubbish it looks when you send the incorrect resolution to an LCD computer monitor I can see that it might be possible.

So should I be looking at an LCD with DVI & SCART inputs, a DVI-output DVD player and use SCART for the STB, and hook up the coaxial from the DVD player to a regular receiver amp as I do now?

That'd be my preferred way of doing it, yes.

I have DD and DTS discs, so any potential player must support those.

You'd struggle to find one that doesn't. As for the players, you should note that some now come with DVI, while some have a new connector called HDMI. As far as I can tell HDMI is just a hopped up version of DVI and you can get converters between the two; HDMI can withstand longer cable runs and includes a digital sound connection. Whether it provides any more potential bandwidth I have no idea.

I should state that I have no direct experience of LCD screens beyond looking at them in shop windows. They tend to look a bit rubbish then, but I suspect that most of the problem is that they're fed an analogue signal and are badly set up. I take it you've already compared LCD to Plasma under optimum conditions and decided that you definately want LCD? If not it'd be worth your while finding a shop that knows what they're doing and making sure that everything is to your taste. Buying Home Cinema kit sight unseen is a bit risky (sorry if you know that already).

Rich :¬)

[Paul Adams]

Originally Posted by Rave

Sorry, I wasn't paying attention earlier, I thought that one had DVI rather than D-Sub. What you need by the looks of things is the LC-32GA4E which also goes for a smidge over £1900 (in the U.K. at least).

Ah, yeah I had a look around the Aquos range and I saved a shortcut for the identical unit, but with the speaker under the screen:
http://www.sharp.co.uk/aquos_tv/rang...duct.asp?id=32

Unfortunately I can't find a supplier in Sweden of this screen, so I've emailed the contact address on the Swedish site to see if they have recommended suppliers.

Struggling to find a supplier nice-looking DVI/HDMI capable DVD players over here too :/

Originally Posted by Rave

I would forego a little convenience for the extra picture quality you'll get from hooking it up direct. It seems silly to me to hamper the performance of £2500 worth of home cinema kit by forcing the video through a digital --> analogue --> digital conversion process. Your choice though ultimately......

True, I guess I was all hyped up about this "progressive scan" thing with component inputs - but that's irrelevant with digital anyway I assume, there is no interlacing then?

Originally Posted by Rave

As for the players, you should note that some now come with DVI, while some have a new connector called HDMI. As far as I can tell HDMI is just a hopped up version of DVI and you can get converters between the two; HDMI can withstand longer cable runs and includes a digital sound connection. Whether it provides any more potential bandwidth I have no idea.

Ah yes, while waiting for my final flight to Sweden I bought a couple of "What Home Cinema" and "What Widescreen TV" kind of mags and read them cover-to-cover (hence the slight awareness of progressive scan, "realistic black" problem and DVI/HDMI).
That's where my idea of having a widescreen TV/monitor with a high resolution (1920x1200) and DVI & component inputs came from, and originally I looked at the 23" HP L2335... though now that sounds tiny

Originally Posted by Rave

I should state that I have no direct experience of LCD screens beyond looking at them in shop windows. They tend to look a bit rubbish then, but I suspect that most of the problem is that they're fed an analogue signal and are badly set up. I take it you've already compared LCD to Plasma under optimum conditions and decided that you definately want LCD? If not it'd be worth your while finding a shop that knows what they're doing and making sure that everything is to your taste. Buying Home Cinema kit sight unseen is a bit risky (sorry if you know that already).

Yeah, had a look at some big stores over here with racks of LCD and plasma TVs on the wall so I get a good idea of direct comparison of picture quality for the same image - any TV I would get I would have to see in action, I wouldn't buy blind from an e-tailer.
"Men In Black" seems a popular choice of movie for comparing the depth of black, so I'd ask for a bit of that to be played, probably The Matrix too


@Howard:
The speakers I am looking at atm, mainly for the looks rather than outstanding performance, are these beech-finish ones:
http://www.onoff.se/online/onoff/gru...tiveprod/25359
I have an active sub already, and appearance isn't so important as I can bung that anywhere


Thanks for all the input guys!

[Howard]

Not a bad choice Might be slightly out-classed by your amplifier though.

[Rave]

Originally Posted by Paul Adams

Struggling to find a supplier nice-looking DVI/HDMI capable DVD players over here too :/

It's a relatively recent innovation as far as I can tell, so the players should start showing up fairly soon.

True, I guess I was all hyped up about this "progressive scan" thing with component inputs - but that's irrelevant with digital anyway I assume, there is no interlacing then?

Yep, I'm pretty sure that's correct. Interlacing for computer screens pretty much died out in the early 90s AFAIK, although I think I still have an ancient Samsung at home which will only do 1024x768 in interlaced mode! It hardly mattered since my 486 only had a 256KB video card. Oh how I pined for an Orchid Fahrenheit- although it played Doom alright so I can hardly moan.

Rich :¬)