Brakes

[Vimeous]

As we were discussing future mods I mentioned brake pads and was firmly told to try something other than my suggested Red Stuff option.

So new thread, what do you recommend and why?

From what I've read on HondaRevolutions Green Stuff are laughable but a good number of peeps have been overjoyed with Red Stuff. They apparently take little time to warm up making them road-suitable and yet for track days round the UK and europe (SPA in a few cases) have stood up to punishment well.
In addition the recommendation is for stock Honda disks as 90% of those who have tried cross-drilled or grooved reckon the OEM vented parts offer better performance for less wear.
Admittedly I am intreguied by the peeps who've had new disks cut from Brembo blanks

So what makes? Who to avoid? Where to buy?



N.B.
Someone somewhere suggested I'm running 282mm disks if that makes a difference.


OOOO
And why would using braided hoses improve pedal feel?

[Shad]

Discs: Stick with normal OEM vented discs, they will be cheaper and won't kill the pads like grooved ones will. Slightly more likely to warp though due to limited cooling properties, but not much of an issue unless you're going to be throwing it around a track 24/7. Also, if you can fit larger diameter discs then go for it, but usually you need different calipers too.

Pads: I've used Ferodo DS2500 pads which are designed for fast road/track day use. They take 1-2 operations to warm up properly but are as good as normal pads when cold I've found. However once up to temperature, they are *amazing*.

Hoses: Braided hoses are useful because they don't bulge/expand as much when you're braking hard. If you can imagine, the brake fluid under more and more pressure the harder you brake, the little rubber hoses on your capilers will flex and bulge under the pressure, giving you slightly less feel. Braided hoses can help reduce this problem.

Also worth thinking about is some good brake fluid, such as some Castrol DOT 5.1 stuff. This is high temp fluid that is ABS safe. Basically it's harder to boil the fluid. Fluid that has boiled will not be much use anymore.

[5lab]

did you know bigger disks will actually REDUCE horsepower at the wheels? because even if hte disk itself is lighter, its further from the centre of the wheel and therefore the wheel needs more effort to turn, and so you get less power..

[Butuz]

Yep, unspring mass (flywheel, transmission, brake disks, wheels, tyres make considerably more difference to performance than just fitting a carbon fibre bonnet and taking the back sets out. Fitting lighter wheels will give you more of an acceleration gain than probably stripping out your entire car.

Lighter flywheel, carbon propshaft, light forged wheels etc are all things that would make a huge difference to the performance of your car, but most people actually fit heavier el cheapo wheels and slow their car down!

As for pads - Ferrordo DS2500 are the reccomended pads for 200sx's at the sx owners club, red stuff, and green stuff are frowned upon, i have green stuff on at the mo fitted by the prev owner, i will be replacing with DS2500 after my next trrack day

As for disks, drilled disks are lighter but have less surface area, so are worse for breaking, really the only way to increase breaking strength considerably is to put bigger disks on as the calipers then get more leverage as they are situated further from the hub. Braided hoses increse power slightly and give better feel.

Butuz

[Lowe]

Braided hoses aren't needed unless you're packing huge 4 pots.

Discs - standards are fine for road use. Grooved are slightly nicer to look at and also do you a favour by helping remove any glazing on the pad surface. This does shorten the life of your pads, but in practice you wouldn't really notice that. The grooves are also good at helping displace any gas build up especially after several stops. Drilled are similar...

I'd defo recommend the DS2500s too. EBC make decent compounds, there's just better around for the same money. If I were forking out, I'd get a set of Brembo Max discs, with DS2500 pads.

[Zak33]

grooves are also for gas dispersment. A thin layer of gas builds up, and the pads glide on it. So grooves are good. But on the road its hard to need them. Unless the car weighs more.

i hate red stuff because they are no good in rallying terms, but thats me being a tart. Mintex. They are the boys. But life on them may be.....lower.

as for bigger disks lowering horsepower. Tricky. They are harder to accelerate and to brake because of their intertia, BUT on a long motorway journey they act like a big fly wheel and actually lower fuel use!!!!

But otherwise everything said is fine. Shad's description of braided hoses is spot on. ne other thing to remember though....as the fluid gets hotter, the runbber hoses flex EVEN more, hence braiding being a good plan. Lots of money for not a lot though.

You know what I'D spend my money on? A new radiator. Have you ever SEEN inside an old radiator...all the muck and crap. The water pump struggles its arse off pushing water through it. Plus its not as efficient. Besides, while changing it you can FLUSH (and I do mean FLUSH) the entire block and pipes

So....new pads = good.
Braided.....wasted
Disks....leave em they're big enough.
Brake fluid....I cant remember what "dot" level to go to, but go TOO far and it rots your cylinder seals ..just keep it changed bi yearly with good quality and you're sorted.

The rest, if you haveit, on a NEW radiator.

Like a PC, heat is the enemy

[Butuz]

Oh so its just me thats packing huge 4 pots and braided hoses?

I'll get me coat

Butuz

[Zak33]

dont say that....I spent all last week packing my house up, 4 huge pots from the kitchen, everything

[Moby-Dick]

Originally Posted by Butuz

Oh so its just me thats packing huge 4 pots and braided hoses?

I'll get me coat

Butuz

nope - I've got the S14a calipers with remachined 300zx discs on

I need to get a hose replaced - one of the braided ones caught fire the other day (long story)

I use pagid pads at the front iirc

[Butuz]

We all have plenty of time for long storys moby - specially if they involve fire!



Butuz

[Moby-Dick]

It involves a spinning wheel stud and my mate getting his earthign point a little too far from where he was wanting to weld. There must have been an arc accross the braiding, which caused the mini conflagration.

[[GSV]Trig]

I'm lookin at upgradin my brakes..
The brakes arent crap by a long shot at legal speeds but why have a car that'll pull 160 if the brakes are crap above 90, maybe there not crap maybe its my driving, eitherway, easier to change the brakes than the driver
Lookin at Vectra GSi 308mm disks/calipers and pads, bit of an upgrade from the Cally's 284mm disks..
Oh and before anyone says have u checked the condition of your standard stuff it had new disks n pads all round n new fluid about 2 months b4 I bought the car...

[Butuz]

I would say a good pair of 4 pots and a decent sized vented disk on front and 1 pots and good disk on back, braided hoses and good quality fluid are all you should need to get very good braking, should certainly be plenty enough for a 160mph car anyway.

Butuz

[Moby-Dick]

I'm happy with my brakes atm - next upgrade would be the bracket to move the caliper so I can fit M3 310mm discs.

[[GSV]Trig]

Originally Posted by Butuz

should certainly be plenty enough for a 160mph car anyway.

Maybe its just me then...
Oh well u can never have too much braking power...

[Butuz]

I would think grip would be the defining factor in stopping flat from 160 in my car rather than brakes, aint tried it tho

Butuz