im sick of all the net whingers

[Karlos007]

Its great news that thers a new xbox possibly on the way with a die shrink, hdmi and a bigger hdd.

but im absolutley aghast at the ammount of people whinging about it.

i mean, hdmi, a nice addition cause its a more tidy cable, and theres a bit more compatibility for 1080p and ofcourse the whole HDCP hd disc thing.

but its not as if the x360 has top have hdmi for 1080p, just make sure you buy a 1080p telly which excepts 1080p through component.

then theres the die shrink to 65nm. big deal. performance will be the same, just will run cooler. hardley a deal breaker.

120gb hdd. well,ok so would be nice, but it means they will relese it to buy as an accessorie, so just slap one on your v1 360. job done.

these additions make the x360 more empowered to fight the ps3.

but they really dont make a v1 360 obsoloete in the slightest. youll be able to play all the games still, still use 1080p if u have a decent telly.

i own a 360 and i dont feel shafted by m$.

but it would seem about 82 million people on the forums are going nuts, saying ms has shafted them, there going to sue, etc. and its doing me head in. rant over!
Karlos

[Veles]

Oh the irony

[Odc]

So long as they bring out an HDMI cable for existing 360's then I don't mind because you can always buy a bigger HDD and so long as your 360 isn't overheating, the 65nm chip will make no difference whatsoever.

[Tom Scott]

I think most of them are annoyed at the way MS said they wouldn't be doing HDMI at launch i.e. 14 months ago, and now they're supposedly bringing it out with HDMI.

MS have got to tread carefullly to a certain extent, why would you buy the HDMI one if just 14 months later there may be one with a incorporate HD-DVD drive and your 360 would have its resale value seriously deminished? You'd be better off getting a PS3 and waiting another 14 months to get what will probably be the "final" 360.

Having had a 360 die on me recently (which I did get exchanged), I'm wondering whether this redesign is more to do with the fairly horrific failure rate of 360 units since the 1080p update (hence the redesign of the ANA scaling chip and not just the change to a 65nm processor).

[Karlos007]

some great responses on here.

certainly an interesting point about the hdmi revision co-insiding with a complete PCB redesign to possibly ssort out a deeper manufacturing / design defect.

My xbox died on me as well, and it was only 2 months old.
about a month after buying it i updated to the 1080p fall update.

i was playing gears of war and i got green corruption all over the screen, akin to a bad overclock on a pc card.
id read a fair bit on the net about dodgy boxes and how thats how it starts, then freezing, then the red ring of death, so i took mine straight back to tescos and got it swapped out str8 away ( i work for tesco so it was easy for me just to walk into work and swap it out )

i updated the new box straight away with the update and this ones been fine since ( touch wood )

I must admit though that i dont buy the update theory though.

one of the forum members on the xbox board at xbox.com has a guide on using a hot air gun on thePCB/GPU to eleviate problems with bricked consoles. the theory is the fault lies with the soldering of the GPU to the PCB, thus the hot air gun softens the solder and makes the connection more stable again.

so yes, maybe the current boxes have a seriouse flaw and maybe this is why we have a new revision coming out.

If thats the reason, then maybe i can see why people are sore about it all.

but if its just because m$ want to keep there console fresh, then sorry, bu tht epeole brandisihing acusations of bieng " shafted " buy m$ or saying there going to sue, are, quiet frankly, redicoulse and unjustified .
Karlos

[Tom Scott]

I agree about the suing, very silly to say you can sue, but most of the people complaining are Americans, make of that what you will.

The heatgun thing only works on certain consoles, its to do with the way the GPU is soldered to the main board, its actually soldered into the socket from in between the chip, and not from underneath as you'd expect. The heating up/cooling down of said chip causes this solder to expand and contract, eventually breaking the contact for some of the pins.

I do buy the update theory, as that update has added 1080p support, so its obviously updated the firmware on the GPU or ANA scaler to support it - maybe making it run hotter which is why as you say the console seem to die with overclockedesque symptoms. The heatgun technique doesn't fix all of the consoles.

If thats not a manufcaturing defect, what is? Why would MS decide to extend the warranty in the states from 90 days to a full year if there wasn't a problem?

Theres been no posting of pictures of the entire new mainboard, so we don't know if they've touched the GPU at all as of yet.

[Karlos007]

Originally Posted by Tom Scott

I agree about the suing, very silly to say you can sue, but most of the people complaining are Americans, make of that what you will.

The heatgun thing only works on certain consoles, its to do with the way the GPU is soldered to the main board, its actually soldered into the socket from in between the chip, and not from underneath as you'd expect. The heating up/cooling down of said chip causes this solder to expand and contract, eventually breaking the contact for some of the pins.

I do buy the update theory, as that update has added 1080p support, so its obviously updated the firmware on the GPU or ANA scaler to support it - maybe making it run hotter which is why as you say the console seem to die with overclockedesque symptoms. The heatgun technique doesn't fix all of the consoles.

If thats not a manufcaturing defect, what is? Why would MS decide to extend the warranty in the states from 90 days to a full year if there wasn't a problem?

Theres been no posting of pictures of the entire new mainboard, so we don't know if they've touched the GPU at all as of yet.

no question in my mind that your right, to some degree there is a definate manufacturing issue. i suppose the question which relates to this new revison, is weather it is a MANUFACTURING DEFECT or a DESIGN DEFECT.

to make that more visual, my idea of a MANUFACTURING DEFECT would be a problem that dosent affect the majority of 360's, and is primerily caused by a lack of quality control when the gpus are bieng soldered to the PCB's, so its situational and factors such as whos working on the lines when your console is put together, affects the outcome.

my idea of a DESIGN DEFECT, on the other hand, would be where the very nature of how the gpu interfaces with the rest of the system is flawed, and would most probably affect the majority of systems coming off the lines.

id imagine a DESIGN DEFECT would warrent a pcb revision, whilst a manufacturing defect would be combatable with better quality control, and while a pcb revison would help, perhapsse by taking the manufacturing skill out off the equation, it would have huge costs involved. in this case i would make that a secondary benefit from a PCB revision.

now im still happy on the presmise that this revision 2 xbox is just m$ increasing there customer offer, and not a sneaky way of them adressing a DESIGN FAULT, and im hoping that all the fallen consoles are symptomatic in poor quality control at the factorys that has now been adressed.

as for 90 day warrenty increase, whilst aknowledging there have been some MANUFATURING DEFECTS on some of there consoles,i believe its more a case of microsoft trying to bring parity between the level of protection us customers enjoy and that of most markets, such as here in blighty, where the consumer is rightly given a 12 month warrenty

although im probably just a nieve, ramatic idealist...lol
KARLOS

[Dooms]

Ummm I dont see the point in HDMI, quality is the same, it actually frees up our TV's HDMI slot for the cable box and let me quote bittech

Up until now, thanks to the recent Xbox Live update, Microsoft has enabled people to use the analogue component and VGA connections to watch their movies in HD, essentially DRM-free. Could this mean mean more people seek out the version 1 console in DRM-free preference?

Its actually allowing people more freedom

Ok the new HDD may be a bitch but you payed for a smaller HDD, the new model may be the same price you payed but its 2 years later!

[Craig321]

Originally Posted by Karlos007

but it would seem about 82 million people on the forums are going nuts, saying ms has shafted them, there going to sue, etc. and its doing me head in. rant over!
Karlos

lol, people have seriously been saying they're going to sue?

So are they going to sue Windows because they made Vista as well?

Also, they mustn't forget to sue everything other company that had made an upgraded version of whatever they create.

Craig.

[torched_geek]

Originally Posted by Craig321

lol, people have seriously been saying they're going to sue?

So are they going to sue Windows because they made Vista as well?

Also, they mustn't forget to sue everything other company that had made an upgraded version of whatever they create.

Craig.

I can imagine somebody tries to sue Microsoft everyday, M$ just has a very efficient legal team that will run anybody who tries this down in their tracks, though I can remember from a few years back, when every other week the runner of a Linux distro was suing them for an unlawful monopoly. I'm sure Vista will bring this back.

[Craig321]

Originally Posted by torched_geek

I can imagine somebody tries to sue Microsoft everyday,

Probably.

Some people will try sue for anything

[torched_geek]

Yeah, that's true..
The Americans especially seem to have a suing fetish.
-Shrugs- I suppose there's millions to be made out of suing a multi-billion dollar company, Lol.

[Oobie-]

well,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPOI-26RVHo

I think it may just kill this guy

[Dorza]

Originally Posted by Oobie-

well,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPOI-26RVHo

I think it may just kill this guy

I have a mate like that. Well he's less audible more physical....He's broken a number of controllers; the latest victim met its end just a few weeks back and now he can't play his PS2, he mentioned doing something to the unit its self but I don't think its borken. He often pulls a tantrum and throws them against the wall. The end result is them ending up in bits. He also punched the back of his chair and broke a finger after dieing in some game.

[vrykyl]

why not update the console as technonolgy allows you to improve it and still make profit??

New buyers get an improved product, original buyers can update if they choose (with hdmi cables, bigger hdd) and everyone can still play the games.....which at the end of the day is surely the point??

Mobile phone manufacturers update products all the time under the same brand name...no-one howled as badly when the nintendo DS lite came out, or the slimline ps2.....

stupid whingers

[803hart]

*sigh* typical reaction