News - Microsft makes its first loss ever of £313m, but should we care?

[HEXUS]

Especially given that it's all aQuantive's fault.

Read more.

[cheesemp]

I know some will attack me for this but I can't help but feel Microsoft are beginning to have a bit of an IBM moment. IBM sat happy making money and suddenly found themselves floundering when Windows appeared and stole their business. They responded with OS/2 which was by many accounts I've read better than Windows yet windows won. Wonder if Windows 8 might be Microsoft's OS/2? Lets face it all empires must fall eventually and in IBM's case it was no bad thing as it forced the company to reinvent itself.

I know people will respond by saying that Windows runs on 90% of all PCs and that Microsoft is always the default choice - Don't forget the phrase 'No one gets fired for buying Microsoft products' used to be 'No one gets fired for buying IBM products'.

I could of course be wrong but I think Microsoft are just too late to the game and don't have a good reputation in the home consumers mind - Just ask a guy on the street if he'd rather have Windows or Apple products....

[Brewster0101]

Wonder if Windows 8 might be Microsoft's OS/2?

Bet there is still no alternative to the mass market on the PC ? OS/2 was up against a developed mass marketed OS, not really the same with windows 8. Windows 8 may not succeed against Android or Apple iOS in the mobile game but it will succeed on the desktop/Laptop.


Is this not the first lose since the company was floated on the stock market - not the first lose ever in the companies history. I read elsewhere that alot of media are reporting the facts slightly incorrectly regarding this.

[cheesemp]

Bet there is still no alternative to the mass market on the PC ? OS/2 was up against a developed mass marketed OS, not really the same with windows 8. Windows 8 may not succeed against Android or Apple iOS in the mobile game but it will succeed on the desktop/Laptop.


Is this not the first lose since the company was floated on the stock market - not the first lose ever in the companies history. I read elsewhere that alot of media are reporting the facts slightly incorrectly regarding this.

Have you seen the number of people buying Apple desktop PCs at the moment? Every time I walk past the apple store in southampton I seem to see someone leaving with one and its all PCWorld seem to pushing now. This is the risk Microsoft are taking with Metro - By forcing people to learn a new system what stops them from going to competitor to learn the new system? Saying that I think Microsoft main competitor in the short term is definitely Windows 7.

[kingpotnoodle]

The facts speak more volumes that "I saw someone leave PC World with a Mac".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems

Most people can't afford or don't want a Mac, thus it commands <10% of the market, the majority of the rest are buying Windows PCs. Consumers are only part of the picture, most businesses have no place for Macs as they are simply harder to administrate when business desktops (as a Systems Admin I have hands on here, Active Directory + Group Policy and other Microsoft technology is genuinely unrivaled) and thus only get a share in small creative type businesses where there is a software driven need to own them. That or being a ponce and trying to have a "sexy office" (cringe).

Mac has always and will for the foreseeable future be a niche in laptops and desktops, iPad's are gadgets not computers and the perceived (IMHO misplaced) consumer love doesn't carry over fully.

Ask a man on the street does he want Apple - yes but he probably wants an iPad/iPhone, ask him if he'd buy a Mac and show him the price and he'd probably say no it's too expensive.

[dcwt2010]

As much as I'd like to see a challenger to the OS monopoly of MS Windows, I don't see that happening any time soon. Unless iOS starts being shipped on new PCs etc, it will remain a niche product but with the profit margin Apple has... they simply don't care.

[tickleonthetum]

I think they've gambled a lot on Windows 8 and I don't think it will pay out!

Having tried it I won't be getting it. Hate the Metro look and feel. The start screen is just a waste of space for me, every thing I do is on the desktop. My wife who uses computers at work hates it too.

I suspect the Surface will flop as well if it even ever makes it into the shops. Too little too late by then...

[d032sh]

I think the people who care about Metro will easily find ways around it, even if Microsoft don't provide a simple 'boot to desktop' option I'm sure there will be (or are already) shell extensions, registry hacks etc. which will bypass Metro for the geeks (and I count myself amongst their numbers) who don't want it.

Everyone else will just get it on their new shiny PC they bought in a shop and get used to it. I don't recall a Windows launch since '95 where non-techy people were really excited about upgrading from an already working system (and most of them were disappointed with the slowness when they did).

Microsoft probably won't get the corporate buy-in for 8, 7 is proven and pretty solid so I can see it becoming a fixture in offices in much the same way XP is now. I can't see them worrying too much about Windows sales to be honest, there's still a lot of mileage left in making cash from sales of 7 to corporates and they will continue to sell a copy of windows on pretty much all new consumer PCs.

[mikerr]

Unaltered metro apps will run everywhere:

desktop (win8),
tablets (surface)
phones (win phone)
and xbox too

When you look at it that way, it can only be a big win.

[DannyM]

iOS succeeded because it was so simple to use, Windows 8 Metro UI is taking the exact same approach yet a lot of you think it will fail, surely the mass market would prefer something more simple to use?

I personally won't use metro unless on a tablet or phone as it has no place on a desktop machine for me but for the general consumer I can imagine the simplicity will be nothing short of a success for MS and the price of the machines against those of Apples should entice customers even more.

As for this loss for MS well it's nothing at all in reality, just a venture gone wrong. Their shares were up 1.6% so that says it all.

[dangel]

For all the noise about 8 being the death knell for MS I really don't subscribe to the view. I think MS are doing the right thing - it's not about the current implementation it's about a future for MS products in the changing ecosystem of the internet and devices to access it. MS have seen the writing on the wall - they need to be relevant in the Mobile and Tablet space and they're not. Drastic change is needed. By building a multi platform OS (WP8/8/RT are all based on NT now) and a shared app platform (Metro) they're being very clever - using the one market they are big in to push into the others. I wouldn't be shocked to see the next XBox become part of this family too - the commonality and the portability between devices could be really powerful if implemented well. More importantly, it'd be unique. Apple aren't there yet because the desktop is irrelevant to them (and they have no real market share) and I don't see much happening of interest in OSX as a result. Google are massive in mobile and look to be making a serious play for the tablet market (zero on the desktop though). There is an opportunity for MS here - i'm certainly very interested in the tablet they've shown off.

Metro won't make sense - yet - and won't be fully resolved - yet - but MS aren't playing a short term game and everything I've seen in the past 3 years from them makes me think they've changed an awful lot as a company. So much so, in fact, that MS are now a company willing to take risks. Even if a lot of people skip 8 they'll pull through it - just like they did with Vista. I'm certain 8 will be ignored by a lot of businesses (but surface might be huge here so..) but arguably the corporate market can take 2 years to move to a new OS. As for the box shifters they'll sell PCs with 8 and most consumers will get it that way (and few really care about which 'Windows' they get other than 'new').

The slightly sad thing is that 8 is a really good OS - if you can make your peace with Metro it's really very good indeed.

[Hicks12]

Think its a silly question, we shouldnt care as MS has yet to release the new Office (which looks brilliant!)/ Win8/ WP8 / MS Surface.

They actually improved on sales/revenue from last year by 4%, thats an improvement so its all good but unfortunately they had written off a massive investment that went bad which is what happens from time to time, its good they have the money to pay for it, id be worried if revenue was down by 10%+ and they made the loss by writing off this investment but they havent .

To many potential mass sales to be had with the release of the above items, its going well for Microsoft and I cant see their demise any time soon, apple on the other hand well they have really invested in much at all, they are sitting on these billions and doing nothing with it and that will be their downfall as all they have used it for is to sue/stifle competition which is now getting thrown back at them, they are hardly innovating and will be lost in the market that they actually made 'popular'.

[dangel]

Don't worry, i'm sure the next iPhone will have an uber high res screen. With the same dull grid of static icons.

[brasco]

Only £313m with a £3.94 Billion write off is not that bad at all!

[Smudger]

Isn't this loss just the result of an accounting write-down of a bad asset? So really, it's not as big news as they are making out.MS had plenty cash, used some of it to buy another business, that failed, oh well, write it off. It means nothing really, just a number on a spreadsheet...

[crossy]

Unaltered metro apps will run everywhere:
desktop (win8), tablets (surface), phones (win phone) and xbox too
When you look at it that way, it can only be a big win.

Hmm, I remain to be convinced - metro only becomes a selling point if (and at the moment it's a big "if" as far as I'm concerned) you see a lot of useful apps - preferably pushed by a simple to use and cheap app store.

I remember being told that Active Desktop was going to be "a major paradigm shift" and then that Vista Gadgets "would change the way we all work" - no and no. Then again, maybe Metro is MS's "third time lucky".

Plus, he says refilling his bucket with more cold water, you're assuming that phones and tablets are going to sell in bucketloads. Not a safe assumption I'd say - given that they're up against very strong Android and iOS competition. We've all seen the comments here on how much a lot of people (dangel excepted) "like" desktop Metro (ie they don't), and the XBox implementation only works well if driven by Kinect - which means it needs you standing up (I know they're working on that) and with a lot of free space to move in.

Getting back to the article - MS makes a loss - "big deal" says I. They took a gamble and it didn't pay off - so now they're writing it off. That still leaves the rest of the divisions ticking over nicely thank you very much. So at worst this is a "blip" - nothing more.

Oh, and what is it with this implication that just because IBM pulled out of the PC market, they somehow "failed". Last time I checked ole Big Blue was doing very well indeed - market conditions permitting of course.