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Thread: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

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    News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Servers were shut down and then game removed, despite the single player missions.
    Read more.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Very, very dodgy precedent. Have any of the purchasers kicked up a fuss? I presume Steam has made no effort to recompense them?

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Always on DRM has resulted in this problem on a number of occasions already (cf. games for windows live) but theres been other ones in the past. Ultimately the issue here rests firmly with Sqenix, if they made the game unplayable by turning off their drm servers they've caused the issue, and its them that should be compensating players. (although considering the resale value I don't think anyones going to be chasing it).

    It makes sense for steam to remove the store page so no one could accidentally buy it, and I'd like to give valve the benefit of the doubt that their system won't let them have orphaned games installed but with no store page.

    All that being said, I still try to avoid always on drm wherever possible.
    Last edited by herulach; 31-12-2013 at 01:06 PM. Reason: formatting

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    But Steam have done that sort of thing before - see Dragon Age II. You could buy it, and now you can't. It's another kettle of fish to completely erase it from people's libraries though.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    It's not just the "always on" type of DRM either though: what happens when game X requires online activation for the install and the activation servers have been shut down? Developers could patch the DRM out with an update in the same way that the original Dawn of War game had its copy protection patched out with the last update, but most will choose not to spend the extra time/money on a game that isn't making any more revenue.

    In twenty years time (probably less), most of these games will not be playable and the "nostalgia kick" will only be available in the unlikely event that they are re-released - but you'll have to pay for the game again.

    tl;dr DRM is bad for the consumer.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Here's me with my tapes and floppy disks on C64, Amiga, Atari ST etc.

    As long as I store them properly I will still own and be able to play them in the next 20 years.

    Steam / Valve is a great platform and stuff like this is beyond their control, this lands right in the court of Square Enix. Dragon Age 2 if you have bought it on Steam already, even though it is removed from the store you can still download and play it, you can even activate the key on Origin if you wished. This was an EA thing, they took that and Crysis 2 off Steam, Crysis 2 is back on there now, surprised that DA2 hasn't come back. Same goes for Wolfenstein, I have that and can still download it on Steam even though it has been removed from the store, believe that has something to do with licensing. Then look at games that have been removed from GOG's catalog, Second Sight & XIII earlier this year and Fallout series is due to leave midnight tonight as Bethesda haven't renewed with GOG.

    Unfortunately this happens, I hope that Valve shows their customers some support with this and maybe gives affected users a credit to their wallet as form of compensation.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferral View Post
    Here's me with my tapes and floppy disks on C64, Amiga, Atari ST etc.

    As long as I store them properly I will still own and be able to play them in the next 20 years.

    Steam / Valve is a great platform and stuff like this is beyond their control, this lands right in the court of Square Enix. Dragon Age 2 if you have bought it on Steam already, even though it is removed from the store you can still download and play it, you can even activate the key on Origin if you wished. This was an EA thing, they took that and Crysis 2 off Steam, Crysis 2 is back on there now, surprised that DA2 hasn't come back. Same goes for Wolfenstein, I have that and can still download it on Steam even though it has been removed from the store, believe that has something to do with licensing. Then look at games that have been removed from GOG's catalog, Second Sight & XIII earlier this year and Fallout series is due to leave midnight tonight as Bethesda haven't renewed with GOG.

    Unfortunately this happens, I hope that Valve shows their customers some support with this and maybe gives affected users a credit to their wallet as form of compensation.
    I retract some of my earlier bit then, didn't realise steam had pulled stuff from the store but still left it downloadable before.

    I still think the article should make it clearer that effectively all valve have done is take a broken game off steam. Its sqenix that have broken it.

    As far as longevity goes, steam/origin/uplay/<whatever blizzard call their thing> only patches seem the most annoying, particularly when they're locked to an account *cough* stardock *cough*.

    This kind of attitude is clearly driven by consoles, where backwards compatibility is less of a consideration (and is pretty niche anyway) and is only going to get worse as digital distribution becomes mainstream there also.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Did they really make it "not happen"? I bought City of Heroes Going Rogue (which is a dead game now) and it's not on my games list, but it's on my "Licenses and subscriptions" list and "Store Transactions".

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    As others have said the blame for this lays with Square Enix, if a developer or publisher closes down servers supporting a game they should at least release a patch to remove the DRM, at best release the server side software to the public so people can run their own servers if they wish.
    All things like this do are give people more reasons not to buy games with DRM, or with the DRM removed.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Remind me never to buy anything from Square Enix.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Quote Originally Posted by ET3D View Post
    Did they really make it "not happen"? I bought City of Heroes Going Rogue (which is a dead game now) and it's not on my games list, but it's on my "Licenses and subscriptions" list and "Store Transactions".
    Actually that reminds me of a good example that isn't Steam related, MMO's like City of Heroes, particularly those with a F2P micro-transaction option, are very vulnerable to being pulled when funding drops too low to cover costs and when they go, all your previous purchases become irrelevant.

    I do wonder how long it will be until a case ends up before the courts in the US or Far East, citing theft or fraud for selling goods with a limited lifespan, despite whatever ToS has been agreed to.


    Personally, I do consider digitial purchases to be more akin to temporary entertainment, like going to the cinema, or going out boozing. You pay for the memories you gain, and the enjoyment you get whilst your purchase is still valid. Yes, there's an expectation of a decent length of time but keeping them forever? Well you can't take it with you...

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    That's not even the most blatant issue Lucio, items bought through micro-transactions in F2P are commonly patched/balanced after the initial launch sale, leading to an item that performs well below what was sold.

    League of legends for example launches new playable characters every so on, these are available through real money or in-game gold (grind). Needless to say some are often overpowered (until they get toned down later on) driving the need to always have the latest "hero" as soon as possible. Same could be said for a FPS I played previously, patches would steadily increase recoil/decrease damage in older weapons to ensure new ones would always provide a competitive edge.

    Personally I don't care, I simply wont go anywhere near F2Ps nowadays, either because the P2W model eventually creeps in or simply because grinding is so often an essential mechanic of these games. To me grinding amounts only to time spent/wasted on repetitive tasks and it equates by no measure to a sense of achievement or fun, so quite the opposite of a what game should be.

    Still in an area that caters mostly to young uninformed consumers there seems to be some questionable practices with little to no scrutiny.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferral View Post
    Unfortunately this happens, I hope that Valve shows their customers some support with this and maybe gives affected users a credit to their wallet as form of compensation.
    I agree with everything you said with the exception of this
    It shouldn't be Valve who loose out here
    The users shouldn't be out of pocket but Valve aren't in the wrong here, should be SE who should give something like a discount code or some steam cash into each of the users wallets
    It's a shame though.

    Always Online DRM is the scourge of the games industry and needs to be wiped off the face of the earth

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Makes me nervous for all the GfWL titles
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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    Looks like the forbes link was updated, making in this instance a bit of a non-issue:

    Update: It appears that contrary to what I first believed, the single-player portion of the game—Order of War without the “Challenge”—is still available on Steam, and only the multi-player content has been removed.

    That’s good, and changes some of the details in the above post. But my larger point still stands: Single-player games that have always-online DRM attached are inherently at the mercy of the servers’ longevity, having an internet connection to begin with, etc. That’s a problem that complicates the notion of digital ownership.

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    Re: News - Order of War: first game erased from all Steam user libraries

    by digital ownership you mean digital rental. If you read the t&cs you own nothing.

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