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Thread: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

  1. #17
    Bagnaj97
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by shaithis View Post
    This really goes to show over overpriced smartphones can be.
    The costs of casing/screen/battery/wifi/storage/software development/GPS/GSM etc do soon mount up. The RPi may have the same CPU and ram as a phone, but it's a far more basic device. If you want a better comparison to make high end phones look expensive, compare them to the Moto G or similar.

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    root Member DanceswithUnix's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by Bagnaj97 View Post
    The costs of casing/screen/battery/wifi/storage/software development/GPS/GSM etc do soon mount up. The RPi may have the same CPU and ram as a phone, but it's a far more basic device. If you want a better comparison to make high end phones look expensive, compare them to the Moto G or similar.
    I think the Moto E looks pretty good value compared to the Pi. £70 gets you a faster CPU, same amount of RAM, flash storage, battery, screen, radio connectivity and cameras. Not so easy to hack on though.

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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by DanceswithUnix View Post
    Is that just the NT Kernel though, I thought that Galileo didn't have video output?
    Pretty much, its just the core OS designed to be used remotely, IIRC its all telnet/SSH into a shell.

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    Senior Member watercooled's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    RS still seem to have some in stock for next day delivery if anyone's after one.

    Decided to grab one myself, I've been meaning to get another RasPi for a while. I sold the first one on here as it was mostly just sitting unused in its box and they were still hard to get hold of IIRC.

    Total price including VAT was £27.42 for me.

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    Seething Cauldron of Hatred TheAnimus's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by DanceswithUnix View Post
    Is that just the NT Kernel though, I thought that Galileo didn't have video output?
    Quote Originally Posted by BobF64 View Post
    Pretty much, its just the core OS designed to be used remotely, IIRC its all telnet/SSH into a shell.
    In a nutshell yes.

    Microsoft, from what I've read, are not going to be giving it away free as in "Windows with BING!", like they have on my excellent £70 tablet.

    It's going to be a version of their IoT offering, which actually is very easy to get started, I just dislike the dependency on azure, which whilst I run all my SaaS companies non-prod infrastructure on, I can tell you is not reliable enough for prod. Even a company that is burning thousands a day, I don't save money on our prod hardware by using azure...

    The thing is, their IoT offering is much easier for dev work, than any terminal type thing I've seen, so long as you've a machine running VS. The remote debugging and such features I've found utterly brilliant.
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    root Member DanceswithUnix's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by TheAnimus View Post
    Microsoft, from what I've read, are not going to be giving it away free as in "Windows with BING!", like they have on my excellent £70 tablet.
    That seems a shame, I think the draw of having a desktop environment on your little embedded system is part of the charm of the Pi. When people say they want Windows on a Pi, I am sure they are hoping to run whatever the modern equivalent of Visual Basic is for teaching novice programmers bad habits.

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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    I thought Windows10 was Intel-only, hence the desire to drop RT devices. If someone's going to say that Surface1/2 etc could run full-blown W10 but Microsoft "can't be bothered then I'm going to be miffed.

    Thought the whole point of RPi was it was cheap and easy. Slapping W10 on it, especially if it's going to not be in "embedded" mode sounds like a lot of hassle - although good news for virus writers or anti-virus software sellers.

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    Seething Cauldron of Hatred TheAnimus's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by DanceswithUnix View Post
    That seems a shame, I think the draw of having a desktop environment on your little embedded system is part of the charm of the Pi. When people say they want Windows on a Pi, I am sure they are hoping to run whatever the modern equivalent of Visual Basic is for teaching novice programmers bad habits.
    Actually it's more doing it remotely. Right now it's C++ only, but they are porting the universal apps stack over, apparently, it's cool to use JavaScript, even thou you don't have to... Kids these days!

    So you will have what is hands down the best IDE, with arguably the best universal language (C#) on a device, without having to resort to SSH/Telnet etc.

    It will be interesting to see if they evolve their offering into a 'headed' device. But right now, the HDMI port will not be used, based on the docs I've skimmed over.
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Nice. I was thinking of upgrading my Pi B 512Mb running raspbmc to get a better power output. Had been looking at more powerful alternatives, but this for the same cost (£29 inc vat) is a steal for the spec boost should run HD TV/Video nicely via Kodi (xbmc as was) with a much better response time on the menus.
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    As for the raspbian port, there already exists a debian port for armv7, so probably why it needs less work to get ready, probably not much work needed at all other than for cutting it right down to boost performance.
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    root Member DanceswithUnix's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by TheAnimus View Post
    Actually it's more doing it remotely.
    Exactly, but the Pi is supposed to be about filling a classroom full of dirt cheap tiny computers, not "and their expensive full PC cross development platform". Besides, if I really wanted to teach my daughter embedded programming then let's face it Linux utterly owns that market and seems the better choice.

    I don't get it, Microsoft just can't leave that hdmi port dark, even for them it just colossally misses the point.

    Javascript?? lol, yeah I should have guessed that one

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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by TheAnimus View Post
    Actually it's more doing it remotely. Right now it's C++ only, but they are porting the universal apps stack over, apparently, it's cool to use JavaScript, even thou you don't have to... Kids these days!
    Actually I'm going to disagree there, (says the guy with two teenagers). The most relevant language combo definitely isn't C++, it's HTML5 and CSS - and no I'm not claiming that this is necessarily a good place to start. Big plus point of the Pi - so I heard - was that it had these point-n-click app builders which Visual Studio definitely isn't.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheAnimus View Post
    So you will have what is hands down the best IDE, with arguably the best universal language (C#) on a device, without having to resort to SSH/Telnet etc.
    Start the queue here for the "Your recommended programming language sucks, instead you need to use..." flame war (Py on Pi in my case )

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  13. #29
    Seething Cauldron of Hatred TheAnimus's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by DanceswithUnix View Post
    Exactly, but the Pi is supposed to be about filling a classroom full of dirt cheap tiny computers, not "and their expensive full PC cross development platform". Besides, if I really wanted to teach my daughter embedded programming then let's face it Linux utterly owns that market and seems the better choice.

    I don't get it, Microsoft just can't leave that hdmi port dark, even for them it just colossally misses the point.

    Javascript?? lol, yeah I should have guessed that one
    I'd argue that by far the best embedded platform is PIC or Atmel. One of the reasons I rant against the Pi, is it's completely failed in its original goal of improving programming and understanding. The board is too hard to hack, you can't even add more RAM with any ease. For someone who remembers clocking his BBC B, that's sad.

    Also languages, Python is a good teaching language, but why does that need a computer? I've said it before, and I'll say it again, the Pi is not for teaching. At all. When I was at uni I was paid to teach software engineering to children aged 9-18, the Pi does not begin to help me do that.

    Draw Turtles, Flow Chart langauges and Lego Mindstorm are great, but they leave this chasam between structured procedural or functional languages and simplistic scripting.

    This is why I really like TouchDevelop for teaching. The way you use a concept keyboard to help people learn what they can or can not say or do is great, it allows for a diverse language, it compiles to HTML run anywhere.

    The fact is the Pi sucks as a computer, and being honest, how does it help its £30, you require a screen and a keyboard. You might as well have bought a £70 tablet. If you want kids to learn to toggle LEDs then lets use a really simple, easy to learn uC.

    Quote Originally Posted by crossy View Post
    Actually I'm going to disagree there, (says the guy with two teenagers). The most relevant language combo definitely isn't C++, it's HTML5 and CSS - and no I'm not claiming that this is necessarily a good place to start. Big plus point of the Pi - so I heard - was that it had these point-n-click app builders which Visual Studio definitely isn't.

    Start the queue here for the "Your recommended programming language sucks, instead you need to use..." flame war (Py on Pi in my case )
    Eh? teaching HTML and CSS is hard, because the languages are god awful clusterfornications of evil.

    Python is a nightmare because they broke it all in 3, so first timers get stuck when they google because the answer they are copying doesn't work. Python is however a great teaching language in many ways, but having taught whitespace sensitive languages before, I find them to require a lot of IDE tooling to help users really understand, blank being control is a hard concept. My point is, having a universal runtime, treating the device as a 'runs any language' device is actually remotely helpful.

    I hope we can see things like google's code blocks or TouchDevelop actually start to use the Pi now. Because frankly, the stuff I looked at was naff, didn't help at all, the hardware was naff, the software was not the best out there. All for a low price point!

    The point is that the IoT build supports pretty much any language, makes deploying as simple as changing the target from "Azure Instance" to "My little Pi". The tooling around that is a lot easier for making something flash an LED.
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Quote Originally Posted by TheAnimus View Post
    I'd argue that by far the best embedded platform is PIC or Atmel.
    Having worked on stuff like print mechanism controllers and battery chargers I have to say that in a modern networked age simple controllers are going to go the way of the serial ports that they communicated over. This is in the same way that for some years it has been expensive to buy a 7400 series logic gate chip, and cheaper to buy a PIC chip and program it to behave like a slightly slow 7400 series. Looking at the connected devices at home, the TVs, video recorders, wifi access points and video over IP cameras all seem to be Linux based. Well, apart from the Nintendo, no idea what that runs.

    I never bought an original Pi, I am with you on that one that it just didn't seem useful. I am hoping that this has a bit more grunt to it, if not then lots of people at work use old Pi boxes for media players and I'm sure I can sell it on to one of them. In the meantime, my first stop will be trying to get the kids hacking Minecraft Pi.

    http://www.raspberrypi.org/learning/...-pi/worksheet/

  15. #31
    Seething Cauldron of Hatred TheAnimus's Avatar
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    Have you tried your kids on something like google code or TouchDevelop ?
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    Re: Raspberry Pi 2 arrives with 6x the speed, Windows 10 compatibility

    I actually ordered one to start tinkering. A lot of the discussion here has gone over my head though. Anyone got a 'step 1' towards actually being productive with it they can recommend?

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