Microsoft responds to Windows 10 privacy concerns

[peterb]

No, not all of the privacy options are available to you at installation, but thanks for the snotty attitude nonetheless.

Your sarcastic douche tone aside, don't you know that not all users install their own OS? That some people buy PCs/Tabs/smartphones with preinstalled OS?

Don't you know that not all privacy issues are not resolved by switching off those in the installation? Of course you don't know that...you just pretend you know it all. Try googling other ways to disable privacy issues in windows 10.

Hi guys, while I appreciate the original comment was anything but helpful, please don't reply in kind!

[azrael-]

I'm sure there will still be a lot of tinfoil hat wearers who will swear this is more smoke and mirrors so that Microsoft can keep an eye on their activities....

You can count me among those.

[KeyboardDemon]

'Anonymised telemetry data' is doublespeak for 'doesn't contain your name'. That doesn't mean you can't be tracked down with the information the communication delivers and infers.

Enlighten me, lets assume that I was one of those users described in the article that had seen the benefit of getting my GPU driver issues resolved through the data that was used by the driver developers to identify and fix the problem (which I might be BTW - I don't know as nobody thanked me for my help). Let's also assume that the developers looked at the bit of data that my PC specifically collected and sent them to then work out who and where I am, what is it that worries you over that? Do we not already have privacy policies and laws to protect us from the misuse of this data?

[LSG501]

"You are in control with the ability to determine what information is collected.".... um no we're not, there is a one size fits all on/off type switch under vague headings. Not to mention some of it is scattered in individual apps rather than in a central control panel.

If we were in control there would be a 'power user' section that allowed us finer control of what is sent to MS. Some of us might be ok with offering up 'stability' info on drivers but the level of information possibly being gathered can be an issue for people with nda's (like me). Windows Pro is meant for small businesses and power users so they should give us the features we actually want/need.

I have the same issue with 'updates' that we can't turn off in that there is a lack of control for those of us who want or need it (I've had windows/driver updates screw up programs I use).

As to the advertising ID... um that along with your MS login is more than enough for them to track back to who is using what (well down to the pc at least), especially if you're on the becoming more common fixed IP web address. I understand they need a way to confirm the license on the OS but I couldn't give a monkey's about the advertisers after paying for the the OS (not all win 10 installs are free, new pc's need new os) and/or programs on it.

And the irony of 'giving feedback'.... you need to join the insiders program which basically gathers even more information lol

[Corky34]

Do we not already have privacy policies and laws to protect us from the misuse of this data?

Some countries do some don't, either way I'm not sure privacy policies and laws offer much in the way of protection when it comes to the online world, at least not from some organisations.

[DanceswithUnix]

Unless it is stored WITH the IP and/or AppStoreID and/or personal details, then its anonymous.

Of course, in the future they could turn on saving that additional data and then that could be linked to past datasets.....

But as I've been saying for a while, they will never do this as long as they have enterprise customers.

If say Amazon find that Microsoft user a0f58ebd-00f2-4ef1-bb5e-d085908d24e5 visited the page about spronglewidgets at time 1:37.064 pm and they know that Mr Frederick Bloggs bought a spronglewidget after visiting that page at that time from their purchase history, then they know the identity of that user ID. Furthermore, that link only has to be made once, and all activities not only after but before that link is made are now public.

I have stuff delivered from Amazon to both home and work addresses. If someone can track my anonymised location data from my phone and see it moving between those two addresses, then they know that the phone belongs to me.

I am only singling out Amazon here as I know they have the raw data easily at hand to do it, but I'm sure others can as well.

To people with the storage and cloud compute at hand to remember lots of history and crunch the data, it isn't really possible to anonymise data.

[shaithis]

If say Amazon find that Microsoft user a0f58ebd-00f2-4ef1-bb5e-d085908d24e5 visited the page to about spronglewidgets at time 1:37.064 pm and they know that Mr Frederick Bloggs bought a spronglewidget after visiting that page at that time from their purchase history, then they know the identity of that user ID. Furthermore, that link only has to be made once, and all activities not only after but before that link is made are now public.

In that example, the data has been tied together....you have the ID and the name and address. So not anonymous any more.

Why would amazon have your Windows ID?

[DanceswithUnix]

In that example, the data has been tied together....you have the ID and the name and address. So not anonymous any more.

Why would amazon have your Windows ID?

They shouldn't but these things have a habit of leaking out.

[iranu]

Look up "traffic analysis" with regard to code breaking. Metadata is as important as actual data and you can build up an enormously accurate picture of an organisation or person using this technique without actually having to decipher any messages or read someone's data.

Why don't MS simply give me the option to turn off all telemetry and data collection? Just give me one button to press that says stop everything going to MS. They won't because this is their new business model. Give the OS out for free while using the data the OS collects for revenue generation. My PC isn't personal any more with Win 10. I can't stop the OS slurping data and I can't stop updates. Effectively I've lost control if I install Win 10.

I'm happy to pay for an OS that leaves me in control. MS haven't addressed anything with regard to privacy as far as I'm concerned.

[DanceswithUnix]

Look up "traffic analysis" with regard to code breaking. Metadata is as important as actual data and you can build up an enormously accurate picture of an organisation or person using this technique without actually having to decipher any messages or read someone's data.

Why don't MS simply give me the option to turn off all telemetry and data collection? Just give me one button to press that says stop everything going to MS. They won't because this is their new business model. Give the OS out for free while using the data the OS collects for revenue generation. My PC isn't personal any more with Win 10. I can't stop the OS slurping data and I can't stop updates. Effectively I've lost control if I install Win 10.

I'm happy to pay for an OS that leaves me in control. MS haven't addressed anything with regard to privacy as far as I'm concerned.

I don't think an option matters. For some people a big switch marked "Stop all data collection" will get a "yeah right, like I would trust that from Microsoft".

[enemys]

Your sarcastic douche tone aside, don't you know that not all users install their own OS? That some people buy PCs/Tabs/smartphones with preinstalled OS?

Don't you know that not all privacy issues are not resolved by switching off those in the installation? Of course you don't know that...you just pretend you know it all. Try googling other ways to disable privacy issues in windows 10.

Yeah, I forgot about devices shipped with W10, point taken. I should have written "or spend 1 minute in privacy settings and turn all those switches off". I am aware, that not every kind of information gathering in W10 can be switched off (diagnostic data sending cannot be completely turned off), but going crazy with "muh privacy!" over basic telemetry seems like an overreaction to me. And these switches in Windows 10->Settings->Privacy are just about the only thing that most of people brag about. Some more suspicious things (e.g. weird, unknown connections opened by system apps and services) go unnoticed and the Internet doesn't go crazy about Facebook, Google or Apple, which do the same exact thing, or worse. So don't be surprised, that I'm a bit sarcastic to all these privacy concerns that emerged with W10, because they usually sound more like panic, than well-thought considerations.

[Saracen]

....

MS haven't addressed anything with regard to privacy as far as I'm concerned.

Me neither. That blog post looks more like a simple PR exercise than actually listening, though as it's MS, that's not exactly a shock.

Mind you, privacy isn't my only reason for rejecting Win10. It's sufficient reason, but there's others, like mandatory updates.

Unless MS change direction significantly, and I'm not holding my breath, W10 is a non-starter for me. I doubt that MS will do anything to change that, and giving it away "free" sure won't. Nor would paying me, like supermarkets do for your transaction data, and I won't do that, either.

[GuidoLS]

Look up "traffic analysis" with regard to code breaking. Metadata is as important as actual data and you can build up an enormously accurate picture of an organisation or person using this technique without actually having to decipher any messages or read someone's data.

Why don't MS simply give me the option to turn off all telemetry and data collection? Just give me one button to press that says stop everything going to MS. They won't because this is their new business model. Give the OS out for free while using the data the OS collects for revenue generation. My PC isn't personal any more with Win 10. I can't stop the OS slurping data and I can't stop updates. Effectively I've lost control if I install Win 10.

I'm happy to pay for an OS that leaves me in control. MS haven't addressed anything with regard to privacy as far as I'm concerned.

Your one stop solution for EVERY OS out there, in a single button? You don't need a software solution. It's called the power button... If that's too draconian, there's always the pinching gesture - the one that is used both for removing the ethernet cable AND/OR the USB dongle that connects to the router. Or turn off the router...

Then there's always that one virtual button that everyone seems to ignore, and then goes on to blame the vendor when things aren't the way they want them to be - the decline button... too many are willing to just mash that accept button without having any real clue as to what they're accepting. Whose fault is that? If anyone has the nerve to say it's anyone but the face in the mirror, they're delusional and have no concept of how the world works. None of us, and I do mean none of us, were ever coerced into installing anything on our computers, let alone Windows10.

I'm outright disgusted with some of the things in Windows 10. I'm disgusted enough that it's cost me a relatively good chunk of change - this was to be my advance my hobby job and buy a new, top of the line GPU set of installs. I let down more than a few clients, and lost more than a few others, because I wouldn't install 10 on their systems without making them jump through a bunch of hoops they didn't want to bother with. As much as I would like to blame MS, it's not them that made me not install it, but my conscience.

By the same token, it's also not the fault of MS that I actually installed, and keep one machine active, with Windows 10. I read the fine text, and know what I can and can't block, and how to block it. This is 2015. We're now the product. I suggest that everyone learns to read the fine print, and how to protect themselves. There's no such thing as innocence anymore, and we allowed that to happen. There's no excuse for naivety any more, and we created that environment. And there's no going back. The genie is out of the bottle, and that SOB is way too fat to ever be shoved back in again.

[Chuzz]

If you have any privacy concerns with windows 10 and this tool can block everything, go here http://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10 I did de install Cortana manually although did a backup in case it broke windows which it did not

[DanceswithUnix]

I have seen a blacklist of IP addresses to block if you want to avoid your PC contacting MS.

Having looked on "iptraf" on my home server (a Linux box) Win10 does seem quite, erm, chatty. I could apply that list on my linux server to filter my whole network, I presume if you are running something like OpenWRT on your router you can do the same.

[Tabbykatze]

Nuking Win 10 phone home from orbit:

https://www.astaro.org/gateway-produ...10-spying.html

https://www.astaro.org/gateway-produ...addresses.html