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Thread: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by CK_1985 View Post
    Although it sounds very useful, there are possible issues around the government releasing address-specific connectivity data. If you're trying to sell your house and the government suddenly tells everyone it has rubbish mobile signal and slow broadband, and as a result the market value goes down by a few grand, you're going to be mighty annoyed!
    One of the issue with mobile signal is that it is not fixed. We've just got through a mast upgrade from 2G (yes!) to 3g and the signal strength is much much worse.

    Ironically the only way to guarentee quality mobile signal is to live in a rough area!

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by abaxas View Post
    So come on.... what do people 'need' fast internet for.....
    Work, backups and legitimate downloads for starters.......
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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    We should be look at satalite

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Mobile signal is still patchy at best, my commute to work sees me losing my data & calls for 65% of the time i'm travelling. And that's on the M4 Corridor route into london!!!

    Practically everything needs internet these days like:
    -Paperless billing
    -Service and support
    -Digital content
    -Government spying
    -Purchase of goods - Bricks and Mortar are still useful but with the vastness and cheapness of click to buy stores, purchasing something at a decent low price is damn near hard to find in store these days.
    -Communication - Email is now a primary method of contact and with the standardisation of digital signing of documents these are just as good as your scrawl on a piece of paper
    -News - The average consumer of news is now easily done through your phone/tablet/PC. I very rarely see people pick up the Metro on the train anymore and I actually saw someone sat next to me reading the same Metro on their Galaxy Note as the one on the seat opposite the other day
    -Fighting for your right to party - Vote for change, change.org, contacting your MP for suggestions of change are done mostly through email/web forms now

    And with the size of the data we upload/download increasing over time this necessitates having ADSL2. Even being on 2.3mbps can be a slog.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by abaxas View Post
    So come on.... what do people 'need' fast internet for.....

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by Corky34 View Post
    I thought the reasons for VM not rolling out in more places was due to councils not granting permission, not wanting their roads dug up and the accompanying hassle involved with laying what they probably see as something that's already there in the form of BT cables, then again i could be talking rubbish as IDK about the inter workings of VM or councils.
    Could well be the visible causes, digging up roads is cheaper and probably quicker than other ways of installing things. That said, other ways might just not be viable, like via sewers or other existing ducts.

    Heck, even BT sometimes have trouble installing fibre cabinets due to "locals" objecting to the "eye sore" they cause and sometimes a lack of space on the pavement.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
    No point trying to insult yourself.

    If you dont understand why, don't assume someone is trolling you, or you are just trolling yourslef.

    Almost no-one needs fast internet. End of argument.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by abaxas View Post
    No point trying to insult yourself.

    If you dont understand why, don't assume someone is trolling you, or you are just trolling yourslef.

    Almost no-one needs fast internet. End of argument.
    I work in an audit department and our software is constantly back up our work to our works server whilst we are off site. We need reasonable internet to ensure this works. If we return one day and somebody's laptop has died overnight then any work that hasn't been backed up needs to be re-performed. We are extremely time pressured on site. We normally only get 5 days as a team on site and we then move onto another job the next week. Can you see that our work being backed-up over the internet, is necessary?

    Similarly, I know the tax department use a piece of software that has a centralised database of all our personal tax clients. They remote desktop into office to use this whilst away/working from home/in a blind panic in the last week of January. Once again, a decent internet connection is required for these things. Not preferable, required.

    Those are just reasons specific to my situation in my working life. Lots of people depend on good internet infrastructure.
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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by abaxas View Post
    No point trying to insult yourself.

    If you dont understand why, don't assume someone is trolling you, or you are just trolling yourslef.

    Almost no-one needs fast internet. End of argument.
    Ah yes, the old "you called me a troll therefore you are a troll" argument... good one.

    The amount of reasons why the option of 'fast' internet should be a legal right are numerous, and people have posted them. You can choose to ignore them with claim that they are not good enough, but all that indicates is a difference of personal opinion and requirement. The argument may have ended for you but for most people there is no argument to be had.
    For most people the internet is seen much like another typical common utility and as such a certain level of service should be expected and enforced by regulation. Aside from the fair statement that the governments priorities are wrong, there really isnt anything to complain about with this legislation.... assuming they actually go through with it and meet their goals for once.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by abaxas View Post
    Almost no-one needs fast internet. End of argument.
    Bear in mind that the definition of Fast Internet is 10Mbps. That sort of speed makes remote login to corporate portals and using Netflix a sensible speed and quality. You may have got it confused with all the 150Mbps Superfast stuff that gets plugged so much.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by shaithis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by abaxas View Post
    So come on.... what do people 'need' fast internet for.....
    Work, backups and legitimate downloads for starters.......
    Government is trying to encourage folks to "think green" - and teleworking is a fine way to eliminate the CO2 produced by the commute. They were also bleating on about "happiness" and not being stuck in a traffic jam in behind "Mater" in her Chelsea Tractor and front of some tailgating wide boy rep in a BMW/Audi is a fine way to improve happiness by decreasing stress.

    There's also training, (big deal with me at the moment because my useless soon-to-be-ex employer doesn't believe in it, unless it's happy-clappy corporate ....). Try watching a video course on C#, Chef, Puppet or Ruby on a <10Mb/s link and it's really, really unpleasant. Plus - as shaithis says - there's legitimate downloads - e.g. a couple of gig for a Linux distro (to practice some of the new-found skills on?)

    I'll also echo tabbykatze's list - I'm shocked by the number of sites that you need to use which have HTML5/Flash anims, ads, etc. So you deploy your favourite "detech'ing" add ons (AdBlockPlus, NoScript, etc) and promptly find that the website is rendered either barely usable or totally unusable.

    On the other hand, I do kind of wonder about the common sense shown in pushing this when Osbourne is trying to remove heat from homes, and food from the tables of the poorest. Of course, maybe this is another diversion for the techno-literate chattering classes? Personally I think a better target (if we're wasting time on "tech") would be 99% 3G coverage for the UK, (and yes I know the Mobile Operators Association claims we're already at 99.3% - but I'm doubtful), or better still 100% 4G coverage - then we don't need fast broadband.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Typical PPE Oxford graduate politician spouting platitudes to gain votes without understanding the consequences of what he proposes. You can currently get broadband upto a certain speed for around the line rental price, which is roughly £17 per month (and a bit less with offers and paying the yearly cost upfront). There will be some people who will be getting a speed of 10mb or over, but most won't. I'm one of them, I get 7mb. In order for me to get a higher speed I need to pay more money.

    Therefore your right to get 10mb will simply cost you more. A lot more. Instead of paying £15 a month for 7mb, you'll fully enjoy your new right to a minimum speed of 10mb by paying £30 a month, because areas with lots of people, where a roll out to the higher speed is cost effective, will have to pay above and beyond in order to subsidise those in rural areas where the cost is more per paying customer for installing the infrastructure.

    This will hit the poorest hardest and they are the very people who need cheap broadband even if it's "only" 6mb.
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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    The basis of the proposal is to extend the "universal obligation" of BT (and only BT) to provide a relephone line on demand to include fast broadband, effectively compelling BT to provide broadband wherever you reside.

    Obviously more remote areas will cost more to provision than densely populated areas (one reason why VM and Sky concentrate on densely populated areas) so those costs will essentially be cross subsidised by all other customers. As that isn't required by VM and Sky, their prices can be lower.

    Again, cross subsidy isn't new, it applies to phone line installation costs, which are capped, and Royal Mail charge the same to deliver a letter, whether it is to the house next door, or one several hundred miles away.
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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by spacein_vader View Post
    Bear in mind that the definition of Fast Internet is 10Mbps. That sort of speed makes remote login to corporate portals and using Netflix a sensible speed and quality. You may have got it confused with all the 150Mbps Superfast stuff that gets plugged so much.
    We all know (or at least should know) that most VPN/corporate access required a higher upload speed than we get with most symetrical connections.

    Quote Originally Posted by spacein_vader View Post
    I work in an audit department and our software is constantly back up our work to our works server whilst we are off site. We need reasonable internet to ensure this works. If we return one day and somebody's laptop has died overnight then any work that hasn't been backed up needs to be re-performed. We are extremely time pressured on site. We normally only get 5 days as a team on site and we then move onto another job the next week. Can you see that our work being backed-up over the internet, is necessary?

    Similarly, I know the tax department use a piece of software that has a centralised database of all our personal tax clients. They remote desktop into office to use this whilst away/working from home/in a blind panic in the last week of January. Once again, a decent internet connection is required for these things. Not preferable, required.
    In terms of backup, this team must be producing 10s of gigabytes of data a day. Also, we we already know, the actual cost of any SLA on your broadband is huge. Do not confuse something being fast, with being available. If you have a standard residential or business broadband there is no SLA. If something is busines critical, you should be paying for the correct product.

    Remote desktop software is much a function of latency than overall speed. Speed != latency. Hence why lots of citrix installations live on the end of 'slow' but reliable connections.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by CK_1985 View Post
    Although it sounds very useful, there are possible issues around the government releasing address-specific connectivity data. If you're trying to sell your house and the government suddenly tells everyone it has rubbish mobile signal and slow broadband, and as a result the market value goes down by a few grand, you're going to be mighty annoyed!
    I looked up my house before I moved a few years ago on Sam Knows Broadband. It told me what ADSL speed I could expect, that VDSL was available, where the exchange is located, all sorts of stuff. I would have thought by now it would be part of the survey.

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    Re: Cameron pledges to make fast broadband a legal right for all

    Quote Originally Posted by abaxas View Post
    We all know (or at least should know) that most VPN/corporate access required a higher upload speed than we get with most symetrical connections.
    So we've moved from 'nobody needs Fast Broadband' to 'Fast Broadband isn't fast enough'?

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