Obama or McCain?

[spiral out]

I think Obama will win and he will prove to be another war monger. They have to go in to Iran at some point and time is running out for dopey bush.

[directhex]

Originally Posted by spiral out

They have to go in to Iran at some point

why?

[2Cold Scorpio]

Considering Obama's solution to all our problems is raise taxes, knows nothing about foreign diplomacy or economics, and is a compulsive liar about his past, I'm going for McCain...someone who actually knows what they're doing.

Obama may have some flowery speeches, but there's no substance to them. Seriously, considering the extreme downturns in our economy since the Dems took back control of the house (sharply rising gas prices, a failing home market, etc. that wasn't anywhere as serious a problem as they were two years ago), so we really need the least experienced one of the lot running the country? I don't think so.

[Agent]

Originally Posted by 2Cold Scorpio

I'm going for McCain...someone who actually knows what they're doing.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEtZlR3zp4c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06hR2EGpl4o&NR=1

Have you totally missed all the video evidence online that prove that this guy is a compulsive liar that can't get one thing straight from one day to the next?

[2Cold Scorpio]

I counter with have you actually listened to Obama talk and go check for the facts? Obama's pile of B.S. seems to be a lot taller...

But lets get away from all that and look at a few key issues:

If the economy is in a recession and the average person has a harder time paying their bills, why on earth would you raise taxes? To fund more unneeded social programs that only benefit a fraction of the population? Frankly, I'm tired of seeing my money go out the door to support folks who are too lazy to work and pay their own way. Longterm welfare needs to be abolished with the exception of only paying those who are truly unable to work (i.e. mentally or physically disabled people, those suffering from severe medical conditions that prevent work, and the like). I don't mind helping them. I *do* mind my money going to those who are too lazy to get off the couch and find work or are too busy popping out kid after kid rather than actually taking care of them. I do support short-term help because people do fall on hard times from time to time. But long-term (as in, say, more than six months)...no way. With the exception mentioned above, no more. Work or starve. The rest of us have to work; they should too unless they truly can't.

I know that sounds harsh, but I'm tired of helping every one who doesn't even try helping themselves...particularly when I myself live from paycheck to paycheck.

And guess what we can do with all this money saved from paying for welfare...either let people keep it, or use it to fix Social Security; I'd for it to still be around in 40 years when its time for me to collect. At least SS is a lot more worthy cause.

That's just one of a number of things I can pick apart. ^_^ The fact is Obama knows nothing about running a country. He doesn't have the experience, nor does he have the needed knowledge of economics, foreign policy, and the like. For Pete's sake, he barely has more political experience than Hillary, and she did little more than ride Bill's coat-tails for the past 20+ years. And she's spent a good chunk of her tenure of Senator traveling around the world promoting her book or running for President rather than actually doing her job serving the people of New York. That's akin to the head of a major company going fishing during a worker's strike...it makes no sense. But who am I to judge...I'm just an old Texas boy who actually works for a living and still cares about his country... ^_^

[Agent]

Originally Posted by 2Cold Scorpio

I counter with have you actually listened to Obama talk and go check for the facts? Obama's pile of B.S. seems to be a lot taller...

Ahhh to check the "facts" that you agree with?

I'm an Englishman, so feel free to provide some links to backup what you're saying about "Obama's pile of B.S" and I'll happily have a look, because of yet the majority of things I've seen around the web are fairly critical about McCain as opposed to Obama.

I'm not 'pro' either of them - I am of the firm belief that your political system is as bad as our own, if not worse.

[TeePee]

In the American mind, any kind of welfare or social support is about enabling the lazy to sit on the counch and not have to work, at the expense of the hardworking. I hope everyone is against that, (I still think bringing back the workhouse is a good idea!) but you should realise that some 'welfare' such as governemtally assured healthcare, is simply part of a civilised society.

The problem is that the US government miss-manages the money they get on an epic scale. We pay about the same proportion of our income in taxes, but look at all the 'Welfare' we get in Britain compared to the US.

Irregardless, this election will be won, not on policy, but on race. Something else the USA does badly.

[2Cold Scorpio]

Originally Posted by Agent

...I am of the firm belief that your political system is as bad as our own, if not worse.

My friend, these days I'd be tempted agree, to be honest.

For the rest...the hard part is finding what *is* the truth buried under all the propaganda on each side (and I say that about both candidates, though I admit to knowing a lot more about McCain). I do believe Obama's popularity is more due to his race and his speechwriters and not on any real merit of the man. In addition to that, the average Joe tends to believe what they're told, and the media is predominantly liberal, so add two and two and you see where this is going.

Even if I completely ignore character and focus solely on his proposals...I'd have to call most of them the result of an ignorant, inexperienced man as most make no sense when looking at the current state of the country. TeePee is right...our elected officials like to just urinate our money away...however, at least the Conservatives take less of it and don't pour it all into useless social programs that only help a fraction of the population at the expense of the majority. Instead of giving all that money to lazy slobs who'll just buy a bottle of whiskey (if not something more illicit), put it back into the backbone of the country: businesses. This generates jobs, which enables production to rise, which enables more people to make money, which enables them to have money to spend, thus stimulating the economy rather than slowing it down. You see, I do support big business (and small business even more) because they're what really make the country strong and productive...and more self-sufficient. As I said, scale back the social programs to just the true essentials, and put that money into the economy and Social Security (when you've worked 40+ years, I say you've earned the right to take it easy the rest of your life unless you wish to keep working).

And use the remaining cash to strengthen the military. Maybe if we can keep it from getting into the sorry shape it became during the Clinton administration, hostile countries and terrorist organizations may be more hesitant to start ...well, you know.

Electing Obama at this point would be akin to a major corporation putting a newly-hired middle-manager who's only been at the job for a week and is fresh out of college...and making him the CEO. Yeah, he's *that* inexperienced, folks. The election is a no-brainer, really. The fact a lot of people don't get that really frightens me.

Say, Agent, how's the weather there in November? If things go sour in November, I may be relocating. I'm of Irish-Scottish descent anyways...it'd give me another good reason to visit my ancestral lands.

[360bhp]

Doesn't matter who wins, same bunch of people anyway!

If JFK didn't get killed, we could have been living in such a peaceful place!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WSGwnz7XpY

[M0nkeyb0Y]

Anyone hear McCain talk about the subprime crisis? I heard a speech and from the way he was talking and stop/starting I'd be suprised if he knew what a mortgage is.

People who complain about B.O's lack of experience should look at the experience of the previous two presidents, both of whom have been held up by an army of advisors; as will the next president.

[2Cold Scorpio]

Bah, I was hoping Mitt Romney would've gotten the nomination, but this wasn't the case. However, I do hope to see a McCain/Romney pairing...it would be quite a good pairing: McCain has the experience and knows foreign policy better than anyone else that ran this year. Romney knows economics and has good ideas about other domestic issues.

I don't see this happening, but it would be nice if it did. ^_^

[Steffani]

Originally Posted by 2Cold Scorpio

Bah, I was hoping Mitt Romney would've gotten the nomination, but this wasn't the case. However, I do hope to see a McCain/Romney pairing...it would be quite a good pairing: McCain has the experience and knows foreign policy better than anyone else that ran this year. Romney knows economics and has good ideas about other domestic issues.

I don't see this happening, but it would be nice if it did. ^_^

I completely agree.

[anomolyrocks]

Obama although i live in the UK it is nice to comment on the events across the pond. I have to say though i did like the viral made for the us elections which was on the bbc news website, v funny. In my opinion America needs "change" which will happen under Obama - according to the viral!!!!!!!!!!!!

[2Cold Scorpio]

Originally Posted by anomolyrocks

Obama although i live in the UK it is nice to comment on the events across the pond. I have to say though i did like the viral made for the us elections which was on the bbc news website, v funny. In my opinion America needs "change" which will happen under Obama - according to the viral!!!!!!!!!!!!

We've had change since '06 when the Democrats regained control of Congress...and none of it has been good. You're right, there would be change under Obama...the question is would it actually be good change or more of the same we've seen the last two years? My money's on the latter.

We do need change...and not the kind the Dems have been giving us.

[directhex]

100 more years!

[2Cold Scorpio]

Originally Posted by directhex

100 more years!

I wouldn't be surprised, and I'm not even completely sure what you're referring to! (yeah, I'm a bit too cynical for my age...lol ).