Do you know the BIGGEST problem facing training modern Soldiers?

[Zak33]

Apparently, according to an article I heard (twice now) on Radio 4....the biggest problem facing the training of modern soldiers...

is getting them to kill people!

Because of the "style" of our modern ethical realtionship with each other on this planet, and our virtually inbred ability to see two sides to most everything....plus a mammoth political correctness that we live with everyday.....the average soldier will not shoot to kill.

Until.....eventually.....his best buddy gets his legs blown off, and his other buddy has a hole in his stomach, the size of a basket ball , then under intense fire, with bullets rococheting everywhere and a sheer terror and despair setting in, the reality of actually dying and realisng the bad guys mean to murder them...

..... we get soldiers capable of protecting their country and killing people when fired upon.

So.....if you guys see a report on telly about our soldiers taking it out on the bad guys.....remember.....maybe, just maybe, their best friend is dead, or worse, captured and being tortured....

maybe.....they're only human too.

[klarrix]

I think the worst thing is that they are now actually taught in most areas of the military to torture people exactly like we've been seeing recently in the papers (according to today's Guardian anyway)

[Zak33]

and maybe...just maybe....its part of war

cos lets face it......they wont be letting OUR captured soldiers eat tea on the lawn

[blockers]

There was a program about this on telle a few weeks ago. "The truth about killing" or something...made for pretty interesting watching.

[turkster]

That is actually slightly comforting Zak. It shows that maybe humans dont neccessarily take too kindly to killing each other. Although the state of the world today would seem to imply otherwise.

Maybe society and governments are the cause for a lot of the strife in the world today rather than human nature.

As for the idea that soldiers killbetter when a few of their friends have been killed, that is only natural. IT also the reason why wars often get so far out of hand.

[G4Z]

well, fair point really, but I think I have to point somthing out here. these people they are interrogating are not soilders, some of them may be involved in the milita activity, but I think it would be a fair bet so say that there are a fair few iraqis being interrogated in this way who have done nothing wrong. As far as I can see the geneva convention is pretty clear on this, interrogation is ok, torture is not. do these photos show interrogation? I dont think so really. I also dont think they quite show torture either, I would say its mostly bullying and humiliation. And to be honest, that is bad enough, it shows us to be the arrogant, heavy handed and mismanaged country that we seem to have become over the last couple of years.

[shiato storm]

and even on the news last night they were said to have tortured children about 12yrs old...so not exactly soldiers then are they. I think the US has clearly over stepped the mark on this and we should just tell them to stop what they're doing and let us do the rest of the work that needs to be done out there. one of the main reasins they're staying is because of the oil and american contracters out there ... a reatehr devious yet clever way of getting loads of moeny back into the US. despicable people. struggle to comprehend why we are so close to them (rather bush+blair)...

[Tomo]

On My God! Are you lot serious?

"I think the worst thing is that they are now actually taught in most areas of the military to torture people exactly like we've been seeing recently in the papers (according to today's Guardian anyway)"

What a load of crap. Are any of you in the military? I doubt it and if you are where have you been trained?

We have one of the most professional armed forces in the world. end of story.

As with any area of society there may be individuals who are sadistic and evil but they are the exception, and to believe that we are trained to do this shows a complete lack of understanding about our forces. If an individual was found to be torturing a prisoner, and in this case I dont believe they did but that is only my opinion, they would be severely punished for the offence and would face criminal charges.

I am sick and tired of muesli eating do gooders giving our armed forces a bashing. They do a difficult job and although they may not agree with the reasons they are doing that job for they still do it out of a sense of loyalty for their comrades and their country. Some of you should try doing something worthwhile instead of sitting on your arses and complaining about what others do.

[Zak33]

Originally Posted by Tomo

On My God! Are you lot serious?

I am sick and tired of muesli eating do gooders giving our armed forces a bashing. They do a difficult job

Agreed....100%

Its not a difficult job guys....its a nightmare.

I'll give you an example....I get stressed at work. Things go wrong I chuck my toys outta my pram.....I need to get stuff done.

No one is being shot at.....at no point am I in peril of my life.

I get paid more than most soldiers......go figure.

Crap job....it takes a certain someone to be able to do it.....and that bloke aint me. But UTMOST respect to them all......there's bound to a be a few bad apples....

but lets face it....Saddam was the WORST bad apple...and he was in charge

[Knoxville]

I think war is the only situation where 2 wrongs can make a right tbh, if we capture someone and torture him because he knows something an eventually he talks giving us information that saves thousands imo we were right and always will be right to do it. To torture people for fun or because they're the enemy is cruel but people willing to kill are going to have a different mental outlook on things compared to us who like zak said in his post have a "virtually inbred ability to see two sides to most everything....plus a mammoth political correctness that we live with everyday".

These are people that you can call sick and strange all you like but they're people we need in a war, not someone who got drafted in and won't do anything but shoot people in the arm. If someone started firing an ak47 at me i know where i'd be aiming and it wouldn't be anywhere near his arm....

[Zak33]

Originally Posted by Knoxville

These are people that you can call sick and strange all you like but they're people we need in a war, not someone who got drafted in and won't do anything but shoot people in the arm. If someone started firing an ak47 at me i know where i'd be aiming and it wouldn't be anywhere near his arm....

thank you

without them.....England would be GERMAN now...

[blockers]

Just noticed in the TV guide....on Channel 4, 1:20am tonight (well technically tomorrow) is "The truth about killing" its a repeat.

Set the videos if you havent seen it, was pretty interesting last time - and revelent to this topic...

[turkster]

Originally Posted by Zak33

without them.....England would be GERMAN now...

Well it sure as hell wouldnt be Iraqi

[megah0]

Did anyone by anychance record this?

[G4Z]

I watched it last night, it was very relevant to this and very interesting. And I am not bashing the armed forces, I was in the TA for 4 years (laugh if you want tomo, I know you will. all the regulars were the same) Im not saying that makes me an authority on the subject (far from it) but I think I have some understanding of things in the army. And Im sorry if you think im bashing our armed forces or whatever, but what those pictures show is not interrogation or torture, its bulling and humiliation, and if you think its ok for us to go invade a country and then do this to the population I presume you think its ok that when our citizens are detained abroad they should also be treated in this way.

[Blub2k]

Originally Posted by Zak33

thank you

without them.....England would be GERMAN now...

YOU mean instead of just having a German royal family and being called after the Angels,them being Northern Germans?