Vertex 3 or 4

[TomWilson]

Vertex 4 128GB or 2x 60Gb vertex 3s in RAID 0?

Wondering which people thought would be best, as they are similar prices.

[Noxvayl]

For speed and redundancy the RAID 0 option with Vertex 3's would be best, however you won't be able to support TRIM with that and I suspect over time the speed will eventually come down to the same level as a single drive.

Because I have a fair amount of applications and like my Games on the SSD I'd choose the 128Gb Vertex 4.

[Agent]

For speed and redundancy the RAID 0 option with Vertex 3's would be best

RAID 0 offers no redundancy.

I'd also avoid Sandforce based drives due to the BSOD issues. AnAnd has this to say on them:

As luck would have it, our own Brian Klug happened to come across an unexpected crash with his 240GB non-Intel SF-2281 based SSD two weeks ago when he migrated it to another machine. The crash was an F4 BSOD, similar in nature to the infamous BSOD issue from last year. While two of the systems we reproduced the BSOD bug on were cured by last year's firmware update, Brian's system (an X58/Core i7 build) was BSODing regularly playing Battlefield 3. Games end up being a great way to trigger the SF-2281 BSOD issue as they frequently switch between periods of idle and load, which does a good job of stressing the power state logic in SandForce's firmware. I immediately sent Brian an Intel SSD 520 to see if the BSOD remained on Intel's drive. Switching to Cherryville caused Brian's BSODs to go away. Indeed most end user reports of SF-2281 BSODs went away with the fixed firmware, but we've still heard of isolated issues that remain unresolved. Whatever Intel has done with the 520's firmware seems to have fixed problems that still remain in the general SF-2281 firmware.

This is actually a dangerous precedent as it means one of two things. The first possibility is that SandForce has been made aware of flaws in its current firmware and chooses against (or is legally prevented from) disclosing it to its partners. The second possibility, and arguably even worse for SandForce, is that Intel was able to identify and fix a bug in the SF-2281 firmware without SandForce knowing it existed or was addressed. I suspect it's the former but as no one is willing to go on the record about the Intel/SandForce agreement I can't be certain.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5508/i...y-to-sandforce

I'd just like to point this out and and stress that there has not been a OCZ firmware update since this article was published (2.15, Oct 2011 vs June 2012 of the article) The bug that AnAnd were able to produce with the drive BSODing in that case isn't fixed.

How much is your data worth?

however you won't be able to support TRIM with that and I suspect over time the speed will eventually come down to the same level as a single drive.

Sandforce drives suffer badly when they are filled with the wrong data. So badly in fact that TRIM does nothing (yes, you read that right). Due to the way Sandforce drives work, it's not a simple case of enabling TRIM and all is well with them
SF do have their own internal garbage collection, which as I understand it, does it's own thing independent of TRIM anyway. You're still knackered if you fill them wrong though!

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5508/i...to-sandforce/7

[Noxvayl]

@ Agent

Interesting. My SandForce Vertex 2 has had zero problems and has worked well for the last 2 years. Perhaps the newer controller isn't as good.

[BerZerk]

@ Agent

Interesting. My SandForce Vertex 2 has had zero problems and has worked well for the last 2 years. Perhaps the newer controller isn't as good.

+1

Work for years, no problem...But going to re-install Windows soon.

[Butuz]

Had to flash my vertex 3's as they kept locking up randomly. The flash seems to have fixed it.

I still wouldnt buy another OCZ out of principle - they were willing to release thousands of HDDs to the mass market which has a showstopping bug. Their attitude? "Meh wait for us to do a flash update and then you can stop moaning"

Butuz

[Agent]

I mean this is the most constructive way guys, but HEXUS is getting terrible for this: Someone posts a major underlying issue with something, with links backing this up and thousands (literally) of results with a simple Google search, then people start to post "but mine works fine".

I'm glad it does, I wouldn't wish faulty hardware on anyone - certainly not something with data on, but common guys, it's hardly a reliable sample size. Visit the OCZ forums if you want to see how many people this has and still does cause issues for. Data loss is a serious issue and not something we should underplay.

I had to replace a lab with 40 of the sodding things . Believe me, messing about with data on such a scale is no fun.

To put 2 of the Vertex 3's in RAID 0, you'd have to be mental IMO

[Noxvayl]

@ Agent

1. Talking about 2 different drives; I commented on my Vertex 2(SF-1200 controller) working.
2. I conceded that newer drives weren't as good.
3. You said you wouldn't recommend any SandForce drive... well the Vertex 2 not only has worked well for myself and others but has won numerous awards to back up it's quality. Don't tarnish all SandForce drives with a brush backed with data from only 2 of their newer controllers; that is going overboard.

I had no prior knowledge of Vertex 3 issues and now being aware of them I'd warn people of the problems myself but I wouldn't engage in hyperbole discouraging the use of any SandForce drives or OCZ drives and will always make people aware of hyperbolic statements like yours because it is not helpful.

Discourage the use of Vertex 3 drives by all means but don't go say the same about all OCZ and SandForce drives based on information concerning a different SSD.

[Butuz]

Lol . I tried to put it politely but agent spoke it how it is.

Butuz

[Agent]

@ Agent
Talking about 2 different drives; I commented on my Vertex 2(SF-1200 controller) working..

Which is great, but is of no use to the OP who is looking at version 3 or 4

You said you wouldn't recommend any SandForce drive... well the Vertex 2 not only has worked well for myself and others but has won numerous awards to back up it's quality. Don't tarnish all SandForce drives with a brush backed with data from only 2 of their newer controllers; that is going overboard.

It's not going overboard - Sandforce has inheritance problems even on their older revisions. You fill the drive with the "wrong" data (which in it's own right is a crazy statement to have to make) and then it's knackered without a proper format. You can not get the speed back, with or without TRIM. Can't be done. Period.

Don't believe me? Read AnAnds article.

Headline speeds are what Sandforce sell on. And when they are used as intended, they work fine (the older ones certainly). You're just in trouble speed wise if you upset them.

You compare this to something like the M4 and you have none of the above to consider. It has a slower 'headline' speed (but not huge for most users), but it achieves that speed almost constantly. You don't need to consider the 'type' of data you put on it and TRIM works like TRIM should, even with the drive being filled.

I had no prior knowledge of Vertex 3 issues and now being aware of them I'd warn people of the problems myself but I wouldn't engage in hyperbole discouraging the use of any SandForce drives or OCZ drives and will always make people aware of hyperbolic statements like yours because it is not helpful.

Sorry you don't find them helpful, but there wasn't any hyperbole involved. I stated clearly why I wouldn't recommend any Sandforce drives:

Sandforce drives suffer badly when they are filled with the wrong data. So badly in fact that TRIM does nothing (yes, you read that right). Due to the way Sandforce drives work, it's not a simple case of enabling TRIM and all is well with them

That is not hyperbole or exaggeration sir, it's a simple fact that can be verified by the articles I linked (or many others). If you wish to ignore them, then fine, but please don't accuse me of 'hyperbole' when I've stated the reasons, with evidence of why I wouldn't recommend them.

Discourage the use of Vertex 3 drives by all means but don't go say the same about all OCZ and SandForce drives based on information concerning a different SSD.

As above.