Fines for Middle Lane Hogs

[Smudger]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22770064

About flipping time, although I don't know how effective it'll be, there's hardly any coppers on the roads...

[Dooms]

Free money for the government, I think they will love to enforce this

I'm all for it, perhaps people might actually learn how lanes work.

[Domestic_Ginger]

Fine under takers too; double monies!

[Saracen]

Tail-gating, too, according to radio and TV reports.

But .... when exactly are you "hogging"?

I mean, well, .... changing lanes is inherently a dangerous manoeuvre, certainly more so than staying put.

So, some scenarios ....

1) Three-lane road. A way down the road is a slow-moving lorry. You're in the middle lane, doing 70. And, in a short while, say, a minute, you'll catch up with the lorry. Traffic behind you is fairly heavy, so if you pull over, in 30-40 seconds, you're going to be wanting to pull back out, and it may not prove easy. And, you are already doing the legal speed limit so anyone you're "hogging" the lane from MUST be speeding.

2) Same bit of road. There's the occasional lorry, and it's 3AM, and traffic is light. Anyone wanting to get past can, as the outer lane is clear. A police car comes up behind you, you aren't preventing anyone passing, but if you pull in, will in a short period, have to pull out. But you didn't pull over, so you get points and a fine.

3) Same as 1) but instead of having to pull out in 30-40 seconds, it's 60 seconds, or 90 seconds? Where is the dividing line? Or are we supposed to pull over if there's a gap 5 times the length of our car?

It seems to me, at least based on reports I've heard so far, that a LOT is down to judgement. Whose judgement? What level of guidance is there, and what level of proof will there need to be?

I want to know a LOT more about these proposals before I agree with them, though I agree, some people do hog, absolutely needlessly, and in today's busy conditions, deserve a ticket. The problem is how we implement it, in the real world.

[Smudger]

I think it's mainly about people who stay in the middle lane no matter what the circumstances. Not sure they'll be nicking people willy-nilly.

[Saracen]

I think it's mainly about people who stay in the middle lane no matter what the circumstances. Not sure they'll be nicking people willy-nilly.

Indeed, but it's the "not sure" bit that worries me.

[Smudger]

I guess it depends who the officer is. If it's any of the ones off those telly shows, any more than a car length gap in the inside lane and you're nicked. And they'll be smiling into the camera. Probably.

[Zak33]

Fines for Middle lane hogs
Fines for Undertakers too

looking like I'm gonna need some kind of 37mm cannon on the nose... if I cant squirt past them on the left, and they won't move... and the right lane is chocker with BMW's....

[Shirty]

I'm broadly in support of this, but I also have concerns about the implementation.

That said I've never understood the mentality behind sitting in the middle lane on a quiet stretch of motorway. Having to cross two lanes to pass someone on an empty road is baffling.

[jigger]

Tail-gating, too, according to radio and TV reports.

But .... when exactly are you "hogging"?

I mean, well, .... changing lanes is inherently a dangerous manoeuvre, certainly more so than staying put.

So, some scenarios ....

1) Three-lane road. A way down the road is a slow-moving lorry. You're in the middle lane, doing 70. And, in a short while, say, a minute, you'll catch up with the lorry. Traffic behind you is fairly heavy, so if you pull over, in 30-40 seconds, you're going to be wanting to pull back out, and it may not prove easy. And, you are already doing the legal speed limit so anyone you're "hogging" the lane from MUST be speeding.

2) Same bit of road. There's the occasional lorry, and it's 3AM, and traffic is light. Anyone wanting to get past can, as the outer lane is clear. A police car comes up behind you, you aren't preventing anyone passing, but if you pull in, will in a short period, have to pull out. But you didn't pull over, so you get points and a fine.

3) Same as 1) but instead of having to pull out in 30-40 seconds, it's 60 seconds, or 90 seconds? Where is the dividing line? Or are we supposed to pull over if there's a gap 5 times the length of our car?

It seems to me, at least based on reports I've heard so far, that a LOT is down to judgement. Whose judgement? What level of guidance is there, and what level of proof will there need to be?

I want to know a LOT more about these proposals before I agree with them, though I agree, some people do hog, absolutely needlessly, and in today's busy conditions, deserve a ticket. The problem is how we implement it, in the real world.

All valid points and the Police need to be sensible. People do tend to drive obliviously in the centre lane for miles and I cant remember how many times Ive been held up waiting to performed a 6 lane overtaking manoeuvre in heavy traffic because people don't notice someone gaining on them to the left or rear and the left hand lane is empty. I think it should come down to if your holding up traffic and have had a reasonable chance give way although I'm not sure why this can't come under due care and attention.

I hired a LWB van a little while back and moving that from the left hand lane to the right and back every few miles was frustrating.

[jigger]

Fines for Middle lane hogs
Fines for Undertakers too

looking like I'm gonna need some kind of 37mm cannon on the nose... if I cant squirt past them on the left, and they won't move... and the right lane is chocker with BMW's....

LOL. Some kind of deployable aerofoil maybe?

[Saracen]

I guess it depends who the officer is. If it's any of the ones off those telly shows, any more than a car length gap in the inside lane and you're nicked. And they'll be smiling into the camera. Probably.

But that (the first line) is partly what worries me. Many, maybe most, police officers are reasonable people, BUT ....

- some are right jackasses, and
- most get a bit, shall we say "jaded", after a while,
- you'll come across the occasional arrogant twerp where a bit of power has gone to his head.

It should NOT be at the discretion of individual officers, unless very clear guidance exists as to where that starts, or every motorist is at risk of being done over by a jackass that got out of the wrong side of bed that morning, or was dumped by his bird the night before.

I mean, every officer does and should have a degree of discretion in how to handle offenders ONCE it is clear someone has offended.Get caught at 35 in a 30 limit and what happens to you will depend, in part at least, on your attitude. Cops don't have a monopoly on being arrogant, by any means. Courtesy and consideration, in both directions, goes a long way. I was stopped (about 35 years ago) for a duff tail light. I could have thrown an attitude and ended up being done. I was genuinely surprised as I'd checked the lights a couple of days ago, so I popped the boot, had a quick rummage and a connector had been knocked off. I reconnected it and the light came on, so I thanked the officer for pointing it out. He said "you're welcome", and that was that. Yet, I HAD been driving with a defective light.

The discretion was in him doing or not doing something formal about it. But I wouldn't be happy if it was down to his judgement as to whether it was bright enough, or whether the indicator glass was the right shade of orange. Or whether I've got to move lane in 5 seconds, 30 seconds, or a minute.

We need much clearer guidelines as to when you are, or aren't hogging, before police start handing out points and fines for doing it, if it's just that officer's opinion as to whether you are or not.

[Flash477]

Personally I don't see a problem with this new law, and tbh I think it is well overdue - I have lost count the number of times that I have had to move from lane 1 to 3 and then back again because some idiot can't be arsed to change lanes. It is actually that kind of driving that probably causes a lot of backlogs on the motorways as instead of traffic being able to flow past in 2 lanes, it all gets bottle necked into 1 lane, which then also makes it harder for the emergency services when they need to get somewhere on the motorway.

All of the cop cars have cameras nowadays, so there is proof as to whether or not you were in the wrong, and as such it would then be up to them to prove it in court if you decided to take it that far.

I think that it is pretty obvious when there is intention to overtake, so I don't see it being a grey area.

Like all other things there will be a degree of opinion depending on the officer, but then there always has been, so no change there.

I was listening to the debate on Radio 2 about it (I recommend listening to today's Jeremy Vine shown if you missed it) and the level of ignorance astounded me. The number of people who used the excuse of being in the middle lane as a safety buffer in case the car when out of control was stupid. They obviously don't realise that if they did lose control then they are actually more likely to hit more cars from the middle lane!

[Whizzkid]

About blooming time. Fed up of people hogging the fast lane. 9 times out of ten its a woman *hides*

[phil4]

It seems to me, at least based on reports I've heard so far, that a LOT is down to judgement. Whose judgement? What level of guidance is there, and what level of proof will there need to be?

I want to know a LOT more about these proposals before I agree with them, though I agree, some people do hog, absolutely needlessly, and in today's busy conditions, deserve a ticket. The problem is how we implement it, in the real world.

This!

[Larkspeed]

But .... when exactly are you "hogging"?

Simple if you are in the middle lane and someone that is traveling faster than you comes up behind you and you do not move over then you are hogging the lane.

You are not allowed to deliberately do anything when driving that obstructs other road users or causes another driver to have to make a maneuver to avoid you unless it cannot be avoided or is an emergency.

This includes:

Pulling out into traffic causing the car you pulled out in front of to brake or swerve to avoid hitting you.
Changing lanes in front of another vehicle causing that car to either brake or swerve to avoid you.
Driving over the center line causing on coming traffic to move over to avoid you.
Making a turn across oncoming traffic causing that traffic to have to brake or swerve to avoid hitting you.
the list goes on

And yes this includes staying in the middle lane of the motorway which would force a faster moving vehicle to change lanes to avoid you when you have a clear lane you could move into to clear the way.

Lane 1 is a driving lane the other two are passing lanes.

Both tailgating and lane hogging are huge problems here, they are illegal and you can get a fine for it. problem is the cops never give out the damn fines. It's terrifying to drive on the highway here if you are not used to it. Plus where we are we get all the Germans coming over the border that seem to be too thick to realize that we have speed limits here.