Porsche board member investigation over emissions

Clearly with VW owning Porche and a few shared engines/platforms, there was going to be some emission issues.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-vo...-idUKKBN1HP0YD

The German prosecutors are now trawling thorugh plenty of documents

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reuters

Around 10 premises in Bavaria and Baden-Wuerttemberg were searched by around 160 officials, the prosecutor’s office in Porsche’s home town of Stuttgart said in a statement

---

Anyone know how many and which modesl are involved? I know that some of the Porsche range became quite popular as company cars this decade with low CO2 numbers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zak33

Anyone know how many and which modesl are involved? I know that some of the Porsche range became quite popular as company cars this decade with low CO2 numbers.

---

I would think the models popular as company cars because of the low emissions :)

I think emissions are the least of your concerns if you own a Porsche as a company car!! :p

It'll be the 918. Loads of people ordered that to avoid high-CO2 car tax.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Smudger

It'll be the 918. Loads of people ordered that to avoid high-CO2 car tax.

---

But TBH if you can afford a car which cost £600000+ when it launched,and you can't afford a few £1000 a year extra in maintenance,there is something weird going on! ;)

http://www.nextgreencar.com/emission...model/porsche/

Lots of v low CO2 models, and low CO2 means low company car tax comapred to list price.

Think I've seen a few diesel panameras on the fleet - probably where they are looking.

Crazy how cheap they are now as well

Edit: might be hybrids, above my level unfortunately :(

Maybe they should have used a Toyota Prius instead! ;) But hasn't it got a worse CO2 rating despite having a smaller,and less powerful engine?? With those Porsches having an average engine size double that of the average UK car,and significantly more power,its not shocking that it turns out the engines used are more polluting than expected. Not surprised at all,and if they have been fiddling the figures they deserve the book to be thrown at them,especially since they are screwing over competitors who have lost out on sales.

I thought the whole concept of hybrids(or even the diesel models)was to move towards smaller and more efficient engines,not as an excuse to shoe horn a large engine into a vehicle. You don't need a 325BHP supercharged 3.0 litre V6,etc and a 168MPH top speed,on our motorways as a COMPANY car,especially since we have something called a speed limit - this is more for showing off than you can outrun Mondeo man on the motorway,than anything else. So I assume the low road tax,is making up for all the speeding tickets the drivers are getting?? ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

But TBH if you can afford a car which cost £600000+ when it launched,and you can't afford a few £1000 a year extra in maintenance,there is something weird going on! ;)

---

That's the... oh never mind... :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by smudger

that's the... Oh never mind... :p

---

lol.

It does make me wonder whether the testing regimin for cars as a whole needs to be more stricter though. If VAG tried to do it,then who else??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zak33

http://www.nextgreencar.com/emission...model/porsche/

Lots of v low CO2 models, and low CO2 means low company car tax comapred to list price.

---

When I was entitled to a company car, only cars with a CO2 of below 130 were even available. I'm sure mine isn't the only company with a similar policy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

lol.

It does make me wonder whether the testing regimin for cars as a whole needs to be more stricter though. If VAG tried to do it,then who else??

---

Knowing someone in the industry who writes ecu software he is pretty sure everyone does it to some extent.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

lol.

It does make me wonder whether the testing regimin for cars as a whole needs to be more stricter though. If VAG tried to do it,then who else??

---

Strict lab-based tests are the best way to compare like for like - but also the easiest to detect & cheat in. The decompiled VW ECU results show that they were detecting the _exact_ parameters of NEDC & only turning on the advertised low emissions during those tests - in real-world driving they would never hit the promised numbers.

https://i.imgur.com/Sx4qaG8.png

A VW would only enable low emissions between any of the pairs of colored lines above (white line is NEDC cycle). That's how much a standardized test can be cheated.

So you fix the problem by using undetectable "real world" driving instead of a dyno... but at that point, you add a HUGE margin of error to proceedings

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by directhex

Strict lab-based tests are the best way to compare like for like - but also the easiest to detect & cheat in. The decompiled VW ECU results show that they were detecting the _exact_ parameters of NEDC & only turning on the advertised low emissions during those tests - in real-world driving they would never hit the promised numbers.

https://i.imgur.com/Sx4qaG8.png

A VW would only enable low emissions between any of the pairs of colored lines above (white line is NEDC cycle). That's how much a standardized test can be cheated.

So you fix the problem by using undetectable "real world" driving instead of a dyno... but at that point, you add a HUGE margin of error to proceedings

---

I believe that the WLTP test is done in the lab but for certification, they now also have to do both the WLTP test in the lab and an actual driving test - i.e. take the vehicle out on the road with emissions kit attached to the exhaust. This will be a lot harder to game.

However it is still massively flawed. No hills - simulated or otherwise and the gear change points are fixed. WTF are they unaware that different cars have different optimal change points? No wonder cars with automatic gearboxes do better in the tests these days.