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Thread: All good things come to an end

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    Monkey Apex's Avatar
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    All good things come to an end

    https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-...-in-2035/41786

    So that date that felt so far ahead actually will be a lot closer, 15yrs to shift this country, not a chance in hell of it actually working.

    Change happens, but this ?



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    root Member DanceswithUnix's Avatar
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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Ask whoever is prime minister in 2035 if this is really happening.

    It won't be Boris, he can promise anything he wants.

    Edit: I quite fancy a plug in hybrid, but I suspect this will make that less likely to happen. That just gets me keeping my existing ICE cars longer.

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    How about spending the HS2 money on improving the charging infrastructure, sure Tesla would be up for a deal of some sort...

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Quote Originally Posted by [GSV]Trig View Post
    How about spending the HS2 money on improving the charging infrastructure, sure Tesla would be up for a deal of some sort...
    that would be quite a good idea.. but I think perhaps start by building out own power stations and not allowing them to be owned by foreign nationals so at least we own our own juice to go into the new charge network

    Anyway... lets not see Boris' promise to many things and us believe them.....

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    15 years for what they want to achieve is an incredibly short amount of time, not to mention the infrastructure, things like this take years and years of planning let alone implementing it and having it all up and running. It certainly won't happen within 15 years.
    Jon

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    Banhammer in peace PeterB kalniel's Avatar
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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Agree with the sentiment so far. People who can afford houses with their own drives will be OK, but it's the less-well off or those who by circumstance don't have a drive/garage who will end up paying more to continue to use transport.

    I just saw a report that said people who own plug in electric hybrid cars don't even charge them most of the time, so they're carrying around bulk for no purpose. If we want to reduce fossil fuel use then we should be taxing the fuel more, then people will pay for what they actually use, not some hypothetical generalisation.

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    A lot of employers are starting to look at charing at work though, we do it here now, the missus works on a uni campus where they have a row of about 5 chargers, its coming, and tbh, I dont think it'll take 15 years to sort out, there needs to be some sort of incentive for the manufacturers to do it, bit of help from the government and 15 years would be plenty of time IMHO..

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    Banhammer in peace PeterB kalniel's Avatar
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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Quote Originally Posted by [GSV]Trig View Post
    A lot of employers are starting to look at charing at work though, we do it here now, the missus works on a uni campus where they have a row of about 5 chargers, its coming, and tbh, I dont think it'll take 15 years to sort out, there needs to be some sort of incentive for the manufacturers to do it, bit of help from the government and 15 years would be plenty of time IMHO..
    We had that at my old work too, and it was unreliable because there were always more cars than chargers. If you rely on it (because of no home charger) then you're stuffed. Plus sometimes people need to use cars at weekends too

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonj1611 View Post
    15 years for what they want to achieve is an incredibly short amount of time, not to mention the infrastructure, things like this take years and years of planning let alone implementing it and having it all up and running. It certainly won't happen within 15 years.
    No.
    It takes years and years to do things the way we currently do them.
    This could be rolling out nationwide within 5 years. It just requires lots of money, some nicely creative incentives and lots of cutting through the red tape bureaucracy.

    Quote Originally Posted by kalniel View Post
    If we want to reduce fossil fuel use then we should be taxing the fuel more, then people will pay for what they actually use, not some hypothetical generalisation.
    Well yes, that will reduce fossil fuel usage, but only because you price people out of the market. It does not solve the overall problem.
    You will instead have stacks of people who cannot afford a srubbishrubbishrubbishrubbishy electric car, cannot use an ICE car, often cannot feasibly use a bicycle, cannot practically walk everywhere, cannot fit into the existing public transport infrastructure capacities (and probably cannot afford the insane fares), and do not even have decent internet by which to work from home.....
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    Re: All good things come to an end

    This isn't something you can throw money at, just take a good look around you, not sure where you live but where I live there are no houses with driveways, there are lots of houses without even parking outside the home, there are some people parking on grass and fields, its full of flats etc, millions and millions of people would need to power their cars daily. Might be a good idea if as mentioned you have a driveway and the UK has the electricity capacity for millions of cars but in most places it needs some serious serious planning, try living around my way, takes them 8 months to fill a pothole. God knows how they will dig up miles and miles of roads and pathways to put in the thousands of power connectors they will need.
    Last edited by Jonj1611; 06-02-2020 at 06:26 PM.
    Jon

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    Banhammer in peace PeterB kalniel's Avatar
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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Quote Originally Posted by Ttaskmaster View Post
    Well yes, that will reduce fossil fuel usage, but only because you price people out of the market. It does not solve the overall problem.
    You will instead have stacks of people who cannot afford a srubbishrubbishrubbishrubbishy electric car, cannot use an ICE car, often cannot feasibly use a bicycle, cannot practically walk everywhere, cannot fit into the existing public transport infrastructure capacities (and probably cannot afford the insane fares), and do not even have decent internet by which to work from home.....
    I'm not suggesting pricing people out of the market by raising fuel tax - it could end up cheaper for some who only use a car occasionally, or who car share etc. And those who can't should always have the choice of what kind of car they use - a cheap city car is probably more efficient than an SUV for example. But if a different car is more efficient for your kind of journey they you can use it and make savings, rather than having to buy a particular car because that's what govt. is incentivising and it turn out to be less efficient than a car they're universally encouraging.

    Above all it matches actual emissions to cost, rather than making everyone pay the same regardless of how much they're polluting.

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonj1611 View Post
    This isn't something you can throw money at, just take a good look around you, not sure where you live but where I live there are no houses with driveways, there are lots of houses without even parking outside the home, there are some people parking on grass and fields, its full of flats etc, millions and millions of people would need to power their cars daily. Might be a good idea if as mentioned you have a driveway and the UK has the electicy capacity for millions of cars but in most places it needs some serious serious planning, try living around my way, takes them 8 months to fill a pothole. God knows how they will dig up miles and miles of roads and pathways to put in the thousands of power connectors they will need.
    sadly, this is correct

    there are millions of homes ...millions, where the rows of terraced houses, cant accomodate the sheer volume of charge stations required.

    assuming they all work and never break......assuming vanadalism never occurs and no one ever reverses into one.
    and that all assumes that everyone gets to use a grid of them, and not have to own their own version... because millions of people cant park anywhere near their own house. not even in the same street.

    then we need to look at fuel stations, where fuel will still be for sale for another decade or two as the older cars all still need it.

    Hydrogen cell might yet come smash electric cars too

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    I think a lot of this is moot and moving forward most people will not even own a car.

    Take away the cab driver and how much does it cost for a taxi journey?

    By the time this happens, I fully envisage autonomous vehicles moving us around for a price that will be hard to beat by owning a vehicle and the associated upkeep yourself. We will essentially have Cars as a Service
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    Re: All good things come to an end

    We are closer on electric than we are with hydrogen, maybe once we've mined all of the, erm, whatever it is we use for batteries these days, then we'll have to look at hydrogen, maybe by the time we're in mobility scooters then the kids will be rocking around with hydrogen cars and someone will be saying that they are going to ban electric cars..

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    Re: All good things come to an end



    think that hydrogen is closer than perhaps you think

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    Re: All good things come to an end

    Problem with hydrogen is availability, though it would be far far easier installing hydrogen pumps at existing service stations than it would digging up everything to put charging points in. And the government still have something to tax
    Jon

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