Traction Control / ESP etc?

[joshwa]

Hello,

My car doesn't have traction control, but I was wondering, does traction control make tires last longer, as they are less likely to spin under accelleration? Or is this of such small importance that it doesn't make a difference to how long the tires last?

Also has anyone had it fitted to a car after purchase? Sometimes it's a factory option, but can it be done afterwards, and would anyone know how much it would cost to get fitted to a Passat?

Does it make a car massively safer? (like euroncap.com keep saying...?) or Quicker? or better handling?

Thanks

Josh

[Butuz]

Traction control that comes from most manufacturer is ususally complete rubbish. They just dont sense and adjust at a high enough refresh rate to be properly effective.

You can get really effective aftermarket traction control such as Race Logic TC but its rather expensive and a bit of a waste of time if your running under 200bhp.

Butuz

[GoNz0]

my bmw has nice stability control, bailed me out a couple of times now.
it would be a big job to retrofit if its anything like my car, ie a donor car so you can swop the wiring loom, ECU, and all the mechanical parts such as air intake limit the hydro unit to power the system, its not worth it :|

[5lab]

stability control is very different to traction control, and does a different job - traction control would, i think, make a difference if you wheelspin, but to be honest, you can probably learn not to do that after a week or 2 in most cars. i don't think its useless - sure, you can drive quicker without it, but that's not the aim - if it keeps the arse in line on a wet day, with an inexperianced driver, than its a godsend imo

not sure if you can get it aftermarket, but i'm certain the costs would outweigh any tire savings.

[SilentDeath]

ESP works in addition to the differential between left/right/front/rear wheels. Im not 100% sure how differentials work but basicly round a corner some wheels need to go further in distance, and turn faster, than others.

ESP works by braking usually just on one or two wheels, allowing you to turn tighter corners at higher speeds. Obviously any cars with ESP will also have ABS (as they work in similar ways). Its suppost to be very good at controlling understeer which is the reson euroncap think its so important.

[Butcher]

Can't see how traction control makes a big diff to safety, ESP could potentially though. Overall driving defensively probably makes a lot difference than any amount of techno trickery though.

[5lab]

esp is a little more than that - it helps stop you spinning, and in fact is better at doing it than any driver could be. esp has gyroscopes in it to sense the angle a car is turning, and compares this to the angle of the wheel, if they don't match, it kicks in. lets say your rear end starts to drift round a right hand corner. esp will brake the front left wheel so as to help stop the twisting motion. the reason why its better than a driver is a driver has no control over an individual wheel's brake.

esp will not make you drive quicker. all it will do is help save your ass if you go to fast.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiZjeeMExY4

http://www.wak-tt.com/esp/5thgear_esp.wmv

[Moby-Dick]

I dont think having traction control will make your tyres last longer , just go easy on the right foot when pulling away

if you insist on having it fitted , its about £500 or so from Racelogic.

[dangel]

ESP Is a godsend - it's a remarkable system and I'm very glad I paid for it as an extra when I bought my Leon - it's saved my ass from a ditch at least once. Traction control shoudln't cut in unless you're being too heavy with your right foot anyway - the exception being in slippy conditions pulling away on full lock for me (in which case I tend to disable it temporarily). Std. traction control is pants, ESP is great. Nuff said.

[badass]

Neither will make you faster "on a track" compared to driving properly, and TBH tyre saving doesn't even come into it. Yes your tyres may last a little longer, but how long your tyres last is more to do with how you drive.
Sure, if you wheelspin everywhere, your tyres will last longer with traction control, but they still won't last long as traction control still allows slip to occur. Just not as much.
You're just better off going easier on the throttle and brakes, especially pulling out of junctions and at generally low speeds.

[kalniel]

Agree with the general trend: Traction control - not worth it, ESP - very worth it.

[SilentDeath]

Neither will make you faster "on a track" compared to driving properly, and TBH tyre saving doesn't even come into it. Yes your tyres may last a little longer, but how long your tyres last is more to do with how you drive.
Sure, if you wheelspin everywhere, your tyres will last longer with traction control, but they still won't last long as traction control still allows slip to occur. Just not as much.
You're just better off going easier on the throttle and brakes, especially pulling out of junctions and at generally low speeds.

ESP, in theory would make you much faster on the track.... but as a driver you get no control over it. With factory fitted systems it woudl depend on the car and how agressive the manufactuer set it up.

But if you had a custom system, allowing you to control all 4 brakes, it would be perfect for on a track. For example in a FWD car turning right/unersteering, you could brake on the rear right wheel and that would correct it.

[5lab]

not really. as far as i know, the fastest way to drive on a track is with none of the wheels sliding..

[kalniel]

Well it's true that side independant braking could improve performance (McClaren ran it on their forumula 1 cards before it was banned), but all the psuedo tests on tv car shows seem to give faster times with ESP turned of. The only electonic aid I can remember that actually increased performance was ProDrive.

[badass]

ESP, in theory would make you much faster on the track.... but as a driver you get no control over it. With factory fitted systems it woudl depend on the car and how agressive the manufactuer set it up.

But if you had a custom system, allowing you to control all 4 brakes, it would be perfect for on a track. For example in a FWD car turning right/unersteering, you could brake on the rear right wheel and that would correct it.

The problem is that in that example, the car is sliding. All ESP would do is correct the slide, no matter how well set up.

EBD on the other hand most certainly does help with lap times. It is banned in formula 1, but at least 2 teams I know of have a very effective way of getting "effective EBD" without actually having a device change the brake force distribution. These same 2 teams also have a very good way of getting around the "no adjusting of the spoilers in the race" rules aswell

No, I'm not telling who they are as 2 of my friends jobs might be at risk if I do.

[joshwa]

I contacted VW and they said it (ESP) couldn't be fitted to my car, however I also asked if cruise control could be fitted to my car, and they said no... even though there are other people that do fit (official vw) cruise control afterwards. I think I'll leave it, and would prefer to spend the money getting my car tuned, and then get cruise control