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Thread: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

  1. #17
    Senior Member mikeo01's Avatar
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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    OK now this is odd. Anything past 220 FSB on the Windows based EasyTune6 will not work. Does this mean my RAM isn't up to it?

    I don't see any reason why my BIOS won't go further than 225 frequency. Even with an underclock it doesn't get past 225, without some sort of freeze (EasyTune6) or no POST (which weirdly enough, did work and I was getting 3.5 Ghz, no freezes, stable).

    Why doesn't the same settings now work? I am quite confused by this.

  2. #18
    Senior Member mikeo01's Avatar
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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Right, I know what the problem is.

    Why on earth has Gigabyte made an AM3 board limited? The HT speed is limited to x5. K8 CPU speed, which is Athlon 64 x2 HT link.

    The limitation is not the CPU, its got to be the motherboard. The HT link cannot be increase, so im stuck with x5 or lower with my Athlon II x3.

    The board is fully capable of an overclock, but Gigabyte has reduced the HT link speed so everything else is limited due to that.

    Seems like the problem, but why on earth would Gigabyte limit this board?

  3. #19
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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo01 View Post
    Right, I know what the problem is.

    Why on earth has Gigabyte made an AM3 board limited? The HT speed is limited to x5. K8 CPU speed, which is Athlon 64 x2 HT link.

    The limitation is not the CPU, its got to be the motherboard. The HT link cannot be increase, so im stuck with x5 or lower with my Athlon II x3.

    The board is fully capable of an overclock, but Gigabyte has reduced the HT link speed so everything else is limited due to that.

    Seems like the problem, but why on earth would Gigabyte limit this board?
    Your motherboard is based on an older chipset,the Nvidia 7025 which does not support the full HT speed of newer CPUs like the Athlon II X3 440. Also overclocking an unlocked Athlon II X3 on your motherboard should be done with a bit of caution too.

    IIRC,I did tell you this before:

    http://forums.hexus.net/2199997-post4.html

  4. #20
    Senior Member mikeo01's Avatar
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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    I am not unlocking it.

    I have locked the core so it is an Athlon II x3. What I am saying is the CPU frequency won't go past 215 and I do not know why.

    I am keeping it as a Athlon triple core, not a Phenom.

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo01 View Post
    I am not unlocking it.

    I have locked the core so it is an Athlon II x3. What I am saying is the CPU frequency won't go past 215 and I do not know why.

    I am keeping it as a Athlon triple core, not a Phenom.
    Like I said, the motherboard does not support the full HT frequency of new CPUs, as it does not support HT3.0 which the Athlon II X3 uses! If you want full HT speed you need a motherboard with a newer chipset.

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    But why would that effect the CPU frequency itself?

  7. #23
    Bagnaj97
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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    I believe the limit for early versions of HT was 1GHz, if you're running it at x5 multi with 220 bus then you're at 1.1GHz. Try dropping the HT multiplier and see if you get any further. Overclocking the HT bus is known for causing instability with minor, at best, performance gains.

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Just to add to what Bagnaj said, HT speed isn't generally an important performance thing and you probably wouldn't notice if you dropped it to x2 tbh.

    Drop HT to x4, and you should be good for a 250MHz FSB before it goes out of spec again.

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Overclocking the HT bus is actually known to produce decent gains in performance:

    http://www.anandtech.com/show/3877/a...ance-scaling/7

    That is with a Phenom II X6,so the Athlon II/Phenom II X3 and X4 CPUs will produce slightly less gains. The Athlon II/Phenom II CPUs are known to be bandwidth limited designs especially when compared to Intel designs from the last few years.

    The Athlon II X3 has a native HT frequency of 2000MHZ as it is uses HT3.0 and the 7025 is only supports HT1.0(1000MHZ) which is what the older generation Athlon 64 CPUs supported.

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Those graphs are for CPU-NB, setting the speed of the integrated memory controller and hence L3 cache. We want as much speed there as we can get.

    I was talking HT speed, which mainly bridges the PCIe interface, unless you are using integrated graphics in which case it fetches screen data from the CPU to chipset and probably matters a lot more.

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    I meant to say CPU-NB. Must be having a senior moment!

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Quote Originally Posted by DanceswithUnix View Post
    ... unless you are using integrated graphics in which case it fetches screen data from the CPU to chipset and probably matters a lot more.
    There's a good example of this in the early 780G / 790GX reviews: the 780G review is done with an Athlon X2 4850e (i.e. HT1.0), whereas the 790GX review is done with a Phenom X4 9850 (i.e. HT3.0). The 780G gets a fairly significant boost in performance, *just* from having a HT3 CPU in the socket.

    Of course, since the HT1 only allowed for 4GB/s bandwidth, and a PCIe 2.0 x16 slot can handle 8GB/s on its own (don't forget that the southbridge, and therefore all storage and peripherals, also conmmunicate with the CPU over the HT link), it is possible that the HT1 link *could* bottleneck the system in general if its getting a heavy pounding...

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Quote Originally Posted by scaryjim View Post
    There's a good example of this in the early 780G / 790GX reviews: the 780G review is done with an Athlon X2 4850e (i.e. HT1.0), whereas the 790GX review is done with a Phenom X4 9850 (i.e. HT3.0). The 780G gets a fairly significant boost in performance, *just* from having a HT3 CPU in the socket.

    Of course, since the HT1 only allowed for 4GB/s bandwidth, and a PCIe 2.0 x16 slot can handle 8GB/s on its own (don't forget that the southbridge, and therefore all storage and peripherals, also conmmunicate with the CPU over the HT link), it is possible that the HT1 link *could* bottleneck the system in general if its getting a heavy pounding...
    That was the sort of thing I was thinking of.

    But for overclocking, you can lose a little HT to gain stability for a better CPU frequency.

    I'm sure I have read overclocking advice that says to drop HT multiplier right down at the start of an overclock so you can ignore it, and put some back at the end when you are sure your core frequency is stable. In this case though, if Mike sets HT to x4 then he is back at his full 1GHz when bus frequency hits 250MHz which is pretty good so I doubt he will need to drop down to x3 by going higher.
    Last edited by DanceswithUnix; 13-01-2012 at 05:58 PM. Reason: Edit for typo

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Quote Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH View Post
    I meant to say CPU-NB. Must be having a senior moment!
    You had me doubting myself for a while there though until I figured one of us was having a moment and I figured it was your turn

  15. #31
    Senior Member mikeo01's Avatar
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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Right DanceswithUnix was right about dropping the HT at the start.

    Can anyone tell me whats happening though.

    Right, reset BIOS to default.

    Drop the HT to x1
    CPU volt 1.475
    DRAM 5.33 1066 mhz
    CPU-NB freq x10

    Increase CPU freq by 10 each time, finally got to 250. DRAM at 1332 mhz if I remember rightly.

    Bump up the HT to x1, CPU freq reset. So I increase the CPU freq and it wouldn't allow past 210... with everything at same settings.

    So I set the BIOS stuff to default, restart. Did the whole thing again but with HT x4, wouldn't get past x1. So I thought OK I will leave it at x1 with 250 cpu freq, wouldn't allow it.

    So using the same settings to get an overclock of 3.7 ghz, wouldn't work after setting BIOS to default. Why on earth wouldn't that work with EXACTLY the same settings as I used?

    Thanks for everyones help.

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    Re: AMD Athlon II x3 440 Overclocking??

    Support for DDR3 1333(OC)/1066/800 MHz memory modules < they're serious about this!

    I have the same board rev 3.1 which will run 1600 xmp, no other xmp clocks will run, only the 800, 1066, 1333 and 1600 supported by the board. As you can see from this handy list, I can only run fsb of 240/241, 250/251, 266/267 or 300. 300 was a no go, may work for a 4 core. My board also will only boot with default settings if the HT and NB are set to anything other than auto. Presently I'm running a 1045T @3.6 GHZ, 1066 mem, 266FSB and 2666 NB for video coding. Games ran best at 250FSB, 3.4GHZ and 1333, some graphics and office apps ran best at 240, 3.25 and 1600.

    4 5.33 6.66 8
    200 800 1066 1332 1600
    201 804 1071.33 1338.66 1608
    202 808 1076.66 1345.32 1616
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