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Thread: 10% tax band petition

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    Senior Member j1979's Avatar
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    10% tax band petition

    Petition to: reintroduce the ten pence tax band urgently, in order to prevent low paid workers facing a painful increase in the tax they pay on their income.

    Well the new 20% tax band is out now and anyone earning below £17,000 will be worse off, even if this does not effect you, im sure most will agree that it not fair on people on low incomes.

    so please consider signing the petition to bring back to 10% tax band.

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    G4Z
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Its total crap but this petition is just a bit late given it was announced 12 months ago.

    I for one will be better off under this new income tax (maybe not if you add in the other tax rises in fuel, car tax and council tax) but I think its utterly dispicable from a supposedly socialist 'fairness for all' Labour party.
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    Senior Member j1979's Avatar
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    yep its old but, MPs are voting this week on bringing it back, when the vote on the Finance bill.

    Senior Labour MP joins revolt over 10p tax rate | This is Money

    i dont know when they vote but, if the gov does not win, it will be the end of Brown

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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    We'll I pay a hellish amount of tax because I'm in a higher bracket, and can't see that changing soon. Agreed however that it is disgusting that a socialist government would cause this.
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by G4Z View Post
    Its total crap but this petition is just a bit late given it was announced 12 months ago.

    I for one will be better off under this new income tax (maybe not if you add in the other tax rises in fuel, car tax and council tax) but I think its utterly dispicable from a supposedly socialist 'fairness for all' Labour party.
    I'm very disappointed with this as well, I was astonished that there was not a bigger fuss 12 months ago because even I noticed the message from the government was a '2p drop in the tax lower tax rate' when the opposition parties could have complained about the '10p increase in the lower tax rate' or '100% tax hike for the lower tax rate' - bit sad that more of the Labour MP (if any) were not against this.

    I'm better off but would have preferred to keep the 10p rate and hold the threshold of the 40% rate or even a lowering of this rate to balance the books just before the economy noise dives ...

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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by j1979 View Post

    Well the new 20% tax band is out now and anyone earning below £17,000 will be worse off, even if this does not effect you, im sure most will agree that it not fair on people on low incomes.
    That just isn't true. It's more complex than that.

    Some people earning less than £17000-ish will be worse off .... but not all. Some will be better off, because some groups get compensated by changes in other areas, such as changes to tax on pensions, and various tax credit schemes.

    It is true that some people on incomes under £17k will be worse off, but not by any means "anyone". It's also the case that not all income is earned, and in some cases, the 10% rate still applies on income from savings, but whether that affects an individual or not depends on the structure of income, and in particular, the respective amounts of earnings, pensions and savings.

    However, for those that it does affect, it's hardly a shining example of social justice, I agree.

    Oh, and it's not all sunshine and roses for higher earners either. They got somewhat clobbered through changes to NI thresholds.

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    SiM
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Petitions site
    With effect from April 2008, the main tax band is reduced from 22p to 20p in the pound, which is good news. However, at the same time the lower tax band is being abolished, whereby the first £2230 of taxable income (in 2007-08 allowances) was taxed only at 10p in the pound. This means that from April 2008 someone earning £500 a week will be about £8 a month better off, someone earning £400 a week will pay about the same, but someone earning only £150 a week will pay approximately £20 a month more in tax. We urge the Chancellor and Prime Minister to acknowledge that this is an unfortunate consequence that they had not envisaged, to realise the extent to which this will hurt families on lower incomes, and to reverse this policy at the earliest opportunity. This would cost very little, and would be appreciated by the poor as welcome relief, and by the better off as just and reasonable.
    I don't see any problem... how many people earn £150 a week? Even Tesco workers get more than that... the only people it would affect is the part time workers... and if they are working only part time then they clearly don't need the money that bad...

    If anything this provides an incentive for the people who are being lazy in crappy jobs to get out there and find a better job and work hard in them!

    According to this I will be (hypothetically) paying £300 more tax this 08/09 than 07/08... imo, that is not a huge amount of money that is going to change my life at all...

    /me eagerly waits for Saracen to provide opposite arguement

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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    sorry, i did'nt want to write an essay so i just said under £17,000

    ok, anyone earning under roughly £18,500 that;

    is not married or have kids (that are dependents), that is not earning below £12,500 (in this tax year or last year and over 25) and is not over 65 and still working.

    but sorry the savings and pension tax, presume that the person has money to save which as mr Brown knows that is unlikly to be the case.

    so the 10% tax on savings interest is a load of bull**** spin that certainly does'nt wash with me.

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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    I'm in favour of a simplefied flat rate tax!

    The problem with this is we've been seeing inflation, even if the RPI is 'fiddled' (ie inclusion of mp3 players say) so that it dosen't show. Staple food prices are also set to rise, with the fearful £1.50 for petrol imminent too.

    This is going to hit more people who are 'in poverty' (i hate this phrase been used without perspective of the world) than the basic tax changes.
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by SiM View Post
    I don't see any problem... how many people earn £150 a week? Even Tesco workers get more than that... the only people it would affect is the part time workers... and if they are working only part time then they clearly don't need the money that bad...

    If anything this provides an incentive for the people who are being lazy in crappy jobs to get out there and find a better job and work hard in them!

    According to this I will be (hypothetically) paying £300 more tax this 08/09 than 07/08... imo, that is not a huge amount of money that is going to change my life at all...

    /me eagerly waits for Saracen to provide opposite arguement

    ohh my god, i did'nt know that there were people like you still out there!

    low paid people are not lazy. and just for the record there are more people earning less then £18,000 then there are earning above £18,000. There are to be 5 million people worse off, but these are the people who can least efford to be worse off.

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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by SiM View Post
    and if they are working only part time then they clearly don't need the money that bad...

    If anything this provides an incentive for the people who are being lazy in crappy jobs to get out there and find a better job and work hard in them!
    What about people who can only work part time though, Students for example?

    And not everyone is being lazy if they are in a 'crappy job'. To put it bluntly, not all people have the ability to get much more than a minimum paid job, regardless of how hard they try.
    That and the economy needs the people at the lower end of the wage scale to survive in its current form.
    As demoralizing as it may sound, without all those minimum wage workers (and believe me, I've been there) in retail jobs / maccy D's etc. it would fall apart.
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by j1979 View Post
    ohh my god, i did'nt know that there were people like you still out there!

    low paid people are not lazy. and just for the record there are more people earning less then £18,000 then there are earning above £18,000. There are to be 5 million people worse off, but these are the people who can least efford to be worse off.
    Why are there people paid more than that, that is the question. Because they're in short supply, because fewer people can/are willing, to do that job.

    If i could earn the same money i do now as a paper boy, i'd be a paper boy without a shadow of a doubt.
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    SiM
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by j1979 View Post
    there are more people earning less then £18,000 then there are earning above £18,000
    I don't believe that, do you have a source?

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    SiM
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    In 2005-2006 the median weekly wage was £362.
    Source here page 6

    Its is more now...

    That histogram on page 6 pretty much summarises how many people are going to lose out... There is hardly and weight below £200

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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent View Post
    What about people who can only work part time though, Students for example?

    And not everyone is being lazy if they are in a 'crappy job'. To put it bluntly, not all people have the ability to get much more than a minimum paid job, regardless of how hard they try.
    That and the economy needs the people at the lower end of the wage scale to survive in its current form.
    As demoralizing as it may sound, without all those minimum wage workers (and believe me, I've been there) in retail jobs / maccy D's etc. it would fall apart.
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    Re: 10% tax band petition

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent View Post
    What about people who can only work part time though, Students for example?
    Students pay hardly no tax anyway... I would be surprised if they reached the 20% band! If they do then they either have a damn good job, or they should be studying more anyway...

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent View Post
    And not everyone is being lazy if they are in a 'crappy job'. To put it bluntly, not all people have the ability to get much more than a minimum paid job, regardless of how hard they try.
    I don't buy that, anyone can be trained, get educated, put extra effort in to get promoted (eg) to McDonald's store manager. Human ability is under utilised by these people. Which is fine because of your next point:
    Quote Originally Posted by Agent View Post
    That and the economy needs the people at the lower end of the wage scale to survive in its current form.
    As demoralizing as it may sound, without all those minimum wage workers (and believe me, I've been there) in retail jobs / maccy D's etc. it would fall apart.
    I agree, if everyone was a millionaire, who would clean the streets? Illegal immigrants?
    But still, if I was in that earnings group, I would work hard, retrain and do whatever to move up... the people who don't (the majority) would be stuck in those jobs... if everyone retrained then there would be problems... but that's not likely to happen

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