The person behind the group was just on BBC Breakfast. He spoke of a phone call he recieved from Cowell :-| a nice little conversation, where he got congratulated.
The person behind the group was just on BBC Breakfast. He spoke of a phone call he recieved from Cowell :-| a nice little conversation, where he got congratulated.
Last edited by kalniel; 21-12-2009 at 12:24 PM.
SyCo is Cowell's label. SyCo is a wholly owned subsidiary of Sony Music UK. Sony Music UK are a wholly owned subsidiary of Sony Music Entertainment.
Epic Records are also a wholly owned subsidiary of Sony Music Entertainment, but are NOT related to SyCo in any way other than through corporate ownership.
Similarly, Ben & Jerrys and Flora are not the same thing, despite both being wholly owned by Unilever - and sales of ice cream don't help the marge company's execs.
Now, if is a shareholder in SME, that's another matter - but, equally, Tom Morello could be a shareholder in SME and make money from Joe's sales. That's how shares work. Cowell makes no DIRECT money from RATM sales - at best he can make money selling SME shares or via shareholder windfalls.
Simon Cowell is a businessman. I am sure he will be happy making money directly or indirectly as long as he makes money. It just depends whether you want to be a contributor by, say, buying Joe or RATM's single.
The statement against the business manipulation of music should have been made differently.
Having said that, I see nothing wrong in the X-Factor as an entertainment programme and the opportunity it gives to ordinary people although my choice of music is different. I also see nothing wrong with Simon Cowell's entrepreneurial success. Our economy needs successful people.
Me either, in theory. Talent and variety shows have been part of Saturday night television since 1862 they're never going anywhere BUT in the last four or five years they've taken over T.V because it's big ratings and easy money. Not only has this negatively affected the music industry but T.V as well, you try turning on ITV or BBC1 over the weekend now, if it's not a show that revolves around people voting for people without enough talent to be famous on their own merits it will be in about an hour.
As straight up entertainment I have no problem with the concept but these shows now dominate the radio as despite the fact there's only one finalist there's always two or three more singles from the loosers, the T.V as I mentioned and the newspapers when they're on.....which is all the time and in my opinion it's about time Rome fell.
Our economy needs something, but it ain't Cowell
He's made a living attatching himself to the vaguely talented, nothing more. Take little Joe wahtever his name is. He'll have what looks on the surface to be a tasty deal with SyCo a "£1million deal" in reality he nets about £150k of that, the rest goes on marketing, recording an album etc. etc. If his album fails to make that money back which given the nature of these flash in the pan one hit wonders isn't a stretch when you think about it he owes SyCo. If it is successful and he sells his quota and more he won't make much either, the terms of the deal won't allow him to, if he was writing his own songs he might, MIGHT make some money but there'll be no mansions for the kid. Look at all the notable boy bands from the 90's there aren't many of them that are actually well off from it, they get by sure but they don't live easy at all, that's why they're all busy turning on christmas lights advertising Morrisons and opening multistorey car parks, they didn't make the money and they never do, people like Cowell take it all.
That's what Cowell and others like him specialise in, picking out a marketable face preferably one with a sob story behind it, give them some singing lessons so they can fudge through a live performance and pay someone to write them a few songs generic and catchy enough to sell. Often they're left in crippling debt and with no career to speak of while Cowell swans off to his next cash cow.
The whole industry seems to make money part from the artists themselves, I read something recently on how band could make millions for the Record co but still 'owe' them money due to the tiny-tiny-tiny % of money the artists actually get from each sales, it's disgusting.
This has been the way for many years - I know of one group who where selling a huge number of records, but at the time their records where topping the charts - had to go cap-in-hand for minimal expenses from their record company.
Most of their profits got swallowed up with promotions and videos before they saw it.
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Millions of people like it Knox (and don't give me all that "they're brainwashed" stuff) which makes yours and my musical preference niche. If SC had a metal-factor show you would be wetting yourself with glee and auditioning.
Ah, I see, all you're concerned about is the money. You see music as a career choice in which you expect your fair share of the proceeds. Sorry, not having a go, but if we concerned ourselves less with the moguls, real music may find its way. Make your music Knox and forget the mainstream.
Given Joes fans calling the campaigners 'homophobic' (interested to know how as Joe has said he isn't gay....it's just his music sucks balls) there needs to be a gay element next year
Queen
Judas Priest
Village People?
Shows then it's the fight to make the charts interesting, not objecting to some short arsed Sanddancer that is perpetually smiling
Nope, I wouldn't, it's been tried before for a start (more than once) and I wasn't excited about it then, plus band I'm in currently doesn't play metal. As for the shows, they're formulaic and easy to watch that's why people get hooked on it them, if you ask people why they watch it half the time the answer is "well everyone else is talking about it" it's plain and simple low quality disposable entertainment nothing more and to try and argue otherwise would be plain ignorant. People buy Newspapers like The Sun in droves does that make it credible? No, of course not, but it's easy to digest entertainment, it doesn't require you to think so it sells.
While I do indeed see music as a career choice but I know full well that -Ah, I see, all you're concerned about is the money. You see music as a career choice in which you expect your fair share of the proceeds. Sorry, not having a go, but if we concerned ourselves less with the moguls, real music may find its way. Make your music Knox and forget the mainstream.
a) Should I become a musician I'll never see a fair share of the proceeds and yes I do think I or any other real artist should be entitled to more, we put the effort in, we pour heart, soul, blood, sweat and tears into our music why shouldn't we be entitled to more.
and
b) I'd never be in a band considered part of the mainstream so the usual rules don't really apply.
Regardless of that you seem to have misunderstood the intentions of my previous post, it has nothing to do with me and what I'd want from a career in music. I'm just making the point that Cowell and people like him aren't talented, they aren't entrepeneurs, they're bloodsucking, shallow, corporate shills that feed off other artists (and I use the term artists loosely in this case) and move on to next weeks big thing. It's because people like that have the money to pour back into promoting their next karaoke act that music's in the state it's in. One one hit wonder breeds another and another and another and we don't need that. I go to local bars and clubs and I see local music dying on it's arse and it saddens me. There are bands/acoustic artists/singer songwriters that play dive bars every day with more talent in their little fingers than the acts that are marketed to us but the moneys not there for people like Cowell, these people write their own music, have their own style and image and aren't easily controlled and packaged so the music industry just passes them by.
Last edited by Knoxville; 21-12-2009 at 09:54 PM.
I saw on the BBC the guy last year tried to get Ricky Astley to number one last year. I think RAtM is a great choice, I feel perhaps Christian Death has more to offer for a Christmas message!
Again, all I'm reading is money. The great blues singers played their music because their soul demanded it and, oh, they produced beautiful music. Did they care how much they would make from their talent? Or did they just care that their music reached inside others often at difficult times?
You can't buy that kind of talent because it isn't for sale.
To be honest, your the one that keeps mentioning the money, Knoxville has given his reasons and an explanation which was clear (to me anyway), you just seem to have chosen not to take note of what he has said and then reply with the same old line, "money", I know people in bands/ that have been in bands that split up because they weren't the "norm" and didnt conform to stereotypes and such, so decided to stop playing as they didnt get enjoyment out of playing the same old, tired, small crowds.
Do I like X-Factor? No
Did I watch it? Yes
Why? Because it was on?
Did I like it? Nope
Why? Because it was the same old crap as all previous shows. Bunch of wanna be's that claim it has been there "Life long dream to be on X-Factor", im sure that "Life long dream" only came about..oh say four years ago.
It's pathetic to be honest, some people just dont have the want nor care to achieve something themselves, so they use a T.V show to do it. Get off your backside, go out there and work for want you want, then maybe I would have some respect.
Before anyone says anything, yes they worked hard when they were on the X-Factor, to get through a few months, to win a T.V show and get a recording deal. They had to do no leg work, at all, to get themselves known, its bone-idle lazyness.
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