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Thread: The privatization of justice

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    The privatization of justice

    http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2...t-behind-bars/

    Blown away by this. I had no idea about private prosecutions.

    In the United States, public prosecutors generally have the power to decide when criminal prosecution is appropriate. Eleanor Lackman, a copyright attorney at the New York firm of Cowan DeBaets, Abrahams, and Sheppard, told Ars that "criminal liability generally is only prosecuted by government entities" such as the Department of Justice. A private party can request a copyright prosecution—as in the Megaupload case—but the final decision rests with the government.

    United Kingdom law differs. There, private parties can initiate criminal prosecutions if they're willing to cover the costs out of their own pockets. FACT was, and so it bypassed CPS and brought criminal charges against Vickerman directly. "It is now our intention to run a private prosecution," FACT's Colin Tansley wrote in an e-mail to his colleagues on December 12, 2008.
    Quote Originally Posted by Saracen View Post
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    Re: The privatization of justice

    Yes, one area where The State has not tsken powers from an individual.

    This quote (taken from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_prosecution)

    gives a synopsis...

    United Kingdom

    Private prosecutions are permitted in the United Kingdom. They are governed by different rules in the different jurisdictions.
    [edit]England and Wales
    In the early history of England, the victim of a crime and his family had the right to hire a private attorney to prosecute criminal charges against the person alleged to have injured the victim.[4] In the 18th century, prosecution of almost all criminal offences was private, usually by the victim.[5]
    In England and Wales, the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) is the primary prosecuting authority with a discretionary power to take over any private prosecution.[6] The CPS must apply a two part test of sufficiency of evidence and public interest before making a decision to take it over for the public good or leave it as a private prosecution.
    The CPS can also prevent a private prosecution from continuing by taking it over and then discontinuing it. The CPS will do this only where there is not enough evidence to make a proper case or where a prosecution is against the public interest or where a prosecution could cause an injustice. In reaching this decision, it must balance the public good against a duty to preserve an individual's right to prosecute under the Prosecution of Offences Act 1985.
    When taking over any private prosecution, the CPS may direct the police to conduct more investigation. The intention of this was to ensure the best available evidence was placed before the court, as further trials were generally excluded by the double jeopardy rule. The latter rule was abrogated in certain circumstances of "new and compelling evidence", and for a limited range of the most serious offences such as rape, armed robbery and murder, by the Criminal Justice Act 2003.
    I would think it originally stems from an age before organised law enforcement agencies. An indvidual or organisation that had been a victim of crime could bring the case before a court.

    Regardless of how a case is brought, the burden of proof remains the same (beyond all reasonable doubt) that the accused has actually committed the alleged crime.
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    Re: The privatization of justice

    Sorry but what are people blown away about?

    In civil matters you don't generally have to hold the same level of proof as for a criminal conviction. So allowing an organisation to provide garantur is probably quite a good idea.

    Previously the only few times I've need to take someone to caught, including one that I thought was criminal (the CPS did not!) I only had civil as an option.

    I don't see how this is bad, except for the little person that wants to take someone to court for a criminal matter.

    It is still much easier to pursue a civil case, cheaper and less risky.
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    Re: The privatization of justice

    The issue is a bit different here, though, Animus. It's not about civil action, which long has been an option here, and the US are probably world masters at civil litigation. The issue is about private criminal prosecutions. There, you would be up against the standard "beyond reasonable doubt" burden of proof, not the much lighter "balance of probability" of civil cases.

    But I still don't see the problem, other than that you need to be willing to devote quite a lot of money to it, and most individuals could not.

    But the state can decide not to prosecute either because it feels it;s not in the public interest, or because it doesn't feel it has a reasonable prospect of conviction. As a private citizen, and a victim, why should I not be able to say "the hell with that, I'll do it myself". I've been victimised, and just because the state doesn't think it can win doesn't mean it cannot be won.

    And companies,. and many organisations, are legal "persons" with most of the same rights ..... and liabilities, as flesh and blood ones. They can be sued, and prosecuted, so they can sue, and prosecute.

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    Re: The privatization of justice

    Quote Originally Posted by Saracen View Post
    And companies,. and many organisations, are legal "persons" with most of the same rights ..... and liabilities, as flesh and blood ones. They can be sued, and prosecuted, so they can sue, and prosecute.
    What's it they say, I'll believe a corporation is a person when Texas executes one?
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    Re: The privatization of justice

    Quote Originally Posted by TheAnimus View Post
    I don't see how this is bad, except for the little person that wants to take someone to court for a criminal matter.
    Quote Originally Posted by Saracen View Post
    The issue is a bit different here, though, Animus. It's not about civil action, which long has been an option here, and the US are probably world masters at civil litigation. The issue is about private criminal prosecutions. There, you would be up against the standard "beyond reasonable doubt" burden of proof, not the much lighter "balance of probability" of civil cases.

    But I still don't see the problem....
    Oh please don't get me wrong guys, It's purely a "I didn't know that" post. Considering I've only just been reading up on them, I don't really know enough to consider them a good or bad thing (hence the post).
    Quote Originally Posted by Saracen View Post
    And by trying to force me to like small pants, they've alienated me.

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    Re: The privatization of justice

    Quote Originally Posted by aidanjt View Post
    What's it they say, I'll believe a corporation is a person when Texas executes one?
    Not sure in Ireland but definitely in the UK they have much of the same rights as human beings.
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    Re: The privatization of justice

    Quote Originally Posted by pctech2012 View Post
    Not sure in Ireland but definitely in the UK they have much of the same rights as human beings.
    Actually they have greater and even more strongly protected rights, despite not being human. That's part of the point.
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    Re: The privatization of justice

    New one on me, I must admit. I dislike FACT, mainly for their incredibly irritating adverts against piracy on legitimate DVDs which you've just paid good money for, as discussed here ad nauseam. But at the end of the day you shouldn't pirate other people's intellectual property, and if they catch you doing it in such a way that they can prove it beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law, then good luck to them.

    I was under the vague impression that FACT could conduct raids on premises under their own steam, but Googling it I could find no evidence of this. However I did find this Register story. What I thought was extraordinary (and not in a good way) was this:

    Quote Originally Posted by The Register
    According to the man, the seized items have been handed by police to FACT for computer forensics investigation.
    Alright, so only hearsay from the accused- but if true, that's very disturbing....police raid a premises at the request of a private organisation- and then hand over the evidence taken in the raid to that same organisation?!?!

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    Re: The privatization of justice

    Quote Originally Posted by pctech2012 View Post
    Not sure in Ireland but definitely in the UK they have much of the same rights as human beings.
    Rights and obligations.

    Essentially an incorporated company in the UK is a legal entity, subject to civil and criminal law, and specific rights and obligations defined by company law, specifically the Companies Acts.

    The most important right is the ability to enter into a contract, which is enacted by the signature of an authorised officer of the company. The company can be sued for breach of contract, or can itself sue the other party.

    The company is required to file annual accounts with Companies House.. The Directors any other officers of the company are also subject to company law, and may be liable to prosecution, independently of the company. For example, failure to render the annual return (separate from the accounts) is a criminal offence.
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