1400 girls sexually abused in Rotherham

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-s...shire-28939089

And, once again it's gangs of Pakistani muslims.
I remember reading another news article several months ago about how gangs of Pakistani muslims were loading English girls with drugs and booze and raping them in turns.

As a human being and more importantly as a muslim, I find this atrocious. Do the Pakistani parents not bring up their kids properly ? If you can't parent your kids the right way, then you should not be having kids!

These gang members should be hunted down and executed. Even lashing them will not suffice

I do feel sorry for the police on this ssue. They're getting crucified in the press for crimes committed by closed communities where they have to tread very very sensitively (Guardian at the forefront of illogic on this as usual).

What do we want - police allowed to do their job even if upsets the ethnics, or child abuse to continue?

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Originally Posted by wasabi

What do we want - police allowed to do their job even if upsets the ethnics, or child abuse to continue?

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We want Police to do as it is fit. If you come to the UK, you cannot bring your non-UK way of doing things e.g. honour killings and FGM issues.

Part of the problem (in the past) was that neither the police nor Social Services DID do their job and either ignored reports, or worse, stigmatised the victims.

No. They dare not do their job for fear of losing it. Good article on Forbes who identify the problem exactly.
Here.

What does the NSPCC have to say about this ?

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Originally Posted by peterb

Part of the problem (in the past) was that neither the police nor Social Services DID do their job and either ignored reports, or worse, stigmatised the victims.

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That.

And from what I can see, a large part of the problem.

Trouble is, there are those that, as soon as the police poke their nose in, play the race card. And authorities, including police but by no means limited to them, were intimidated by that.

Justice should be race blind (and gender, religion, sexual preference, etc, blind too). You should not be targeted because you're of a particular ethnicity, but you should not be immune from investigation because of it either. Race, and those other factors, should play NO part in the decision either to investigate, or not, to arrest or not, to prosecute or not.

Oh, and for clarity, I'm NOT talking about not acting on specific information. If police are told there's a robbery suspect, 6'2 tall, male, Asian, with white jeans and a red and yellow striped shirt, then him being black is part of that and comes into the decision to stop, question and probably detain. But what you don't do is stop a black guy JUST because he's a black guy.

Anyway, back to Rotherham .... the truly disgraceful thing is that it looks like action wasn't taken because of "don't rock the multicultural boat" fears. Cobblers to that. Allegations need to be taken seriously, investigated properly, and that done regardless of the race, background, ethnicity or religion of either the complainant, or the accused. Nothing short of that sort of judicial blindness is ever going to help settle racial issues. If you pick on minorities because of, say, race, you will pee them off, big time. If you give them a free pass on things like this because of race, you will pee off everybody else, big time. Justice, in this sense at least, MUST be blind.

Another great example of this country being a complete push over.

The only people they'd happily upset is Britons, in fear of "racism" and upsetting outsiders and people with different backgrounds in the UK.

It angers me to the bone. Get over it, no it isn't racism its called a crime and they deserve justice. This is the UK, and if you abide by your own laws and rules, or non-UK way of thinking then you really shouldn't be here.

Without trying to go into different areas, you can feel this "inside fear" across the UK. We all are bleeding scared of everything in case it "upsets" someone.


One big push over this country is. Let's see what happens if we go to different countries and go against their background, religion, laws etc. Yeah, be a bit more strict than us I bet.

Well there were a large variety of reasons why action wasn't taken - fear of rocking the race boat was one, but so was not believing the victims, not understanding the nature of CSE and thinking that there can be some kind of consent, blaming parents, chaotic handling of cases, pressure to work on other crimes where targets had been set, absence of adequate 'lessons learned' reviews, and so on.

The report is available to download, the failings are shocking. But it's clear it's not just fear of being accused of racism - on my reading it's not even the main problem (misunderstanding the nature of CSE was).

I think this country is coming to crisis point. As some have pointed out, it's working class children who were targeted, and then ignored by the police. This has been going on for decades, and is widespread. Often the children, and young women were; threatened into keeping quiet, didn't tell because of shame, or we're treated like they were the trouble makers. Someone needs to stand up and tell the truth, stop pandering to political ideologies, that have consequences they can't predict, or control.

The same Rotherham Council took adopted children of a couple because they were members of UKIP they later apologised all whilst 1400 children were subject to horrific abuse.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/poli...P-members.html

The saddest thing is that this probably isn't an issue that is just confined to Rotherham. I wouldn't be surprised if there are other parts of the UK or the world that have grappled with something similar.

The problem is that many of these countries are too politically correct. By all means, don't discriminate based on their race or religion, but at the same time, you should be able to call out a crime for the evil injustice it is without instantly being labeled as a "racist" or an "Islamophobe" or something else that is overused.

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Originally Posted by Tschebyshev

The saddest thing is that this probably isn't an issue that is just confined to Rotherham. I wouldn't be surprised if there are other parts of the UK or the world that have grappled with something similar.

The problem is that many of these countries are too politically correct. By all means, don't discriminate based on their race or religion, but at the same time, you should be able to call out a crime for the evil injustice it is without instantly being labeled as a "racist" or an "Islamophobe" or something else that is overused.

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Jack Straw mentioned the problem a few years ago, regarding Blackburn http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-12142177

Shot down by Keith Vaz. "Why didn't Jack Straw say something about this (before)? He has represented Blackburn for 31 years, he's been the home secretary."

Maybe because he will be branded racist?

Yet recorded cases of abuse in:
Derby
http://www.derbyscb.org.uk/docs/BD09...iveSummary.pdf
Oxford
http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/latest_ne...oitation_case/
Rochdale
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...-police-errors
Telford
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telford_sex_gang
Peterborough
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...shire-25659042

and now Rotherham.

It's a problem of institutions and networks. BBC, Catholic Church & the Pakistani Muslim community. Not everyone in the BBC was a paedo, same with the Church and the Pakistani Muslim community.

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Originally Posted by Tschebyshev

The problem is that many of these countries are too politically correct.

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Read the report. That was far from the only problem.

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Originally Posted by kalniel

Read the report. That was far from the only problem.

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Indeed. It wasn't the only factor. It does appear, however, to have been a very significant one, as clear from not just the report (have read it, or most of it, though not every dot and comma in the 160-ish pages), but from some of the stuff that's come out since.

Bear in mind the report wasn't a judicial (like Leveson) inquiry with statutory powers over witnesses, and other than those witnesses still having a duty to cooperate by virtue of current employment obligations, cannot compel all witnesses to attend, let alone testify. It appears to be pretty thorough, and certainly blew the lid off the situation, but isn't the be-all and end-all analysis of everything that happened, why, and by whom.

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Originally Posted by kalniel

Read the report. That was far from the only problem.

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Would these crimes have happened if the police had been allowed to do their job without tiptoeing around sensitivites on pain of demotion?

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Originally Posted by wasabi

Would these crimes have happened if the police had been allowed to do their job without tiptoeing around sensitivites on pain of demotion?

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Who can say, but I think at least some of them would. There were a number of failings before it even got to the police so improving their response on that one factor couldn't have affected those, however one would hope that further harm would have been reduced if the police had acted better.

Food for thought, a Police force should have a few police officers from an ethnic community in the area it regulates.

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Originally Posted by OilSheikh

Food for thought, a Police force should have a few police officers from an ethnic community in the area it regulates.

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I thought they were British?

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Originally Posted by wasabi

I thought they were British?

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British per se is not an ethnicity.

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Originally Posted by wasabi

I thought they were British?

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I meant , in this case, British Pakistani police officers

This becomes scary how those people felt they can get away with everything only because their race is different. People of different races should be taken equally, this makes you feel so unsafe. If a Pakistani guy will harm me I can be also sued for racial intolerance now? In Britain this is not the first case, there were also Muslim guys who were abusing women on streets if their clothes wasn't according their religion.

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Originally Posted by OilSheikh

I meant , in this case, British Pakistani police officers

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So the police are meant to not differentiate between people based on ethnicity except when they differentiate between people based on ethnicity? Mmm'kay?

I think it is plain stupid to try and analyse this situation. Trying to justify certain crimes in regards to their ethnicity, religion, whatever. Same for other bleeding areas.

I highly doubt they would of been so sensitive if the description was "someone in a hoody acting like a "gangster"". No, I bet that stereotype would of been taken with ease.

The fact that remains is that it is a crime, and if someone wants to "rebel" because they feel they've been picked out for racism then that is their problem. If they protest due to their religion and believing that is the cause of their sentence well they need to get a grip and stop using these as excuses.


And for the record, our country, culture, religion, basically way of life differs from some so there is naturally going to be some clashes. I don't understand why as a country we feel we need to take a step back and be kind as to not "offend" others. We can't bend law, as essentially we are making things "nice" for others.

Yes have a lovely home but because we class you as "not one of us" we shall let you do as you please because you're not happy with something, or you think what you are doing is right, or be light with your sentences. Complete push over and a complete wash of police time and money. Police spend a stupid amount of money only to give silly sentences. Jeeze get a grip, it doesn't matter if they are black, white, they can be bleeding orange purple blue, the law should still apply.


Also another issue is religious beliefs and what they follow, i.e. as mentioned above, clothing (I can't comment completely on it). Well the issue straight away is simple: A country primarily Christian. You are always going to get an individual on both sides conflicting and not living in peace, which is an issue.
You can't overlap faiths onto an individual who has different faith than yourself, as it is morally wrong. Yet it happens. Some on the extreme ends are open, physically or verbally.

When in Rome, do as the Romans do. Else, don't go to Rome :rockon:

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Originally Posted by wasabi

So the police are meant to not differentiate between people based on ethnicity except when they differentiate between people based on ethnicity? Mmm'kay?

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What he means is that there should be British-Pakistanis on a force that polices a predominately British-Pakistani community. If its a white-dominated police, then people who are arrested, whether guilty or not, could use the excuse that they were unfairly targeted because of their race. Their inclusion in the force allows the police to better connect with the community.

A recent example of this is the race riots in Ferguson, Ohio. It was a case of a black community against a white police force. How did they try to ease tensions? They brought in Ron Johnson, an African-American patrolman, to oversee security.

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When in Rome, do as the Romans do. Else, don't go to Rome

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I personally would find it disrespectful to go over to another country and not try to fit in.

Hell I even feel bad that I am not good at Spanish when I visit Spain, I feel like a right ignorant Brit :P

I'm not totally up to speed with all the reports, etc. I find alot of the news distressing. Isn't this whole nightmare, a result of Labour policy. I saw they were making senior figures, resign from LP. And then getting all self righteous about the abuse(Yvette Cooper). It's obvious, they need to sack all those officials involved(council,police,social services,etc), Arrest all the Pakistani men, and give them harsh sentences. Then carry out the same policy across the country. They need to help all the victims, counseling, and serious compensation(paid by LP)! We need to get back power from EU, and deport anyone who doesn't conform to our laws. Make the Human Rights Act fair! I think multiculturalism is supposed to be about learning from other cultures, and enhancing our own. This, and what is happening with IS, and other Islamic revolutionaries, doesn't seem to fit into that!

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Originally Posted by Tschebyshev

What he means is that there should be British-Pakistanis on a force that polices a predominately British-Pakistani community. If its a white-dominated police, then people who are arrested, whether guilty or not, could use the excuse that they were unfairly targeted because of their race. Their inclusion in the force allows the police to better connect with the community.

A recent example of this is the race riots in Ferguson, Ohio. It was a case of a black community against a white police force. How did they try to ease tensions? They brought in Ron Johnson, an African-American patrolman, to oversee security.

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Being devil's advocate.

Committing violent race-motivated crimes against vulnerable women and children? Police's fault for not being ethnic enough.

Mention ethnicity when talking about immigration policy, get slammed for being a racist Nazi because everyone in Britain is indistinguishably British.

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Originally Posted by OilSheikh

When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

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You mean begin a military campaign to invade other countries and impose your own culture on them? ;)

right on my doorstep in Bucks

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...herts-29054064

:( Most of them are in their 30's . You would think they would have some brains at that age.

I sometimes wonder what the response would be if this scenario were reversed. Pakistani children, and the children of middle class councillors, police chiefs, etc, were harassed on the street, lured into cars, drugged, kept captive, and gang raped. The fact that it's been going on for decades, says to me; it's a deep seated cultural problem(Pakistani women need to speak out!), the predators know they can get away with it(the 'race card'), they specifically target vulnerable children, and young women, who are naive, and probably don't have anyone to protect, or believe in them. And as very few of the predators have ever been arrested, or served meaningful sentences, indicates to them, that they'll get away with it, because as a nation we're too stupid to protect our children.

Audio interview of a Rotherham girl.

'Raped once a week'.

Looks like the news has made it across the pond. An American author, Dennis Prager, wrote this article - "1400 English Girls Raped by Multiculturalism" Bit political, but it does press down on the question about political correctness. If that atmosphere hadn't been prevalent, would this have happened?

Don't know if you guys have seen Channel 4's documentary "Pakistans Hidden Shame" but it certainly opened my eyes, I wasnt aware of how big a problem the Pakistani community had with child sexual abuse, it's still up on 4oD, worth a watch.