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Thread: Car Insurance

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    Car Insurance

    If you're fully comp on your own vehicle can you drive someone else's car to work even if you're not a named driver on their policy and their policy is only social and domestic purposes.

    What if you were a named driver but still used it to get to work in an emergency. Would this be allowed...

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    Re: Car Insurance

    I think you are hoping for a bit much. It's best to get everything in writing and check the details. Although I'm sure you can get special policies, but is yours one of those.

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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by pp05 View Post
    If you're fully comp on your own vehicle can you drive someone else's car to work even if you're not a named driver on their policy and their policy is only social and domestic purposes.
    It depends on your policy. Where it is allowed, you may only be covered to the minimum legal requirement, so not comprehensive.

    Commuting to work does not normally count as business use, unless you use the car in the course of your employer's business (for example travelling to a different site where yoir emploer pays you a mileage allowance.

    It would be advisable to get the owner's permission in writing. But check with your insurer.

    Quote Originally Posted by pp05 View Post
    What if you were a named driver but still used it to get to work in an emergency. Would this be allowed...
    Travelling to a fixed place of work (commuting) is not normally business travel (unless your employer pays you a mileage allowance). Travelling on your employers business (another site, carrying goods etc where he pays a mileage allowance) is business travel. You would be on dodgy grounds depending on the emergency. But it would be have to be a good reason - if it was that serious, could you have used a taxi? Check with your insurer.

    Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer - this is my opinion based on my experiences as an employee and car owner over a number of years. So CHECK WITH YOUR INSURANCE COMPANY.

    Insurance contracts are basaed on ultimate good faith so Check with your Insurance Company and disclose any material facts that might affect their acceptance of the risk.


    Oh, and did I mention Checking With Your Insurance Company?
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    Re: Car Insurance

    Check your policy, but I believe you can although it isn't necessarily there by default for fully comp. You are normally covered third party on another car if that is insured by the owner. Also, I think insurance companies are fine for using a vehicle to commute to one place of work without any special declarations. But again, see what your policy states.

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    Re: Car Insurance

    As others have said, it is absolutely essential to either check YOUR policy, or with your insurer. Or, ideally, both.

    Historically, by which I mean when I started driving, this was something that was standard on pretty much every policy. So much so that we took it for granted.

    But, about 15 years ago, I friend pointed out it no longer was. I thought "Yeah, yeah" and dug my policy out ... to find he was right - it had quietly vanished.

    So now, boring as hell though it is, I read my policy document CAREFULLY when it arrives, both with a view to what it does cover, but also critically, what it doesn't, and never assume anything. If you do have cover, it'll almost certainly be "3rd party only" which, as others said, is the legal mandatory minimum, so if you do drive a friend's car and have an accident, your friend's car isn't covered.

    Don't mess with this. If your policy doesn't cover cars owned by 3rd party (not rented, hired, etc) AND you aren't named on his policy, then you'll be driving uninsured. Get caught foing that snd not only do you get prosecuted but the police WILL seize the car. You can get it back when sonrone with vslid insurance claims it but it'll fost you domething like £150 recovery fee, and £20/day storage charges - and probably a wince-inducing rise in your premiums for several years.
    Noli nothis permittere te terere.


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    Re: Car Insurance

    My friend is fully comp on his own car which includes commuting to fixed place of work. He is also named driver on his brother's policy. Brother's policy is social and domestic only.

    He was returning from work yesterday evening when a car hit him from behind at roundabout - no damage whatsoever. However what got his goat was the other driver refused to give him his address. Just name and phone number and that he would pay for any damage.

    He phoned his own insurer first to report incident who told him since he is named driver on his brothers policy he should report the incident to them. He is not making a claim, just letting them know for information purposes. But I think he is concerned that his brothers policy is S&D only and if that would work against him.

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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by pp05 View Post
    He phoned his own insurer first to report incident who told him since he is named driver on his brothers policy he should report the incident to them. He is not making a claim, just letting them know for information purposes. But I think he is concerned that his brothers policy is S&D only and if that would work against him.
    So he was driving his brother's car??? I'm not clear on that.

    IANAL but...

    It sounds like he was using the car within the insurance terms, so I would say if there is any grief then get a better insurer.

    There is a good chance that the brother's insurance will go up at next renewal on the basis that being in an accident makes you statistically more likely to be in another one. Shop around, some insurers ignore such things.

    However, I don't think "in an emergency" is part of the discussion. Either you are covered by insurance or you aren't. As others have said, it is in the insurance documents which have to be read thanks to the race to the bottom on premiums taking cover levels with it. Personally, I never end up with the cheapest quote, there is always something there that puts me off in the small print.
    Last edited by DanceswithUnix; 16-06-2018 at 09:23 AM.

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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by pp05 View Post
    My friend is fully comp on his own car which includes commuting to fixed place of work. He is also named driver on his brother's policy. Brother's policy is social and domestic only.

    He was returning from work yesterday evening when a car hit him from behind at roundabout - no damage whatsoever. However what got his goat was the other driver refused to give him his address. Just name and phone number and that he would pay for any damage.

    He phoned his own insurer first to report incident who told him since he is named driver on his brothers policy he should report the incident to them. He is not making a claim, just letting them know for information purposes. But I think he is concerned that his brothers policy is S&D only and if that would work against him.
    A bit tricky, that (as I understand it, and of course, IANAL).

    If there has bern an accident, you are REQUIRED, by law, to exchange details. Failing to do so is an offence. That includes name, address and car reg, at a minimum.

    However, caveat 1 = if there is no damage at all .... has there (legally) been an accident? If there is damage to either car, or to third-party property (like a parked car, a wall, lamppost, whatever), or injury to anybody in either car, or third-party (pedestrian, maybe) or animals, then there has. But if, as described, there's no injury to anybody, no damage however minor to either car, or to any third party property, then there hasb't been, so no need to exchange details.

    In theory.

    In practice, I personally would insist on the minimum details I mentioned above, and in the event they weren't forthcoming, I woukd report the incident/accident to the police as soon as possible and in any event, within 24 hours.

    Why? Because there might have been damage or injuries not apparent at the time and if you gaven't met the legal minimums at the scene, and the party subsequently report and you haven't, prosecutions may follow even if the other party was at fault.

    That bit is NOT theoretical. It happened to a friend of mine.

    Minor accident, damage limited to a coupke of scratches and the lady driver of the other car said hers already had scratches. It was late at night, on a roundabout about 200 yards from a big petrol forecourt that was well lit. Both parties agreed to go directly to the petrol station and check for damage and exchange details.

    My mate went, waited half an hour, and she was a no-show. Do he went home, and forgot all about it until, 4 or 5 days later he noticed a policeman having a good look at his car. He went out, was asked about the accident, and told the above account which, by the way, was confirmed by the lady driver. She HAD agreed to meet, hadn't bothered to go, and was going to forget about it. When she got home, she told hubby who told her (quite correctly) to report it to police "just in case".

    In court, the lady explained all of the above, but that didn't stop my mate being found guilty of, IIRC, :-

    - failing to stop after and accident,
    - failing to exchange name and address, etc,
    - leaving the scene and failing to report accident.

    It cost him his licence, and put a huge loading on his insurance.

    So were it me, I'd get my tail down to the local station, or ring 101, and report it as "probasbly nothing, but just in case, as full details weren't exchanged".


    Is it legally required to give address at the scene? Yes. But, if I felt there was good reason not to do so, then I wouldn't BUT would then go directly to the police and report the incident.
    Noli nothis permittere te terere.


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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by pp05 View Post
    My friend is fully comp on his own car which includes commuting to fixed place of work. He is also named driver on his brother's policy. Brother's policy is social and domestic only.

    He was returning from work yesterday evening when a car hit him from behind at roundabout - no damage whatsoever. However what got his goat was the other driver refused to give him his address. Just name and phone number and that he would pay for any damage.

    He phoned his own insurer first to report incident who told him since he is named driver on his brothers policy he should report the incident to them. He is not making a claim, just letting them know for information purposes. But I think he is concerned that his brothers policy is S&D only and if that would work against him.
    -Never tell the insurance company that you were returning from work ( if you said that you only use the car for S & D ). They will straightaway invalidate your insurance and will not cover you for accident. Always lie to say that you were coming back from shopping at your local supermarket. Obviously, if you keep on having accidents during rush hour, you cannot keep up this lie.
    -Are you sure there's no damage to the bumper? No scruff marks ? No cracks? Examine with a torch or in daylight.
    -Driver doesn't have to give you his name or address. Take down his car reg, Mobile no, take photos and his License no. I once gave my name and address when I got hit from behind, on the advice of a 999 operator. The @!£$% came to my house and scratched my car at night.
    -If the guy has offered to pay for any damage, go this route. If he gave a dodgy phone no, then you have to resort to your insurance company.
    - Don't tell your insurance company if you manage to sort it amongst yourselves.They will make a note on the commonly held insurer's database and next year, you will find that you cannot get cheap rates anywhere. But, do report it online on your local Police force's website, just to protect yourself.
    -Keep this in mind... If the other party didn't have a dashcam in their car, then what proof is there that there was ever an accident ?

    The world is not black and white.. follow the book and you will be the one suffering.

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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by OilSheikh View Post
    -Driver doesn't have to give you his name or address.
    I was under the impression that the driver doesn't have to give their address too, but according to this, they do:

    https://www.which.co.uk/reviews/new-...a-car-accident

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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by MrJim View Post
    I was under the impression that the driver doesn't have to give their address too, but according to this, they do:

    https://www.which.co.uk/reviews/new-...a-car-accident
    Well, you do .... and don't.

    Section 170 Road Traffoc Act 1988 (as amended) requires that yiu do BUT also says if you don't for any reason, you MUST report the accident to police as soon as possible and IN AMY EVENT, within 24 hours.

    Oh, and the requirement to give details applies where 'any oerson with reasonable grounds to ask' asks you. That would include, but not be limited to, the other driver.

    If you don't give name and address plus other bits like car reg, and you don't report to police within 24 hours, you HAVE committed an offence.

    So, you do but kinda don't, provided you promptly report. Which is why I said earlier it was "tricky".
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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by OilSheikh View Post
    -Never tell the insurance company that you were returning from work ( if you said that you only use the car for S & D ). They will straightaway invalidate your insurance and will not cover you for accident. Always lie to say that you were coming back from shopping at your local supermarket. Obviously, if you keep on having accidents during rush hour, you cannot keep up this lie.
    -Are you sure there's no damage to the bumper? No scruff marks ? No cracks? Examine with a torch or in daylight.
    -Driver doesn't have to give you his name or address. Take down his car reg, Mobile no, take photos and his License no. I once gave my name and address when I got hit from behind, on the advice of a 999 operator. The @!£$% came to my house and scratched my car at night.
    -If the guy has offered to pay for any damage, go this route. If he gave a dodgy phone no, then you have to resort to your insurance company.
    - Don't tell your insurance company if you manage to sort it amongst yourselves.They will make a note on the commonly held insurer's database and next year, you will find that you cannot get cheap rates anywhere. But, do report it online on your local Police force's website, just to protect yourself.
    -Keep this in mind... If the other party didn't have a dashcam in their car, then what proof is there that there was ever an accident ?

    The world is not black and white.. follow the book and you will be the one suffering.
    Every SDP policy I've had (in 40+ years) HAS included to and ftom permanent, regular place of work. It doesn't include to/from client sites, other offices, customer's homes/offices, carrying commercial goods, etc. For that, you need business cover. But if you work in the same shop/office/factory/etc then getting to/from that place is almost certsinly covered. I've never yet seen one that doesn't.

    A few years ago, I semi-retired and got rid of the 'work' car that had business cover but still occasionally go out to clients, so had my SDP cover extended to include limited (1500 miles) of 'business' cover, though it's to/from client sites, not carrying commercial goods, etc.

    That extension cost me zero. A good broker is very useful. And, that stipulation IS stated, in writing, on the policy document. If I ever need to claim, I might have to justify business miles being occasional, and adding up to less than 1500/year, but I easily can.

    But in general, SDP includes to/from norjal, fixed place of work.

    I'd also disagree about lying to, or rven omitting telling insurance companies about accidents.

    Get caught doing that, either lying or even not telling them something you should, and that most definitely DOES put you at serious risk of invalidaging the insurance. Possibly a fraud prosecution, too.

    Insurance contracts are "uberimae fidei", or "utmost good faith". Premiums Re based on complicated risk assessment, and that assessment is based in large part on your answers to questions, and info you SHOULD supply. if you omit or deceive, and they find out, then the risk wasn't properly assessef, the premium doesn't reflect the risk and cancellation of policy is very likely. Which not only pretty much guarantees a heavy clobberong of subseauent premiums, but runs the risk of prosecution for driving without insurance and if that comes to light at the scene when police check your insurance (which it might) will also get your car seized unless you can very rapidly get alternate cover in place.

    It's up to you, of course, but IMHO, .ying to or deceiving by omission is a mug's game.

    I agree that insurance companies don't always act in a way that seems fair, but playing a loaded game is implicit in driving a car.
    Noli nothis permittere te terere.


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    Re: Car Insurance

    I added 3,000 miles of business use to my policy a while back, it cost about £40, which as a proportion of my premium is buttons. Committing insurance fraud to save a couple of quid is absolutely crackers. Just look at the guy who had his house burn down and cover voided because he misrepresented it. Losing your car because you thought you could get one over in the insurer and save yourself a tenner is just foolish.

    I've always played fair with my insurer and they have done the same back. It really feels like people who say they are out to get them are the same people who take the mick in the first place.

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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by Butcher View Post
    I added 3,000 miles of business use to my policy a while back
    Interesting, I didn't realise you could do that. One question though: how do you show your insurer that you haven't exceeded the allotted 3000 business miles?

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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by OilSheikh View Post
    -Never tell the insurance company that you were returning from work ( if you said that you only use the car for S & D ). They will straightaway invalidate your insurance and will not cover you for accident. Always lie to say that you were coming back from shopping at your local supermarket. Obviously, if you keep on having accidents during rush hour, you cannot keep up this lie.
    -Are you sure there's no damage to the bumper? No scruff marks ? No cracks? Examine with a torch or in daylight.
    -Driver doesn't have to give you his name or address. Take down his car reg, Mobile no, take photos and his License no. I once gave my name and address when I got hit from behind, on the advice of a 999 operator. The @!£$% came to my house and scratched my car at night.
    -If the guy has offered to pay for any damage, go this route. If he gave a dodgy phone no, then you have to resort to your insurance company.
    - Don't tell your insurance company if you manage to sort it amongst yourselves.They will make a note on the commonly held insurer's database and next year, you will find that you cannot get cheap rates anywhere. But, do report it online on your local Police force's website, just to protect yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by OilSheikh View Post
    -Keep this in mind... If the other party didn't have a dashcam in their car, then what proof is there that there was ever an accident ?
    Unless of course there are other witnesses...

    Quote Originally Posted by OilSheikh View Post
    The world is not black and white.. follow the book and you will be the one suffering.
    Keep THIS in mind - if you don't follow the book, or if you start lying by omission or commission to your insurance company, you are potentially storing up a whole load of grief, including having any claims refused, prosecution for insurance fraud, leading to a criminal record and the possibility that you will be uninsurable for a long period of time.

    It's a game only for the incredibly stupid.
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    Re: Car Insurance

    Quote Originally Posted by MrJim View Post
    Interesting, I didn't realise you could do that. One question though: how do you show your insurer that you haven't exceeded the allotted 3000 business miles?
    So far they haven't asked, but I would probably use my mileage expense claims to show business use.

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