Return to work opinions

[cheesemp]

So, I've been asked to return for work for the first time in over 3 months. To ensure social distancing we've got to sit with empty desks between us - This therefore means office capacity has been halved so we get to work from home every other week. We are expected to lug office chairs, monitors and PCs back and forth from home to work. We also need to wear masks at all time we are not at our desk. We've also been told there are zero options for work from home for childcare or our own desires. I've always viewed my firm as a good place to work, both fair and progressive (they are a tech firm after all) but this just seems utterly crazy. My Wife has been told she is unlikely to return to the office this year, so I'm just don't understand my firms' position.

Just wondered what other people (lucky enough to be unaffected job wise) where experiencing. Is my firm an outlier or is this standard? I'm disappointed as I've loved working from home and its really made me question my long term future at the firm (I've been there 14 years it's been so good in the past).

[ik9000]

same situation, but I'm lucky in that I have a home "desk" (literally an old worktop on two wooden pc stands rescused from the skip when we last moved office), and my home machine is good enough to remote in so I don't have to lug stuff back and forth beyond a few folders and basic stationery and a calculator (which is my own anyway). The chair is wearing out earlier than it should be but it's good enough for now. My main gripe is the travel expense but it will be nice to see people again. I am missing the team. We do however have the option to continue wfh for the near future while we try and figure out travel etc. I imagine that will change at some point. You always have the option of requesting permanent wfh and the company have to consider it - but they are within their rights to ask you to return to the office as it is your place of work as defined in your current contract. In the current crazy it's important to give everyone a bit of slack and try to work with your employers where possible. If you're shielding or such like then talk to them. If not, embrace the silliness and get on with it. It's all any of us can do. Masks are a PITA and I'm taking in my own towels and cutlery etc, but it's just what we're all going to have to do for a while. The childcare issue... well what do you usually do over a summer? If it's parents(grandparents) and they are unable to assist then I would talk to your boss and explain and see if you can do a few days in/wfh and a few days off with your partner doing similar on the other days to get you into September.

[cheesemp]

same situation, but I'm lucky in that I have a home "desk" (literally an old worktop on two wooden pc stands rescused from the skip when we last moved office), and my home machine is good enough to remote in so I don't have to lug stuff back and forth beyond a few folders and basic stationery and a calculator (which is my own anyway). The chair is wearing out earlier than it should be but it's good enough for now. My main gripe is the travel expense but it will be nice to see people again. I am missing the team.

That interesting. I guess its down to whether you like office working or not. I have a decent setup here (minus chair) - mechanical keyboard, decent mouse etc. I also have no real UK team anymore - I manage an outsource team in eastern Europe. It just feels like I am being asked to drive 30 minutes twice a day and lug equipment around for reasons? I think my firm is trying to push back on home working hard but that's just my guess...

[ik9000]

That interesting. I guess its down to whether you like office working or not. I have a decent setup here (minus chair) - mechanical keyboard, decent mouse etc. I also have no real UK team anymore - I manage an outsource team in eastern Europe. It just feels like I am being asked to drive 30 minutes twice a day and lug equipment around for reasons? I think my firm is trying to push back on home working hard but that's just my guess...

I would gently but firmly push the issue as in that situation it seems rather unnecessary to go in. Particularly with the stupidity of lugging stuff back and forth. Ask for their occupational health risk assessment for it as I'm willing to bet they haven't done one. It doesn't take a genius to see that there is an easy mitigation option (wfh).

[cheesemp]

I would gently but firmly push the issue as in that situation it seems rather unnecessary to go in. Particularly with the stupidity of lugging stuff back and forth. Ask for their occupational health risk assessment for it as I'm willing to bet they haven't done one. It doesn't take a genius to see that there is an easy mitigation option (wfh).

Interesting idea. I'm just surprised it has come to this to be honest - It's just not like my firm (at least locally). It may be driven from headquarters in the US (or at least I hope it has).

[half_empty_soul]

I work in security, we didn't stop to operate even for a second

[spacein_vader]

I would gently but firmly push the issue as in that situation it seems rather unnecessary to go in. Particularly with the stupidity of lugging stuff back and forth. Ask for their occupational health risk assessment for it as I'm willing to bet they haven't done one. It doesn't take a genius to see that there is an easy mitigation option (wfh).

This cuts both ways though, they should be getting you to complete a Display Screen Equipment assessment in line with HSE rules to ensure your home work environment is suitable.

As an office drone we've yet to be sent back into the office but it remains available to us for work that can't be done remotely. We've been told a return is likely to be slow, gradual and probably won't ever go back exactly how it was previously.

And that's within the NHS.

[philehidiot]

I took the opportunity, whilst it was empty, to burn my place of work to the ground.

EDIT: The government guidance is that you should work from home if at all possible. If you are clinically vulnerable then they should be working to enable this. If you can work from home sometimes but not others, they would really have to have a good reason why people have to come into the office. Seems like the worst of both worlds to me.

[kalniel]

its really made me question my long term future at the firm (I've been there 14 years it's been so good in the past).

I suspect that's the aim, rather than have half of the people in at once, it's just have half of the people...

Despite 'optics' from Boris, check the actual regulations and insist your company sticks to them.

[cheesemp]

I suspect that's the aim, rather than have half of the people in at once, it's just have half of the people...

Despite 'optics' from Boris, check the actual regulations and insist your company sticks to them.

I don't think that's the case. We're hiring hard. I'm lucky to work in software sector that doesn't tend to be hit by down turns that much and we've got more work to do than we have staff to do it. Its one of the reasons I've stayed. Job security with a young family is critical.

[ik9000]

start by talking - friendly chats and goodwill of line managers usually helps in these instances.

[Saracen999]

.... Job security with a young family is critical.

Yes it is, and with that in mind, be cautious about becoming too awkward, about being the one insisting on "sticking to rules". It shouldn't be used as a reason to target you but believe me, there's a very real risk it will be. He who sticks head above parapet gets shot at.

There's a judgement call to be had here. Obviously, don't stand for anything that puts you at serious risk, but be aware that squeaky wheels don't always get oiled: sometimes they just get replaced. It seems to me the next year or two, maybe more, are going to be a buyer's (employers) market.

Also, on lugging chairs, PCs etc back and forth, while yes, it's a right PITA, there is also logic behind it. Risk assessments require mitigating risk and not sharing chairs, monitors, etc, is one part of it. And benefits both sides. Also, if a desk/workstation area is being shared, it makes either nightly or between handover periods that much easier to deep clean what's left.

Also, government advice on "should work from home" is changing, at least in messaging. Last time I checked written guidelines, it still said that but be aware that BoJo has been suggesting returning to work where possible, rather than WFH where possible. My guess? Big office landlords are starting to get edgy about big employers (like banks, insurance companies and even gov't departments) cutting their office requirements significantly and permanently, having got a sniff of potentially massive economies to be had.

A radio chat a couple of weeks ago suggested that some people had serious productivity increases when working from home (like 20% and more) doing the same hours. On the other hand .... some people didn't.

Partly, it's environmental, like do you have a suitable, preferably separate, space? But psychology is a big factor too. Some people just aren't psychologically suited, and are too susceptible to the major distractions - bed, TV and fridge.

Also, I suggest caution in pushing the childcare angle. Yes, from your end of the telescope it's important. But consider the employer's view from their end of the telescope .... kids can be a bigger hit on productivity than bed, TV and fridge combined. If I were you, I'd stress the productivity gains end of it. Maybe track down that research I mentioned. And keep schtuum about childcare. It may well be very important to you, but I'd not mention that to the employer. It isn't, after all, what they're paying for.


On a much more general note, as someone that worked from home for, well, since about 1990 until (early) retirement, if my employer were expecting to save money on office space rents by getting people working from home permanently, I sure as hell would be looking at getting compensated for dedicating part of my home, even part-time, to WFH office space.

[cheesemp]

start by talking - friendly chats and goodwill of line managers usually helps in these instances.

Agreed - I have done. To be honest my manager seemed as surprised by the hardline pushed by HR as the rest of us. I know he'll do what he can.

Yes it is, and with that in mind, be cautious about becoming too awkward, about being the one insisting on "sticking to rules". It shouldn't be used as a reason to target you but believe me, there's a very real risk it will be. He who sticks head above parapet gets shot at.

There's a judgement call to be had here. Obviously, don't stand for anything that puts you at serious risk, but be aware that squeaky wheels don't always get oiled: sometimes they just get replaced. It seems to me the next year or two, maybe more, are going to be a buyer's (employers) market.

Also, on lugging chairs, PCs etc back and forth, while yes, it's a right PITA, there is also logic behind it. Risk assessments require mitigating risk and not sharing chairs, monitors, etc, is one part of it. And benefits both sides. Also, if a desk/workstation area is being shared, it makes either nightly or between handover periods that much easier to deep clean what's left.

Also, government advice on "should work from home" is changing, at least in messaging. Last time I checked written guidelines, it still said that but be aware that BoJo has been suggesting returning to work where possible, rather than WFH where possible. My guess? Big office landlords are starting to get edgy about big employers (like banks, insurance companies and even gov't departments) cutting their office requirements significantly and permanently, having got a sniff of potentially massive economies to be had.

A radio chat a couple of weeks ago suggested that some people had serious productivity increases when working from home (like 20% and more) doing the same hours. On the other hand .... some people didn't.

Partly, it's environmental, like do you have a suitable, preferably separate, space? But psychology is a big factor too. Some people just aren't psychologically suited, and are too susceptible to the major distractions - bed, TV and fridge.

Also, I suggest caution in pushing the childcare angle. Yes, from your end of the telescope it's important. But consider the employer's view from their end of the telescope .... kids can be a bigger hit on productivity than bed, TV and fridge combined. If I were you, I'd stress the productivity gains end of it. Maybe track down that research I mentioned. And keep schtuum about childcare. It may well be very important to you, but I'd not mention that to the employer. It isn't, after all, what they're paying for.


On a much more general note, as someone that worked from home for, well, since about 1990 until (early) retirement, if my employer were expecting to save money on office space rents by getting people working from home permanently, I sure as hell would be looking at getting compensated for dedicating part of my home, even part-time, to WFH office space.

Interesting thoughts Saracen999 - I guess I'm just one of those who just enjoys it and has found my productivity has risen (at least in my opinion) - problem is as someone who actively manages outsource teams while handling sales, support and resellers questions quiet randomly it's hard to prove... I'm also pretty new to a position and my functional boss is now not my day to day boss so hard for him to compare.

[Saracen999]

If you enjoy it, you're probably right, that it has.

It does suit some people, though has disadvantages. But some people loathe it, and others just aren't strong-willed enough to pull it off.

My motivation was self-interest. I was self-employed, and paid on result, not time. I goof off, I don't eat.

I had to be strong willed enough,p seeing as how I'm partial to eating.

One disadvantage is that it can be isolating, working on your own. My solution was that, yes, id did that, but it also involved quite a lot of international travel, and that caught me up. It just meant friends could be in Tottenham, Toronto or Tokyo.

[ik9000]

Saracen you are so right about the temptation of the fridge. Comfort eating and end of the day drams have kept me going but at a cost. I am having to ramp up the exercise regime to compensate and try and undo the bad work!!

[jimbouk]

Drop your pc, ketchup your toes and ask to see their risk assessment for moving PCs yourself. I know when I had to move offices just down the corridor in my last place someone turned up with a little trolly for the computer.