http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4853674.stm
It's about time torrent sites start to fight back.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4853674.stm
It's about time torrent sites start to fight back.
doubt they will win, they are in the wrong really and they know it - logically by hosting links to the copywrited files they are aiding in copywrite theft. If they only linked to legit torrents there would be no problem, or if they even attempted to implement such a system they would be ok.
Its not copyright theft. Its copyright infirngement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spud1
In the same way price fixing isn't stealing from consumers. Its abusing their position.
Personally, I think it won't be long before the site is shut down - they are just obviously trying to prolong it's lifespan just to generate further profits in that time.
I'm just glad I've been "pirate-free" for the past 2 years (used to be heavily into torrents etc)
well ok but either way it is still illegal :)Quote:
Originally Posted by badass
thing is if they just have a spider which crawls to locate torrents, then hows that wrong?
Google indexes all kinds of illegal content.
That's cool. Glad they didnt just bow under and close like so many sites have in the past.
Go Torrentspy.
The argument usually goes that even the sites that host the .torrent themselves arent actually hosting infringing material, merly a hash of it, And since the file never goes through their servers they should be exempt from comeback. Technically thats true, but when it comes to a middle aged judge who has no concept of the technology involved, it looks a lot like they are in fact infringing, when really they arent.
That's not really the argument. I think it's as stated before that the site is merely an indexing application, like any search engine.
Seems a bit unfair to me, its just a search engine after - if you type the name of a film and then torrent after it, google will pretty much do the same thing. Why dont they target the actual sites / ppl cracking / ripping the stuff in the first place instead?
Quote:
Originally Posted by poindextermatic
Because they are individuals, and it takes a lot more work to find out who they are than to shut down big sites that have big arrows pointing to the owners.
Ah, my apoligies, i thought they hosted the torrents too, /me must read article betterQuote:
Originally Posted by yamangman
In that case then, they want to get on googles back too, as it preforms just as good a job of searching the sites (at least the non memebership ones)
They do go after them :) There have been a few big busts recently (biggest being when fairlight and Razor got busted a few years back). These groups are the root cause of all this yes, but look at it from another perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by poindextermatic
Bit torrent opened up what was previously a 'closed' community to the masses. Ok so there were always websites and methods that people could use to get hold of pirated software, but it used to require some technical knowledge - ftp access, irc knowledge, usenet access etc etc. Bit torrent is so simple and easy to use that anyone can do it, you don't need the knowledge anymore.
Consequently the number of people pirating films, software etc must have increased immensely over the past few years, I have no figures to back this up, its pure speculation, but logically it makes sense. Before P2P took off in a big way did you ever hear about a group being busted? (in the news I mean) Software/film piracy was not really in the media at all.
So anyway, my points are that as has been mentioned, it is a lot easier for the feds to go after bit torrent sites, and p2p applications as they are publically accessible, and usually there is a paper trail leading to the owners/administrators - with groups this just isnt the same, would require spending alot of time getting into the 'scene' so to speak, to get close enough to someone to bust them. Also, getting rid of and/or controlling P2P should dramatically reduce piracy, cutting off a large number of people from access to illegal material, and therefore reducing piracy.
Of course that is the theory - in practice it will never work. Each time a group gets killed many more appear in its place. The same goes for bit torrent sites, and P2P applications. It would be great to see them all disappear - the groups, the torrent sites, the p2p apps, but it just isn't going to happen :(
So is torrentspy still safe to use?
I probably download 2-4 torrents a month from them
by safe to use what do you mean?
Downloading illegal files is never safe, there will always be logs kept somewhere, and p2p is even more unsafe as you never know who is connecting to you (only their ip address, and maybe one or 2 more details)
Another classic case of "The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers." The very nature of the internet means that there will be an infinite number of bittorrent sources and search facilities so it's totally pointless to try to crack down on it.
The media industry does not understand or rather refuses to acknowledge the real cause, which is over priced goods. The movie/record/games industry could easily earn more money than they could ever dream of by putting everything online and allowing you to download a movie/record for £3 but they simply do not have the vision to take advantage. They prefer to go with the tried and tested method of high prices for substandard merchandise in expensive high street shops. Innovate or die people.
More power to torrents :) I don't own a TV in UK and even if I did there is no way I could get the US channels such as Fox etc...
I download the torrents and once they episodes are out on DVD I grab the box sets...just recently got my self a huge 24 box set :D
Viva la Torrentspy, Isohunt, Piratebay et al :mrgreen:
my uni blocks the dload of .torrent files
Sorry to pick on you now mike :) but following that logic.Quote:
Originally Posted by bsodmike
Say a company releases a car in JUST the UK, and would not export it anywhere else for say, 5 years. If you lived in say the US, where you can't buy it, would it be ok for you to nip over to the UK, steal one, and ship it back to the states?
No of course it wouldn't
It's no different in this situation, just because you are going to buy one eventually doesnt mean you can steal it first..
I sympathise honestly, I miss UK and USA tv now im in switzerland - 64 channels with 3 in english (CNN, BBC prime and BBC world) - so no sitcoms, soaps etc etc until they appear on DVD. This doesn't give me the right to just steal it though..
It's like those ppl u see in WHSmith standing there reading magazines... do they actually buy them or what? Maybe somtimes, maybe somtimes they don't think its worth the money.
Don't really think its like stealing a car, its totally different...
I'm just glad that torrentspy hasn't been hit with the same nonsense a lot of other p2p index sites have been hit by.
That is - make an "accusation" - servers get confisicated - but no charges are ever actually brought. A number of the big sites have been hit by this sort of nonsense - and have never seen their kit again
Hasn't there been talk recently of making tv shows available for free legal download? After all.. they're free to watch on tv (unlike box office movies).
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsodmike
Ditto for me with Scrubs...great show, takes ages to get it over here, so dl it the day after it's aired across the pond. And then go out and buy the box sets - Scrubs S1,2 and 3 sitting on my shelf. :)
Here, the important thing is that I would never have got into Scrubs and therefore never bought these box sets, without downloading the eps via BT.
At least the TV companies are starting to see that the first showing figures are not the only thing to judge the success of a series by.
Admittedly only one series so far (Family Guy) has been treated in this way, but fingers crossed, they may actually see the bottom line for once instead of just the American viewing numbers.
Downloading illegal stuff is - its exactly the same in the eyes of the law, whatever you (or I for that matter) may think.Quote:
Originally Posted by poindextermatic
Theft is theft, whether it is a car, watch, 10p, a film, a tv episode, a game...
Amen, got my self the scrubs box set too. Tbh I think I've spent MORE on DVDs since I started downloading torrents that I did before. Why? Cause I didn't watch anything...i.e. no TV, no torrents = I wouldn't watch anything, and wouldn't buy anthing either....Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilWeevil
It's sort of like "demoing' a TV series. I can watch a few eps of scrubs and go 'OOOOh I like this!" or watch 24 and go "I so want that box set"...
And sadly, thanks to torrents, I've easily spent over £500 in the past couple months on DVDs...
So meh :p
And that is where you are totally WRONG.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spud1
The law differentiates completely between copyright infringement and theft.
The legal definition of theft:
"To dishonestly appropriate an item with the intention to permanantly deprive"
Theft is a criminal matter, copyright infringement is purely a civil matter.
The law does differentiate between them a lot. To steal something you have to take it away from them. By copying something you are not taking it away from them.
If you want to call piracy theft, then using the same logic, price fixing is theft. That simply means the corporate thiefs are getting burgled. Poetic justice.
Me too. I could go on and on about it but I don't want to cause a threadjack!Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilWeevil
err no it's not purely a civil matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by badass
You can find the original acts that apply at: http://www.opsi.gov.uk/
with the most useful one (Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988) at this link:
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1988..._en_1.htm#tcon
It's a pain in the ass the read (being a legal doc an all) but it's worth doing. A (very) brief overview can be found here: http://www.fast.org.uk/thelaw.asp
At the end of the day, copyright infringement is illegal, and depending on what you have done, you can get up to 10years inprisonment and a hefty fine.
Normally it is just a fine that is given out, and that is all you would expect, but you DO get a criminal record if caught, you CAN go to prison and it IS illegal.
edit: even better source of info: http://www.fact-uk.org.uk/site/crimi...tice/index.htm
I may have been wrong about copyright law being completely civil, but the law does differentiate between theft and copyright infringement. If it didn't, you'd get done for theft instead of any of the other offences mentioned under the acts you quoted there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spud1
Also, I haven't read the links in detail there, but the impression I get is that none of these copyright related offences are "arrestable offences" while theft most certainly is.
When I say "arrestable offence" I do not mean that you cant be arrested anything that is not an arrestable offence. I know the police can arrest for non arrestable offences in certain circumstances.