HEXUS.tv - promo-features :: Clash of the Titans - AMD v NVIDIA
http://www.hexus.tv/amd/At AMD’s invitation (and expense), we put a pair of ATi Radeon HD 2900 XT cards in CrossFire mode, up against a single Nvidia GeForce 8800 Ultra – in near identical systems - why? Because they cost about the same.
In advance of a full head-2-head being completed by HEXUS Labs, this promotional feature then showed these PCs running the latest DX10 benchmark available at standard settings. Guess which setup was victorious?
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Would it not be better to run 2 tests.
Both cards in the same board, but use 2 different boards, one an AMD/ATi based board and the other an NVidia based board, so your showing both cards in a "home" and "away" situation?
as much as i dont want to say this these results are a little bogus, the game tested is ati sponsored so will be tweaked for ati cards, also im guessing vista was used? as ati drivers on vista vastly beat the ones of the 8800, also comparing price is a little silly as you could just buy a gtx for alot cheaper and overclock it yourself, there is alot of things to take into consideration but i wouldnt trust those benchmarks myself.
Well I haven't watched all of this but my idea about who'd ultimately win the test was formed when I saw:
1) AMD branding everywhere
2) Two bigwigs from AMD on the panel
Not accusing Hexus of overt bias, btw - but it did seem a bit obvious. Perhaps it could be relabeled 'two new cards beat one (older) one shocker?'Just teasing, I have an 8800 GTX so I'm biased in that respect but I have no foot in any camp, I like to see the market vibrant and giving the best choice for us poor consumer saps. I'm also assuming that in this test ATI's drivers are better than Nvidia's?? (Shock! Horror! Nvidia in poor driver scandal, surely not!?!)
Last edited by pollaxe; 09-07-2007 at 11:58 AM.
tbh i think we can say nvidia will probably end up saying something to hexus about it
If I didnt know any better I think AMD/Ati are desperate for publicity.Originally Posted by Steve
Nvidia and Intel has well and truly trounced on them in all areas,. Amd have lost the plot!
They maybe at a same price point but think, lol it takes TWO top of the range ATI cards to beat ONE nvidia card?. I think to TRULY test then let us see who well they fare against TWO 8800 ultras? I bet this then would be a whole different ball-game!
Granted thje price point is the same as I have mentioned
However this is NO reason for AMD to brag, lets face it if it takes two top of the range ATI cards to beat a single 8800 ultra, then really it shows NOT how good AMD/ATI is but how good NVIDIA is. I think this is going to have a backlash against AMD.
Oh well
gilgamesh
In the immortal words of Ali-G "Is it cos I is an Overclocker?"
yeah, i also felt this was an AMD stunt. the truth is that everyone already knows about the call or jaurez benchmark. also the test platforms were not using the most effective/equal set up. They could of used an Intel Chipset to make things more fair and a Core 2 duo a better processor. i just believe with an more efficient processor/ equal chipset the 8800ultra would of looked a whole lot better.
Last edited by Blackmage; 09-07-2007 at 01:36 PM.
gilgamesh (10-07-2007)
yer agree with above amd chipsets and the amd processor used is top of range and intel one isnt, also agree with 2 up 2 cards needed to beat one isnt good shows amd wont own top market unless they work for it, they worried about the unified shaders to much 320 yes but all the other stuff sucks like texture and rop s (check stats).
I'd like AMD to kick nVidia's arse a bit - then nVidia's next card will be a whole lot better.
Oh, and they might get around to fixing their awful drivers (nVidia).
Crosshair VIII Hero (WIFI), 3900x, 32GB DDR4, Many SSDs, EVGA FTW3 3090, Ethoo 719
Hexus, let's be blunt. This sucks.
Oh common Hexus, you say you wanna compare apples to apples, in fact what your doing is comparing 2 apples to 1.
The conclusion from your intervies/test is obvious, if users want a fast DX10 gaming platform they should go for the single Nvidia 8800 Ultra.
Why?
1) It costs as much as a similar setup with 2 2900XTs, but the Nvidia setup CAN be expanded in the future by adding another 8800 Ultra, the AMD setup cannot.
2) The Nvidia setup runs on a Core2Duo, which is a much faster cpu than anything AMD has at the moment (what core2duo are you using in the Nvidia machine anyway, it is not mentioned... kinda convenient isn't it).
In fact, after seeing this intervies/test, AMD should be very ashamed, they produced a setup with 2 graphicscards that is a bit faster than the single Nvidia setup... 1 apple compared to 2 apples, like I said...
In other words the results are useless...
Belgarath
as with my last post.
Come on Hexus and ATI I expect much better than this. Come up with something that means SOMETHING. other than the ultra being better, Think about it the ATI cards needs TWICE the amount of power to achieve 8800 ULTRA speeds then 8800 ultra needs itsself. Hence the two cards needed. So in essence the NVIDA 8800 ultra, bang for buck (or in my case pound) is the better, when you factor in speed, power requirments and upgradability (ability to add another 8800 ultra)
As the other posted, no AMD CPU at th is moment in time come come ANYWHERE near close to Intels CORE 2 DUO/QUAD
Lets face it AMD Amd made a BAD MOVE aquiring ATI at this moment in time. Instead of the five billion paid for ATI, they should have used that money in developing a DECENT CPU to rival the Intel core 2./ Then when they have a rival or BETTER then use the profits out of that to purchase ATI.
AMD have only just come out with a quadcore now, whilst intel has already started to move on to the Yorkfield and the Penyrn, so in essence AMD is behind a generation or two. BE honest AMD/ATI please, lets face it your behind, be HONEST with people and your customers and use this FAUX-Pas you made and learn from it, that way you can be better next time.
ATI is desperate right now , as when AMD aqquired you, you lost 75% of your income due to the lisence agreement with Intel re: chipsets for mainboards.
Even if two ATI cards CAN be 8800 ultra NO ONE whom has an IQ over a 130 would believe that the cards are TWICE the speed of an ultra. Usually there is only a couple of percentage difference in them. The only shocking trouncing that has come over in recent years is the core 2 duo, over the AM2/AMD 64X2 etc. Hexus please understand posting news such as this demeans the integrity of yourselves and your readers. In future please post unbiased reviews.
Lastly I would to see a SINGLE ATI beat a NVIDIA 8800 ultra card. Competition is good for all of us. However the plain fact is that it cant right now and thats the reality of the situation.
Hexus please credit us with some common sense.
gilgamesh
Last edited by gilgamesh; 10-07-2007 at 10:15 AM.
In the immortal words of Ali-G "Is it cos I is an Overclocker?"
guys, i just want to point out a couple of Steve's statements up the top of the article:
It was a promotional feature done by heXus on behalf of ATi. We all know that NVidia are ahead of ATI/AMD at the moment, but its always good to support the underdog, as it helps keep up the spirit of the competition
Draw what conclusions you will, but don't blame heXus for it
Having looked through this carefully, I can see a bunch of stuff that might be done differently, but there do seem to be some facts that are not in dispute:-
1) Hexus have said clearly that AMD invited them down at their expense - that is about as clear a statement on 'the environment' as you can get
2) The systems were physically identical - attested to by an nVidia partner (who built both systems)
3) The say that the pricing is the same at the time of filming - but that will change with time
4) Have to say that all of the cards sold so far, seem to have 'Windows Vista Ready' stamped all over them. The 'drivers need more time' is a bit week if nVidia have had 9 months 'in the field' to work on them - but, for sure, things will always get better/faster - so a 'follow up' test might be in order soon to see what progress has been made
5) Benchmarks will always be biased one way or another to some extent - according to who actually 'paid' toward their development. Half Life 2 was an ATI project - and ATI did well. Doom 3 was an nVidia project and nVidia did well. This is the way of the world. Not too sure how many DX10 games are actually on the shelves for testing right now, but - again - worthy of a re-visit
6) Claiming 'system specs too low' is also weak. That is a strong argument when scores are 'tied' - that the CPU etc may be a bottleneck. In this case, that is unlikely to have been the case
7) 'Two against One' is not fair is a non-existant argument if I understand the driver issues right now. The 'best' match-up would be (based on price) to have a pair of 8800GTS cards against the 2900XT CrossFire cards.... but - after 9 months in the field - it seems that no 'publicly available' driver was forthcoming. You can only test with what is in front of you. AGAIN - strong argument for a re-match
Overall, we can all claim that the ground was un-even in some way...
...but the systems were the same - cost the same - and ran the same test with publicly available drivers...
...and the whole thing had 'At AMD's request and expense' stamped all over it
It is what it is - and DEFINITELY made for good TV
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I kept 6 trusted serving men, they taught me all I knew.
There names were what and where and why and how and when and who.
(I also had the HEXUS forums on speed dial just in case)
I wouldnt say Hexus are being bias, they were invited to attend...
what was the outcome? can't watch the tv's at work
Nox
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