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Thread: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Saturday

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    Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Saturday

    The price of fuel broke the £1 barrier not so long ago and with the addition of the Government's tax increase, a group named TransAction 2007 is planning a "nationwide legal protest" this Wednesday, December 12th.
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    sneaks quietly away. schmunk's Avatar
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    *yawn*

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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Can't get away from the fact that, as we develop alternative fuels etc, prices will carry on rising

    I was discussing another impact of this kind of pricing with a motorcycle cop on Friday as we filled up (our vehicles!)...

    ...and that is "The UK police force is a huge user of fuel. When prices increase 10% over 1 year with little/no warning, then it massively impacts the country's budget for policing and security"

    Wonder what the (exact) relationship is between higher petrol prices and a reduced police presence (whether that is actual full-time bobbies or just a reduction in overtime etc) ?
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    No more Mr Nice Guy. Nick's Avatar
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    At the risk of being flamed off the forums:

    This makes me laugh, in an sad, ironic and wearily cynical way.

    Here we are with fuel prices always increasing as soon as a barrel of oil goes up a few cents yet we never see the prices drop as quickly when oil prices drop...

    And yet we all happily drive around in gas guzzlers and 4x4s with 2 litre engines just to take ourselves to work...

    Take a look at the roads in the morning, the VAST majority or cars all have one person in them and you can be sure that with people living within a reasonable drive of work that they pass close to other colleagues yet no-one lift-shares.

    Rather than protest over fuel prices (where's the money the Government needs going to come from instead?) how about we protest over the lack of car-pool lanes? Allow cars with two or more passengers to use the bus lanes... it'll ease congestion and reduce pollution AND the occupants can share the fuel costs, making it cheaper for them.

    But no, we're a bunch of apathetic consumers who can't be bothered to get off our arses and come up with workable solutions other than have the occasional protest over fuel prices rather than come up with sensible and cheap to implement solutions.

    Yes, protesting does sometimes make a change but did it do anything last time? No, not really... all it did was inconvenience millions of people, perhaps even damaging the cause.

    Higher road taxes aren't the asnwer either... If I can afford a BMW soft-roader, a £100 hike on my yearly tax isn't going to bother me, is it?

    No, if the Government wants to keep it's coffers full it needs to come up with sensible solutions for the motorist that don't hit the less affluent, and more numerous, driver in the wallet.

    How about plugging all those bloody holes in corporate tax that sees us haemorrhaging tax bucks every year?

    How about tightening up on benefit fraud?

    To be honest, the more I dwell on this the more I realise what a bloody shambles this country is in... AND we're supposed to be hosting the Olympics in just over 4 years time... where the money coming from for that?

    But what really riles me is that the NHS has been in decline for years, state pensions are pretty much screwed and yet all anyone can think of is that the price of fuel is preventing them from filling up and buying a Mars bar and a can of coke out of their change.

    I can't wait to see what wonderful scheme we're gonna come up with in 30 years when the pension drawing populace outnumbers the working populace by 2 to 1... a mass zimmer frame shuffle on Parliament Square?

    Then again, given the NHS is falling apart through lack of funds and piss-poor management, perhaps that's the plan... that we all die sooner through lack of decent healthcare.

    Come on people, fuel prices are secondary to the really big picture and can be easy to fix with initiatives that think outside the box... there are far bigger issues looming in OUR LIFETIMES that we WILL have to deal with.
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    How about tightening up on benefit fraud?
    I cannot agree anymore with this comment, people who literally rape our hard earned tax is a bigger issue for me then the price of petrol.

    What would happen if regular working employees "didnt feel like working" for a day? The country would be a in a mess thats what.

    Some of these "fakers" actually get given huge cars to transport their kids to school in! Petrol is an issue but there are things of higher importance that need tackling and need sorting NOW.
    .: Rishi :.

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    DR
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    I guess I will fill it up today

    ... I don't use my car as much as most - but it does suck gas - I know Nick hates me for it too.

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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Quote Originally Posted by schmunk View Post
    *yawn*
    x2....


    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    we're a bunch of apathetic consumers who can't be bothered to get off our arses and come up with workable solutions
    Depressingly true. I'm not a huge fan of this government, but the idea that the UK government controls the price of fuel is a joke. Sure, a large amount of it is tax - who is going to offer up their local hospital for closure? Anyone fancy reducing road or rail maintenance spending? What about defence - we don't need those lot anymore, we've abolished war haven't we.

    And frankly the idea of making up the difference by reducing benefit fraud is a joke. An army of volunteers with donated notepads to catch the cheats? It's one of those problems that will always exist, but is always overestimated, and the cost of reducing it rises dramatically the harder you try - you get diminishing returns on what you spend. Minimise it, but its similar to the problem of "wasteful government departments with too many staff": always blamed for huge waste but there is only a certain amount of money that can be saved before you notice ill effects (e.g. not being able to catch fraudsters!) /rant

    Last edited by DeSean; 10-12-2007 at 12:03 PM. Reason: Edited to include rant against whingers :)

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    Seething Cauldron of Hatred TheAnimus's Avatar
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    I always thought the complaint was from people who have no alternative.

    If you live in a backwards part of the country, that because a large section of the people are too stupid/lazy/welsh to have jobs, there is sod all infrasturcture for anything but cars, as people are too scattered. Like my parents in cornwall for instance.

    Or those who are providing a courier/hallage type service.
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    Does he need a reason? Funkstar's Avatar
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Fuel prices up here in Shetland.

    Diesel - 117.9p
    Unleaded - 114.9p

    You don't usually get premium fuels up here as they would be far too expensive, especially because of the small market for them.

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    Seething Cauldron of Hatred TheAnimus's Avatar
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Aye, now as I would hope to never need a car for driving to/from work, the notion seams in-convient to me learning at an early age the effect one heinie has on my sega rally skills, and there are so many millions of people like me. I would only use a car (and i'm torn between buying a car or a new kitchen this coming year) for recreation really. As such i don't consider the fuel prices at present *that* extravogant, granted I'd sooner see a road pricing scheme, where your taxed per mile (more for popular congested, less for rureul) but hey, i'd sooner be having a march against people been held for 42 days without trail... Thanks Tony Cronies, you've made the terroirsts win.
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    No more Mr Nice Guy. Nick's Avatar
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Quote Originally Posted by DR View Post
    I guess I will fill it up today

    ... I don't use my car as much as most - but it does suck gas - I know Nick hates me for it too.
    No, I don't... you have a reason for a big 4x4, you do make use of it... it's the town and city drivers in their 4x4s that make me mad
    Quote Originally Posted by DeSean View Post
    x2....

    Depressingly true. I'm not a huge fan of this government, but the idea that the UK government controls the price of fuel is a joke. Sure, a large amount of it is tax - who is going to offer up their local hospital for closure? Anyone fancy reducing road or rail maintenance spending? What about defence - we don't need those lot anymore, we've abolished war haven't we.

    And frankly the idea of making up the difference by reducing benefit fraud is a joke. An army of volunteers with donated notepads to catch the cheats? It's one of those problems that will always exist, but is always overestimated, and the cost of reducing it rises dramatically the harder you try - you get diminishing returns on what you spend. Minimise it, but its similar to the problem of "wasteful government departments with too many staff": always blamed for huge waste but there is only a certain amount of money that can be saved before you notice ill effects (e.g. not being able to catch fraudsters!) /rant

    I wasn't implying that benefit fraud would fill the hole I meant that there's more pressing issues, such as benefit fraud, companies openly avoiding tax through loopholes we're too slow to close, (as you say) govt departments stupidly over-manned or full needless of middle-management consultant bods.

    They reckon we'll be spending £12 billion on the Olympic games... 12 BILLION... on GAMES!

    This is, to me, utter lunacy. Simply put, as a country, we CANNOT afford it. I laugh when the government issues a press release about how we're all spending too much on credit cards and borrowing is catastrophically high due to us wanting and buying what we can't afford but the Olympics is a classic example of just that.

    The Dome was another superb waste of money.

    And to be honest, you cannot trust any of the people on power... not one of them... opposition or incumbent, all of them might talk the talk but they've ALL got their eye on how to make money at the end of the day. The Tories were riddled with sleaze and greed scandals when they were dumped from power and Labour is the same now...

    Christ, now I'm starting to sound like Rave....
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    To be honest, the more I dwell on this the more I realise what a bloody shambles this country is in... AND we're supposed to be hosting the Olympics in just over 4 years time... where the money coming from for that?

    Then again, given the NHS is falling apart through lack of funds and piss-poor management, perhaps that's the plan... that we all die sooner through lack of decent healthcare.

    Come on people, fuel prices are secondary to the really big picture and can be easy to fix with initiatives that think outside the box... there are far bigger issues looming in OUR LIFETIMES that we WILL have to deal with.
    I agree with most of what you posted. But. Some of the Olympics is being funded by the Lottery and by Londoners with their council tax. But i know the tax payer will be shelling out a vast amount.

    I disagree with the lack of fund about the NHS, they have the funds, just that the piss-poor management spend it on more admin than anything else, conference in the south of france anyone!

    I'll be honest and say that the fuel (car related only) doesn't really bother me, yes i drive, but i don't live far from work, prices going up will only make me cycle to work and i can save the fuel for other things.

    But i do find this protest nothing but pointless and a complete waste of time.

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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    The taxes we pay on fuel are excessive IMO, we're one of the highest, if not the highest, in Europe.

    I'd be all for a decrease in fuel tax, although you could say I'm bias as I drive over 600 miles per week.

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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    I don't think people realise how much fuel prices affect them whether they drive or not. High prices affect business as well, since they all have to manufacture and transport/distribute food, goods and services. Many complain about rip-off Britain already, but it doesn't help if businesses have high overheads to work with.

    Housing such as ours has oil central heating, and the cost of filling our tank has skyrocketed in the last year or two.

    Oil and fuel prices have a knock on effect on the economy, so one should not dismiss the issue lightly. We're already looking at troubled times ahead, largely because of the housing market but this doesn't help.

    Lastly, a small fact for those that didn't know: tax is levied on VAT on fuel - a tax-on-tax if you like. Last time I looked at such things, it came to 8p a litre and that was a while ago.

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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    Quote Originally Posted by gt81 View Post
    Housing such as ours has oil central heating, and the cost of filling our tank has skyrocketed in the last year or two.
    Likewise. 2000 litres in Dec 2005 - £500, the same amount in Dec 2006 was £650. The quote this year was just under £950.
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    Re: Nation takes a stand, petrol protest on Wednesday

    go protest - won't change anything. has the uk government ever listened to the public?? they are greedy selfish little muppets.

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