Headlines - Very PC MD responds to Dragon?s Den mauling

[joshwa]

Hi Revol68 - please don't swear - also personal insults are not acceptable on this forum.

Please consider this a friendly warning.

[revol68]

calling a global warming denier an idiot is not a personal insult anymore than calling a KKK member a racist is.

[TooNice]

At least the company highlighted has come up with a good idea. Hey is it was that simple, why have Dell, IBM etc not done so already, not because it not hard to do , but thye have seen an opportunity.

Or maybe the larger companies deemed the market too small/unprofitable to warrant their attention ATM. It may not make business sense for Dell to replace their current product line if the new line is less profitable, or introduce a new line which may end up cannibalising sales of their current products [think of why only Western Digital is the only HD manufacturer with 10k RPM SATA HD]. VeryPC may be in a unique position to carve a niche in the same way that the Raptor has it's niche.

As to your rant against venture capitalist, what do you expect them to be doing? They are not a charity, and those entrepreneurs are strangers. They could be nicer, but in the end, it makes sense to me they would scrutinize every project for their profitability and tell it as they see it (right or wrong).

[revol68]

Or maybe the larger companies deemed the market too small/unprofitable to warrant their attention at the moment. It may not make business sense for Dell to replace their current product line if the new line is less profitable, or introduce a new line which may end up cannibalising sales of their current products [think of why only Western Digital is the only HD manufacturer with 10k RPM SATA HD]. VeryPC may be in a unique position to carve a niche in the same way that the Raptor has it's niche.

As to your rant against venture capitalist, what do you expect them to be doing? They are not a charity, and those entrepreneurs are strangers. They could be nicer, but in the end, it makes sense to me they would scrutinize every project for their profitability and tell it as they see it (right or wrong).

yeah VeryPC may manage to get a niche market and then expand from their if they can but I think it's silly to complain of venture capitalists being mean and too focussed on profit rather than ethics, it's a bit like complaining about the bad manners of a mugger.

[Steven W]

I'd heard of them. Didn't think he deserved the abuse.

[revol68]

I'd heard of them. Didn't think he deserved the abuse.

aye but the whole point of the show is that they are big bad, take no nonsense, pull no punches venture capitalists out to smack down peoples hopes, dreams and aspirations with some economic reality and of course snidey over aggressive mannerisms.

[PeterStoba]

Can you have 54monitors connected to a PC? :s

[joshwa]

On the subject of Dragon's Den - the terminal argument from Peter was somewhat irrelevant - and who would actually use terminals these days? (he appears to be talking about 54 thin client machines and a citrix(?) server - or something similar)

But regarding the PCs themselves - how difficult would it be for Dell or any other big company to start publishing power consumption figures for the PCs/Laptops they sell? and simply introducing a "Green" low-power range? Like this company they could just select low power CPUs, hard drives, fans, power supplies etc.

[revol68]

On the subject of Dragon's Den - the terminal argument from Peter was somewhat irrelevant - and who would actually use terminals these days? (he appears to be talking about 54 thin client machines and a citrix(?) server - or something similar)

But regarding the PCs themselves - how difficult would it be for Dell or any other big company to start publishing power consumption figures for the PCs/Laptops they sell? and simply introducing a "Green" low-power range? Like this company they could just select low power CPUs, hard drives, fans, power supplies etc.

haven't Dell already moved towards that with that new Hybrid thing, boasting of it's low power consumption and the like.

[joshwa]

haven't Dell already moved towards that with that new Hybrid thing, boasting of it's low power consumption and the like.

Yep - they come with a 65W AC Adaptor so must use less than that - or a max of 65w under load. They don't give specifics such as idle watt use and load... other than:

Size and materials - Our smallest design is about 80% smaller than standard desktops.
Power usage - Uses about 70% less power than a typical desktop.
Packaging - Studio Hybrid packaging is made from 95% recyclable materials.

[Whiternoise]

The dragons have one purpose. To make money. Plenty of people come on with charitable ideas and get shot down for being in the wrong place. Simply telling them that it would take a long time to make serious amounts of money is an immediate put off - they want results now. I mean the idea could be ground breaking, but at the end of the day they're capitalists.

Also remember that half of them probably don't know RAM from ROM, and would probably stumble quickly if they got out of their depth in technology. It's a fair point asking why other top manufacturers haven't done anything like it yet, so naturally the obvious answer is to say it's not a viable business option.

I wish Very PC all the best. They're doing a great job, and as the man said "there's no such thing as bad publicity", at the end of the day they got their funding and didn't have to sacrifice their business either. Well done to them!

Plus, it's pretty much a fact that "GREEN" sells.. Joe Customer thinks "hey, i can add it to my recycling and say to the neighbours that i'm doing better than they are".

It's true. The earth has these periods of warming up and cooling down. It's a fact.

Not to detract from the thread, but whatever your views on global warming, climate change et al all you have to do is look at Beijing and the amount of work they've done to reduce the fog caused by.. wait for it.. over industrialisation.

One of the best arguments i've heard is thus:

Imagine 50 years time..

1. Global Warming is a fact. Humanity does nothing. Basically we're all screwed for it, species die out, crops wither and are untenable, some crops can no longer be grown naturally, sea levels rise beyond our control, prices for everything skyrocket as resources become scarce. Get the picture here? BAD.

2. Global Warming is not a fact. Humanity does nothing. Lucky break, the world continues as normal and settles into it's "usual cycle".

3. Global Warming is not a fact. Humanity does something. Well, it didn't actually happen but look where it got us. We recycle over 50% of our resources, thus not needing so many raw materials. Electronics use far, far less power than before, so your electricity bills go down. Cars run on biofuels - since all the oil has run out and or skyrocketed in price - and produce lower emissions and are potentially cheaper to run. Being more conservative with everything means we don't waste as much (regardless of global warming, the amount of stuff that we waste is criminal), we pay less on pretty much all of our bills and we're better off for it.

4. Global Warming is a fact. Humanity does something. So, it's pretty bad, but at least it didn't really hit the fan quite so much. As above, we're using a lot less resources, the temperature hasn't quite risen high enough to kill everything off and the sea level hasn't yet risen to crippling levels. The damage that global warming could have caused has been roughly minimised and we're seeing the benefits.

Now if, as you believe, G.W. doesn't exist, then surely option 3 is better than option 2? As you rightly say, your bills get cheaper too! If it does exist then we're doing the right thing. Either way, it's not really worth the risk to sit around waiting for the time when you might be able to say "I told you so!".

[alsenior]

On the subject of Dragon's Den - the terminal argument from Peter was somewhat irrelevant - and who would actually use terminals these days? (he appears to be talking about 54 thin client machines and a citrix(?) server - or something similar)

he mentioned RS232 in what he said. that made me think that he is not shall we say up to date. hell serial is only really used for low level stuff or things like flashing roms. i would seriously doubt any tech credentials he has for recommending connecting modern thin clients to a server by serial.

[Saracen]

calling a global warming denier an idiot is not a personal insult anymore than calling a KKK member a racist is.

Calling a member of these forums an idiot is a personal insult. You've been asked by a mod, as a friendly warning, not to do it, and responding by telling him that it's not an insult is not the expected response. So this is a less friendly warning. Do not do it again.

[revol68]

Calling a member of these forums an idiot is a personal insult. You've been asked by a mod, as a friendly warning, not to do it, and responding by telling him that it's not an insult is not the expected response. So this is a less friendly warning. Do not do it again.

So membership of the Hexus forums automatically protects people from the terrible affliction of idiocy? What a community this must truly be.

i really don't know of a milder, more family friendly term for someone who denies climate change, infact idiot is atleast giving them the benefit of the doubt that they are not lying/twisting things for their own gain like the actually backers of the denial lobby who've pumped millions into mudding the waters and creating an artificial debate over the reality of climate change.

I'm also curious as to how far this ban on 'insulting' people goes, if someone denied the holocaust would I be entitled to call them an idiot, if they made arguments that were racist, sexist or homophobe? (examples of which are dotted through out the Hexus forums btw) which to my mind are far more insulting than being called an idiot.

People claiming global warming is a fiction insult everyones intelligence, I see no reason to care that they be insulted by being called idiots anymore than flat earthers or creationists.

As for the expected response comment, have you any idea what that sounds like? What was the expected response, to fall on two knees and thank the mod for having such mercy when they could so easily have elected to swot me like a fly?

[koocha]

So membership of the Hexus forums automatically protects people from the terrible affliction of idiocy? What a community this must truly be.

i really don't know of a milder, more family friendly term for someone who denies climate change, infact idiot is atleast giving them the benefit of the doubt that they are not lying/twisting things for their own gain like the actually backers of the denial lobby who've pumped millions into mudding the waters and creating an artificial debate over the reality of climate change.

I'm also curious as to how far this ban on 'insulting' people goes, if someone denied the holocaust would I be entitled to call them an idiot, if they made arguments that were racist, sexist or homophobe? (examples of which are dotted through out the Hexus forums btw) which to my mind are far more insulting than being called an idiot.

People claiming global warming is a fiction insult everyones intelligence, I see no reason to care that they be insulted by being called idiots anymore than flat earthers or creationists.

As for the expected response comment, have you any idea what that sounds like? What was the expected response, to fall on two knees and thank the mod for having such mercy when they could so easily have elected to swot me like a fly?

Ok, first off, put your handbag away.

Second, let me pick out some random smileys to cheer the place up:

Thirdly, what about the end of the world? Does it really matter about global warming if the world is going to end?!?!?!?!?!

http://www.december212012.com

[TAKTAK]

So membership of the Hexus forums automatically protects people from the terrible affliction of idiocy? What a community this must truly be.

i really don't know of a milder, more family friendly term for someone who denies climate change, infact idiot is atleast giving them the benefit of the doubt that they are not lying/twisting things for their own gain like the actually backers of the denial lobby who've pumped millions into mudding the waters and creating an artificial debate over the reality of climate change.

I'm also curious as to how far this ban on 'insulting' people goes, if someone denied the holocaust would I be entitled to call them an idiot, if they made arguments that were racist, sexist or homophobe? (examples of which are dotted through out the Hexus forums btw) which to my mind are far more insulting than being called an idiot.

People claiming global warming is a fiction insult everyones intelligence, I see no reason to care that they be insulted by being called idiots anymore than flat earthers or creationists.

As for the expected response comment, have you any idea what that sounds like? What was the expected response, to fall on two knees and thank the mod for having such mercy when they could so easily have elected to swot me like a fly?

why such nihlism? (is that the right word? )

everyone has the right to air their views on the matter (whether they be the same, or whether they be different) without being told that they are 'idiots'..
and seeing as though calling someone an 'idiot' is deemed as verbal abuse (in company), it is acceptable on the ground of HEXUS to perpetuate a low tolerance of any issues of users at each others throats. OBV it is up to the mods what is said in a joking fashion and what is not...

but the fact of the matter is global warming would occur naturally if humans were not around... the fact that we are here merely speeds up the process... afterall, we are still coming out of an iceage, so one should expect global temperature to fluctuate...
but that does not deny you, your own views on the subject... and your right to air them in public.

but TBPH there is no way of providing infallible evidence for/against the situation... so in a way... everyone is an 'idiot'... it's all guess work and predicting whether to ignore it and suffer the consequences (if it is true), or do something and suffer the consequences (if it is wrong)

but to set it out..

do something: it happens : economic downturn world suffers anyway
do something: it doesn't happen : economic downturn, world suffers
don't do anything: it happens : (according to all the hype everything assplodes and dies)
don't do anything: it doesn't happen : the world is fine and carries on as normal....

so there is a 3/4 chance of the world suffering.... a 100% chance of suffering if something is done, and a 50% chance of suffering if something isn't done... which to me looks better towards not doing anything...

obviously that is just my take on the scenario.. and people can 'poopoo' it all they like, but i'm steadfast in my views