News - Mozilla offers to help EC in Microsoft investigation

[handscombmp]

This is silly. Of course Microsoft should bundle IE with Windows. If someone buys a PC and have no other computers. How are they expected to download an alternative browser? You need IE installed to be able to download other browsers. Besides, what about Mac OS X and Safari? I'm not defending IE in any way as I am an avid Chrome user but I'm sure that people just like to attack Microsoft.

I'm the same and think its unfair. Also without IE how do i get Firefox onto my pc. I think it should be able to be uninstalled but they have everyright to put IE in Windows.

Along the same lines as Subnet1 what about iPods and iTunes. Apple have completly taken out any competion as you can only use the iPods with iTunes. At least windows you can use another browser.

[Funkstar]

Also without IE how do i get Firefox onto my pc.

I already explained how it can be done

Of just make then availbale over Windows Update. Simple.

[aidanjt]

An operating system without a browser is like a cheetah without legs, a human without a brain, or a bird without wings. This is about the dumbest whine to come out of Brussels. Yes, Windows needs a real package manager, and a package manager removes the need to have a browser to find software. But Windows doesn't, and you do need to browse the internet to get software. So why complain that cheetahs run really fast, humans can think about complex problems, and birds can fly?

[M_Taylor40]

If you can't make your point without swearing , then dont bother making it at all - admin

[McPhee]

I get the EU's point, i'm just wondering how far they are going to follow it through? If they're truly dedicated to this "cause" then Apple should be next up for the iPod - iTunes partnership and their use of the App Store to crush out any competition with their own products on their mobile OS (Opera Mobile being banned, anyone?).

I don't really see why it's going this far though really, surely Microsoft could just strip Windows 7 bare, bundle in Skybox and then let users choose which software they want to use. To me that'd be a fair resolution to the problem (apart from any computer without a net connection being pretty badly nerfed). However i expect the EU will be looking for "compensation" on behalf of the people and will also want existing Windows versions to be changed.

[tighsamhradh]

Telling Microsoft that they can't include I/E wih their OS is like telling KFC that they can't include fries or drinks with their chicken, because it's anti-competitive towards McDonalds. I am totally fed up with the EC sticking their unwanted nose into everything. It's very difficult (impossible for most) to download an alternative web-browser if one cannot browse the Internet in the first place. Just how is it "anti-competitive" to include a browser in the OS. No-one (in their right mind anyway) has ever had to pay money for an alternative browser, so what's the problem? Including I/E does not mean that the respective companies behind Firefox, Opera, Chrome etc are losing revenues as a result of I/E's bundling (because their products are free), so the whole thing is pointless. Just legislation for the sake of it. If Microsoft can't do it, then it's about time that Apple got a serious telling off for including DVD playback software and a web browser in their (in my opinion) seriously lacking in most areas OS. AND as stated by others in this thread, Apple has the total monopoly on ipods. It is not possible to drag and drop tunes from your PC onto an ipod, or use any other type of media playback/synchronisation software to do it either. This IS in fact anti-competitive behaviour which has gone completely unpunished for years. Microsoft don't stop anyone using an alternative way to use their MP3 players, but Apple do.

The EC should be ashamed of it's childish behaviour toward Microsoft, who are only giving customers what they want - a usable system straight out of the box; not one that needs several upgrades before they can use it properly. I run a PC shop, and am therefore on the front line here. I know full well that if I sold people a computer without a web browser that I would receive a barrage of complaints, not Microsoft or the EC - ME!

[Steve]

To the people that have issues with the EC's current actions, some food for thought.

Yes, Linux distros are very frequently distributed with Firefox. Yes, Windows always has IE bundled in.

However, the creators of the Linux distro don't make Firefox, and so are not in a monopolistic position like Microsoft is.

However, I do think that it's up to the creators and supporters of other browsers to dislodge IE, rather than some committee telling Microsoft that they can't ship it with their OS.

[Grey M@a]

To the people that have issues with the EC's current actions, some food for thought.

Yes, Linux distro's are very frequently distributed with Firefox. Yes, Windows always has IE bundled in.

However, the creators of the Linux distro don't make Firefox, and so are not in a monopolistic position like Microsoft is.

However, I do think that it's up to the creators and supporters of other browsers to dislodge IE, rather than some committee telling Microsoft that they can't ship it with their OS.

I agree with the the Linux comment but then you could bring Apple into this argument as they ship and make Safari for their OS. It's all tit for tat though. Just leave things as they are and allow people to make up their own minds Hell if the likes of Safari, Firefox, Opera et al want their browsers to be out there and available to the mass market that won't go looking for other browsers, they should produce a CD that they pay for from their own pockets with no comeback on Microsoft and include them as part of OEM install disks or extra CD's/DVD's so then people can look at them without forcing MS into some crap Anti Trust court case yet again.

I have a Mac, PC running Vista and then a Linux box here at work which I use all day, everyday but I run Firefox across all three as I prefer it but the mass market will use what is put in front of them such is the case here at work. Those on Mac's run Safari as its there to use out the box, those with laptops and pc's running windows they tend to keep to IE. You can't force people to change their ways, if MS is forced to unbundle IE can you imagine how many calls and complaints will be put into the high street tech support lines and MS support themselves. The EU really does need to get it's head out of it's arse and focus on more pressing matters.