News - HMV to talk with banks due to disappointing performance

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Retailer warns it may breach banking covenants in January.

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Read more.

I really feel this January we will see a seismic shift in the High Street. My mates that are in retail all reckon this could be make or break for many retailers, and my Christmas shopping experience has been quiet with lots of items out of stock already, so internet sales must be huge!

Another one bites the dust!

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Originally Posted by TheAnimus

Another one bites the dust!

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I was thinking exactly the same thing when I saw the headline.

I am surprised they managed to continue this long. I was expecting them to go soon after the Virgin Mega Stores buy out a few years back.

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Originally Posted by 3dcandy

I really feel this January we will see a seismic shift in the High Street. My mates that are in retail all reckon this could be make or break for many retailers, and my Christmas shopping experience has been quiet with lots of items out of stock already, so internet sales must be huge!

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Nearly everything I got this year was with Amazon, a lot of their prices were the same or cheaper than nearly everyone else and with a 30 day Prime trial, I was having nearly everything delivered next day(no thanks to Yodel I might add)

They would do better if they actually tried to be one of the cheapest stores, but they are one of the most expensive.

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Originally Posted by Matsy

They would do better if they actually tried to be one of the cheapest stores, but they are one of the most expensive.

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How would that help, they're losing money? And if you say they'd get more customers you're sadly mistaken...

Once Amazon starts paying more tax,I wonder if they will be as cheap as they used to be??

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Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

Once Amazon starts paying more tax,I wonder if they will be as cheap as they used to be??

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Before that happens I think alot more high street retailers will suffer and/either fold.

Although the supermarkets are just as competitive

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Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

Once Amazon starts paying more tax,I wonder if they will be as cheap as they used to be??

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The music and DVD retailers in the UK (Virgin/Our Price/Andys Records) all fell foul of online trading when it all started to gain momentum about 10 years ago, at the time it was primarily places like Play and WOW etc who were taking advantage of the VAT loophole to import individual CDs/DVDs at outrageous prices, often upto 50% cheaper. One by one the retailers fell and bowed out of the market. The VAT loophole is closed now and the majority of prices on Play are within £1 or so of the HMV prices the damage has been done, and it's now also got no chance against the buying power and tax policies of Amazon.

The next/current target on Amazon's list is the bookshops, with E-Books being the undeniable future for the majority of reading the UK is still classing an E-Book as computer software and charging VAT at 20% for UK retailersm rather than 0% like books, whereas Luxembourg dropped the VAT on E-Books to 2.5% - funny that. This has been fixed though by the government so we can all breathe easily, it will be put right in 2014 so all those UK bookshops just need to keep surviving while having to add 17.5% more than Amazon onto the price for a year or so.

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Originally Posted by Barakka

tax policies of Amazon.

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This has very little to do with tax policies of amazon. I would like to know why you think it would be?

Amazon charge and pay VAT on every applicable sale, 20% of gross, that can't be dodged. Amazon pay NI, commercial rates etc. When you consider that amazon turn over some £7bn apparently. That is £1.4bn if its all applicable. But lets call it just one.

HMV sold less than £1bn. It might have been as little as £0.5bn. So HMV has paid at very, very most £200M in VAT. Less than a fifth of amazon.

Then to compare corp tax between amazon and HMV is stupid, really stupid. I don't know where you got your ideas from but consider a news source with better analysis. HMV has been loosing money, they have debt, something like £100M if memory serves (I have no BBG :().

My point is the idea of HMV been disadvantaged because amazon isn't paying 24% to HMRC for its profits is just plain stupid, HMV isn't making profit to pay tax on.

HMV suffers because they have to pay for a lot more staff, expensive rents for shops, insurance, theft, well the list goes on!

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Originally Posted by TheAnimus

This has very little to do with tax policies of amazon. I would like to know why you think it would be?

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Mearly that paying less tax gave them more profit to have faster growth and stronger buying power to push down prices further, over the last few years.

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Originally Posted by TheAnimus

Then to compare corp tax between amazon and HMV is stupid, really stupid.

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Yes stupid, really stupid, I bow to your superior knowledge.

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Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

Once Amazon starts paying more tax,I wonder if they will be as cheap as they used to be??

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Don't think Amazon will ever pay their full whack of tax - they'll either do a Starbucks and pony up a nominal amount (to keep the customers happy), or take a leaf from the scummy banks playbook and claim that "they'll have to leave the country if HMRC gets strict with them" (not that HMRC is likely to come down on them - based on past [dismal] performance).

So HMV will be gone by the New Year - I'll miss them, since they did have some good deals on the "older" stuff (e.g. DVD boxed sets) that beat Amazon's prices and you could get it now. Someone said HMV were a bit of a dinosaur and Asda, Tesco, Sainsbury's, Morrison did their range but cheaper - but I've never found that the supermarkets stocked anything other than what was in chart vogue at the moment (and that interests me not one whit!).

Seems odd - any HMV store I've been in always tends to be packed out. Obviously no-one actually buying stuff, just looking.

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Originally Posted by =assassin=

Seems odd - any HMV store I've been in always tends to be packed out. Obviously no-one actually buying stuff, just looking.

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That's all I ever do if I go into a HMV!

What a lot of you are forgetting as well is that the approach we all have towards music is changing all the time, HMV don't stock the sort of music I am into for example. Everyone is developing very individual music tastes and the top 40 charts are probably only bought by 10% of music buyers maybe less, but being number one in the charts no longer means everyone knows who you are anymore like it used to 20 years ago. Don't forget we are also lazy and the ability to download (legally or illegally) is not going to help matters.