News - Intel to continue making socketed CPUs for “foreseeable future”

[HEXUS]

Also AMD has "no plans at this time to move to BGA only packaging".

Read more.

[kingpotnoodle]

Wow, surprise... not. Of course they won't get rid of socketed CPUs, and the rumour roadmap doesn't really suggest that unless you want it to. It's possible they may offer more integrated solutions like NUC and others may start to offer more high end integrated boards (especially slim ITX as that would be a great idea, there's already integrated Atom boards), in time socketed may become an expensive enthusiast option, but they won't disappear for a good long time yet - CPUs are becoming more disposable but not THAT disposable.

[shaithis]

Didn't think it was currently a flyer.

It would just be an incentive to NOT upgrade your CPU (or even mobo, Intel makes money on chipsets as well as CPUs) as the associated cost would put a lot of people off.

[edvinasm]

Didn't think it was currently a flyer.

It would just be an incentive to NOT upgrade your CPU (or even mobo, Intel makes money on chipsets as well as CPUs) as the associated cost would put a lot of people off.

In a minor way yes. However, these things are future plans more than "make as much as you can now" plans. I have read and watched a number of articles/shows regarding this rumour of Intel moving away from sockets. Was shocked and angry when I first heard this but.. Now it does make sence. The way we (PC users) lost ground in recent years was because consoles are simple, don't need any upgrades and are standardised and optimised. Tablets and smartphones are heading this direction too. We need same thing to happen on PC. Its not 80s anymore and most of us don't want to assemble PCs anyway (enthusiasts are minority unfortunately). Besides, MB and CPU are only few parts that are in the case - there is GPU, RAM, SSD/HDD, Audio, BL drives, Chasis, PSU etc.

To sum it all up - the sooner we move to soldered in CPUs the better. Might be a bit of shock in short term but most will benefit in long run anyway. MB are becoming less and less responsible for processing since most parts are moving onto CPU package. Soldering on will make sence eventually. And there still will be lots of choice hardware and software wise (provided Microsoft will listen to its audience).

[kingpotnoodle]

MB are becoming less and less responsible for processing since most parts are moving onto CPU package. Soldering on will make sense eventually.

You're right, I think it will happen more and as I said in the original rumour thread I think it is more like extending the CPU package to encompass the whole motherboard which is now little more than sockets, power smoothing and an I/O controller.

I don't think sockets need to or will die completely for a long time though, that flexibility is still needed and desired - it may well start to become the more expensive option though whilst fully integrated solutions become the mass market option... even that is years away IMHO.

[watercooled]

Yeah I also saw it as a poor interpretation TBH, especially when I found some comments on a article with a proper translation vs Google Translate which most seem to have used. At least this is a bit of reassurance amongst all the doomsaying of late. Nice to see AMD and Intel are starting to give some response to rumours to stop some random site posting whatever they like and have everyone else jump on it as pure fact...

@edvinasm: Despite 'a number' of articles publishing this, believe it or not they all lead back to the same questionable source, with some more open about that than others.

I still disagree about 'the sooner we move to soldered CPUs, the better' as I probably said more than a few times in the last thread. Maybe at some point it will make sense even to enthusiasts, but currently there's no advantage to anyone but Intel, it's not all about lack of upgrades either.

Edit:@potnoodle: That's basically what motherboards have always been, integrating common parts to the CPU doesn't really change anything; the chipset was generally made by the same company as the CPU anyway. There remains a lot of differentiation between high and low end motherboards for a given socket.

[shaithis]

To sum it all up - the sooner we move to soldered in CPUs the better. Might be a bit of shock in short term but most will benefit in long run anyway. MB are becoming less and less responsible for processing since most parts are moving onto CPU package. Soldering on will make sence eventually. And there still will be lots of choice hardware and software wise (provided Microsoft will listen to its audience).

Better?
For some people yes, for many others NO.

Even someone (like yourself) who thinks it's good will change their tune the moment their mobo or CPU dies and you have to pay twice as much to replace it....

Just how much do you think will be saved from a total system cost by removing the socket?

How much time/complexity is removed from system building?

Think about it, if you don't build your own machine, you don't know/care either way anyway. Your none-the-wiser....at least until Mr ripoff PC doctor tells you "£250 to fix it mate"

And we will never be in a situation where everything is on the mobo/cpu.

Again, the server market will stop that dead in its tracks, as will the gaming market. Servers are highly customised for the tasks they perform and a discrete GPU will always have an advantage over IGP.

[borandi]

MB are becoming less and less responsible for processing since most parts are moving onto CPU package.

You're right, I think it will happen more and as I said in the original rumour thread I think it is more like extending the CPU package to encompass the whole motherboard which is now little more than sockets, power smoothing and an I/O controller.

For everyone running at stock, you're wrong. The advent of MultiCore Enhancement/Acceleration (http://www.anandtech.com/show/6214/) being used on the latest generation of motherboards is only going to continue in earnest. Regardless of what you may believe, the m/b BIOS and chipset have a great deal when it comes to those last few % in performance, USB speed is a big factor, as well as memory compatibility and PCIe lane responsiveness (given different PCIe layouts possible when using the PLX 8747 chip) and bandwidth. The motherboard is responsible for more than you know.

[kingpotnoodle]

For everyone running at stock, you're wrong. The advent of MultiCore Enhancement/Acceleration (http://www.anandtech.com/show/6214/) being used on the latest generation of motherboards is only going to continue in earnest. Regardless of what you may believe, the m/b BIOS and chipset have a great deal when it comes to those last few % in performance, USB speed is a big factor, as well as memory compatibility and PCIe lane responsiveness (given different PCIe layouts possible when using the PLX 8747 chip) and bandwidth. The motherboard is responsible for more than you know.

Those motherboards are the halo products used in a small % of custom PCs though - they will be the ones that definitely stay socketed (and I hope they do for a long time). Most boards used in mass-made (i.e. what you buy in PC World) PCs/laptops are a lot simpler, general users wouldn't give a fig about USB speed and an extra few % in benchmarks.

Edit:@potnoodle: That's basically what motherboards have always been, integrating common parts to the CPU doesn't really change anything; the chipset was generally made by the same company as the CPU anyway. There remains a lot of differentiation between high and low end motherboards for a given socket.

Time was the motherboard chipset had the PCI-E controller (or AGP before it), a graphics chip and going way back they used to have L2 cache memory - the trend is towards integration and more stuff on the CPU package and less on the motherboard. These days most motherboards (not the high end ones) are just a sockets, traces and the I/O hub chip and that I/O hub chip will probably end up on the CPU package before much longer relegating the basic motherboard to little more than a dumb backplane. At that point budget solutions might as well solder on the CPU to the motherboard and just sell a few SKUs with different CPUs on. Rather like the current Atom boards - I just see that moving a little higher up the food chain.

Soldered on CPUs are most useful in small form factor machines (already see it a lot in laptops, nettops etc), I think that's what the roadmap was suggesting if anything and what we will see increase. It makes things like slim-ITX and solutions like the NUC a lot more practical.

[watercooled]

That's simply not correct though, there are still a lot of logic and power devices on the motherboard, even cheap/Atom-type boards. Slim systems use low-voltage mobile parts, as they have been doing for ages. The power draw and heat output of desktop CPUs makes them impractical for such purposes, soldered or otherwise.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

The rumour was was most likely indicating that desktop chips will stay at 22NM longer than the 14NM ones,,and the 14NM chips were more likely to not be socketed. Considering these are most likely to be used in tablets and laptops,it made sense. Intel is simply prioritising 14NM for a market which actually needs it and use a tried and tested process for another market,which also means they have more time to make their investment back. I suspect you will see Haswell extended well into 2014 and Broadwell targetted to the mobile market.

[borandi]

Those motherboards are the halo products

Wrong. Up and down the ASUS and GB Z77 range, for any motherboard north of £75. ASRock and MSI are starting to do this as well after the AT post and it will become the norm for home builds as these manufacturers all want the better results in benchmarks. It's just a bigger leap than the BCLK/FSB issues we saw on 775.

used in a small % of custom PCs though - they will be the ones that definitely stay socketed (and I hope they do for a long time). Most boards used in mass-made (i.e. what you buy in PC World) PCs/laptops are a lot simpler, general users wouldn't give a fig about USB speed and an extra few % in benchmarks.

I don't buy anything in PC World. While they have a bit of a market share, motherboard manufacturers do not listen to the users who buy there - just the system integrator itself. The users who do buy from PC world will not care if socketed or not.

General users don't care about a lot. My parents don't care about a lot in the PC space. As long as they can surf the web and play cards. The users that do care often have a purpose for their machines and are more likely to be on the cutting edge of performance. Waiting so long for Broadwell after Haswell means that some will be itching to jump, which also means they'll also have to decide on a motherboard. Given that these users do care about the few %, it will matter on the motherboard side if they can't switch out.

AnandTech did a podcast on this topic. Explains it a little better
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6491/

[aidanjt]

Well that isn't encouraging, corporations don't see past the next quarter. :/

[ed^chigliak]

I've just had a motherboard fail outside of any warranty. I could replace it for £35 and keep on trucking with the same CPU however that's not what I've gone and done. I went with all new core components to gain USB3.0 and leave DDR2 behind. My old CPU still has value to sell it on ebay or to upgrade a family members PC. Not so if the CPU is soldered to a defective board.

I'm all in favour of a PC that just work but I can't see that's ever going to happen or that such a change might be brought about by soldering a CPU to the motherboard. This is a cost cutting / money making scam. People who don't care what's inside the box are happy with a socket. Those that do care are happy with a socket. Problem solved... keep using the sockets.

[bridges009]

The way we (PC users) lost ground in recent years was because consoles are simple, don't need any upgrades and are standardised and optimised. Tablets and smartphones are heading this direction too. We need same thing to happen on PC. Its not 80s anymore and most of us don't want to assemble PCs anyway (enthusiasts are minority unfortunately).

It's always, always been the case that people assembling their own PCs have been the minority which is why there have always been the Dell, HP, Acer, etc to sell fully assembled and supported systems to the mainstream. Why you think motherboards and CPU's "need" to become literally unified products I don't know, because they essentially already are to the mainstream anyway.

Having said that, I've never upgraded a CPU and kept the same motherboard. I've got a first generation i7 920 and it's stupid money to buy a faster compatible chip.

[Zeven]

Even if Intel goes along that route, AMD will be there to save the day, right? They could use the additional market share.