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Thread: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

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    Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Allows them to non-destructively study the 3D design details of modern processors.
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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    A non destructive chip examination will potentially increase yields dramatically during the QC process.

    Interesting xray tech!

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Quote Originally Posted by Tabbykatze View Post
    A non destructive chip examination will potentially increase yields dramatically during the QC process.

    Interesting xray tech!
    And allow the Chinese to rip off anything they like! Huzzah!

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Quote Originally Posted by philehidiot View Post
    And allow the Chinese to rip off anything they like! Huzzah!
    We know it's always happening in any market anywhere in the world. The Chinese just don't bother hiding it.

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Quote Originally Posted by philehidiot View Post
    And allow the Chinese to rip off anything they like! Huzzah!
    Manufacturing anyway is happening in Asia mostly, AMD already has Chinneise company with their IP.
    What do you think they need more ?

    Actually i think we will only benefit from this technology on the long run - easier chip diagnostics = increasing yields + transparent security.
    On the short - expect more CPU security flaws found.

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Quote Originally Posted by Tabbykatze View Post
    A non destructive chip examination will potentially increase yields dramatically during the QC process.

    Interesting xray tech!
    How would this be cost competitive with poking the chip with live wires and seeing if it turns on? I can maybe see this help investigate defects in the production line, but an hour in a fancy X-ray machine per chip (with the next gen Xray sources) AND all the compute to make sense of the reflections won't be cheap

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Quote Originally Posted by Xlucine View Post
    How would this be cost competitive with poking the chip with live wires and seeing if it turns on? I can maybe see this help investigate defects in the production line, but an hour in a fancy X-ray machine per chip (with the next gen Xray sources) AND all the compute to make sense of the reflections won't be cheap
    It'll be more an R&D thing at this stage as you say - screen for defects and ID them / determine causes way faster. The tech is in its infancy and when it's working at full chooch then it's quite possible wafers will come out, be screened and you'll know immediately without any physical contact whether they're good, bad or ugly. I'm sure it'll run side by side with physical testing. And as for compute and cost - the people who build fabs are used to this.

    Compare this to the difference between physiological and anatomical testing in medicine. Sticking wires in and seeing what happens tells you something isn't right and then you often go onto anatomical testing to see what is the problem. Certain anatomical features relate to certain physiological effects and symptoms. Some anatomical features will cause physiological problems in some people and not others. It works in tandem, not in isolation.

    With enough information, you may be able to match features on this imaging to performance for easier binning.

    You may be able to perform this imaging mid-manufacture to see if it's baking right and if not, or signs are there are problems emerging, you may be able to alter a process mid-way, re-run a process, alter the next process to compensate or ditch the wafer before you throw any more money at it.

    Non-invasive testing like this opens up a world of options and not just for the final product.

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    This is an interesting science experiment, but I can't see it displacing destructive imaging via successive slices any time soon. It certanly won't be used for routine quality control.

    The authors used a "3rd gen synchrotron X-ray beam". This is nothing like the small and relatively cheap X-ray sources used in hospitals. It is a massive particle accelerator that fills a large building and costs hundreds of millions to build and run. There are about 70 of these things worldwide. The UK has only one (Diamond light source in Oxfordshire) that cost £263 million back in 2007 and costs £40 million a year to run.

    I dare say that in time the technology will improve. Better x-ray sources will become available, and the computing to make sense of the raw data will become cheap, but in the meantime this is mostly a curiosity.

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Gosh I was sure "ptychographic" was a typo of say psychographic, when I first saw the article.

    That's a weird word.

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    Re: Researchers develop ptychographic X-ray laminography

    Quote Originally Posted by chrestomanci View Post
    This is an interesting science experiment, but I can't see it displacing destructive imaging via successive slices any time soon. It certanly won't be used for routine quality control.
    I bet a few knock offs will appear in China, bought by the government and having a line of manufacturers with "acquired" chips they'd rather like to zap.... yeh I'm being a prick again.

    Everything starts somewhere. I'd hope I can get one of these in 30 years time off Ali Express for £3 delivered that fits in my pocket and irradiates my balls with its poorly shielded plutonium core.

    Seriously though, these things may well be huge and expensive which is why they might be very excited at finding a way to commercialise their services beyond just research.

    Or students at the university will nip in after hours to use the giant particle accelerator for beer money from some shady guy in a suit with a mysterious chip that says only "PROPERTY OF US GOVERNMENT. MMIII GUIDANCE MODULE 3.11".

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