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About LinkBacksNothing says buy my competitors product like throwing shades at it.
Not being a laptop person I'd assumed Intel and AMD laptops were much the same but if a massive company like Intel are taking notice of AMD laptops they must be rather good.
Nothing says buy my competitors product like throwing shades at it.
Not being a laptop person I'd assumed Intel and AMD laptops were much the same but if a massive company like Intel are taking notice of AMD laptops they must be rather good.
Last edited by Corky34; 25-11-2020 at 05:40 PM. Reason: Why 'U' being silly.
ik9000 (25-11-2020),Saracen999 (26-11-2020)
Yes, but if anyone makes purchasing decisions based on which company has <insert favourite expletive here> the consumer the least, someone might come along and accuse you of shopping based on activism, when all you are trying to do is 'support' the company which historically has committed fewer shady things.Originally Posted by Tabbykatze
And 'support' is too strong a word: more like not-support the shady company.
Point being, not to expect wonders from any company but rather to not reward the more aggressive anti-consumer company, and buying for now but with a view to my next purchase too. For that the AMD alternative doesn't have to be massively cheaper like they used to be, but rather while they are the smaller player - and cost at most the same (Zen3 might be entering into dangerous territory here) - I would rather buy them.
Intel for instance could easily afford to subside certain market to the tune of $billions like they did with table Atom chips with the intention of driving out competitors and later raise prices. In the meantime, consumers would get extra cheap CPUs like those £50 Atom tablets.
"Good" says our resident consumer champion, but when making a purchase I also think about tomorrow's prices after the competitors have been driven out. Maybe that makes me an activist!?
Purchasing decisions by end consumers will be corrupted when one business in an effective duopoly is forcing the hand of suppliers to remove or detriment the only other option.
In effect my comments come from Intel has been caught doing this before and crippled the CPU industry wherein servers and consumer systems stagnated in performance and features for nearly a decade. In the last 4 years it feels like there has been more movement in the industry than in the last 10.
It's difficult to turn some of this Intel momentum around now its been so many years Intel have ruled the roost. I deal with creating minimum specs for servers for running our software. I had to explain that the spec we were recommending where less powerful than my cheap AMD 3600 powered desktop PC as intel had drop the ball so badly. The sad thing is it doesn't matter how good AMD are if Intel is the default option for the server manufacture you recommend (And work with). I did at least get to drop in an 'or equivalent'! It's the same with laptops too - We've all been offered 'high spec' intel i7 laptops to replace our desktops and I said no I want AMD as they are better but that's the only spec IT can provide so it's the only option... I've asked to wait.
ANSWER TO INTEL WOES: (1) Replace the top management (2) End the Blue versus Green badge employee politics, its bad for the creative engineers.
Essentially Hexus said it all... "Companies are naturally inclined to try and show their products in the best light but go too far and you will lose trust and burn through years of goodwill very quickly."
I laughed with tears on this comment. Best ever!
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I will say it again SELL INTC before it is too late.
Absolutely. Intel's division between the two tiers is killing them. Good engineers who are working on the actual front line of R&D aren't allowed to (or if they are allowed, aren't rewarded) make suggestions on improvements. They are also resentful as they're doing the grunt work without any corporate rewards (like full use of the R&R facilities) or job security. They are used to do a specific job, abused and dumped. I'd be resentful and I'd keep my good ideas to myself to show off at an interview for a company that'll treat me right.
I think they are making inroads into the top management as they did get rid of one of the troublecausers.
A business like Intel thrives on propagation of good ideas. It has learnt that it doesn't need to advance, as it wasn't being competed with, so it completely choked off the ideas market within the company. Now, AMD and (I hate to say it) Apple are showing that even the largest companies aren't too big to fail.
You're supposed to be selling innovation, whereas Intel was selling chips. Haswell only became unusable for me because of the side channel vulnerability mitigations. I only had to upgrade in several years due to Intel's screw ups and the only place to get properly better performance was their competitor.
I hope Intel survives this as the last thing we need is AMD (or APPLE!!) being all tyrannical in its place.
As for the second point, I feel marketing should just resist showing comparisons to competitor products. We never trust them anyway. Compare yourself to where you were yesterday and you should always show progress. Let the reviewers compare you to the competition. Internally, of course they should be buying and analysing competitor products. But the marketing should be just clean of it all so we can't question anything.
A salesman who always ridicules the competition is one not to be trusted, as it means their own product doesn't have enough selling points and they have to stomp on others. A salesman who always sticks to comparison to their older generation products feels more trustworthy, as they are pointing out flaws and improvements against their own products. Then, when that second salesman does mention something about the competition and where they have gone wrong, boy do you remember it... because they felt so strongly that they had to tell you.
Intel can help its case a lot if stops all the stupid feature tierisation and naming schemes it has on desktop and in mobile.
If they remain absent from those segments in 2021 then it will be more than reasonable to cry conspiracy and intel paying off oems to skip amd designs, but when they were planning for 202 they couldn't be sure that the demand would be there for amd cpus so they haven't tend to crop up in some form factors where the additional validation of designs would not necessarily pay off.yup. I went searching and came to the same conclusion. Why no 4000U in say an XPS or similar? Most... puzzling.
The fact that intel are trying to talk down amd laptops with biased and misleading presentations at this time would seem to indicate though that the oems are working on more compelling amd offerings for 2021.
I thought every laptop sacrifices performance for battery life, which is why they are all slower than desktop counterparts.
Hexus won't post my original posts, just thjs doesn't surprise me one little but.
It's nothing new from what Intel have done in the past.
I'd made so many witty, hilarious and also valuable comments as well....
Old puter - still good enuff till I save some pennies!
I don't think anyone can beat Intel for tyrannical beat-them-at-all-costs blatantly illegal bullying. Microsoft used to be close, but even they seem to have cleaned up their act a bit since Bill left.
It seems sadly ironic that the only reason Intel wasn't absorbed into IBM was that IBM at the time they bailed out Intel were scared of being broken up under monopoly legislation and wanted to be ethical and do the right thing; and that gave Intel the push away from bankruptcy and into being the well funded gorilla it is now. With hindsight pulling the then failed Intel into IBM oversight could have made the world a nicer place, possibly merging with IBM's CPU design teams giving better Intel CPUs. Or better still, we might have moved away from x86 years ago and be using PowerPC architecture that wasn't so obviously cobbled together in a hurry.
I don't know, because I have the same level of inside access these days as everybody else, i.e. none, but we did have an "outage" a few days ago (Sunday or Monday IIRC) and my guess would be .... something got broke. Maybe links, maybe a full re-index is needed, maybe some database damage, maybe just stuff close to that outage got broken. It's just speculation, and I assume if anything can be done, it is being or will be.
A lesson learned from PeterB about dignity in adversity, so Peter, In Memorium, "Onwards and Upwards".
Echoes of "Nobody gets fired for buying Big Blue" .... until they didn't.
Heads up Intel - take note of the comment above about burning through goodwill, note the tone of posts here (and pretty much everywhere), then study what happened to "Big Blue" as a result of corporate arrogance.
A lesson learned from PeterB about dignity in adversity, so Peter, In Memorium, "Onwards and Upwards".
Not disagreeing with your point, but (pedant mode on) .... it can't really be a duopoly, or certainly not an effective one, if either duopolist can force suppliers to do much of anything, unless there is collusion between the duopolists, and not only is that illegal but in this case would suggest AMD actively sought to screw itself.
Intel's putative actions suggest it is, or at least believes itself to be, effectively a monopoly. At an absolute minimum, a duopoly with a substantial element of monopolistic power.
Just sayin'.
A lesson learned from PeterB about dignity in adversity, so Peter, In Memorium, "Onwards and Upwards".
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