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Thread: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

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    Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    Gabe Newell talks about dev teams working on OpenBCI headsets and expectations for the tech.
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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    Macross Plus future here we come (controlling fighter jets with a brain interface)??? Or is it Ghost in the Shell (with the brain hacking)?

    On a serious note, this has me intrigued. And if it works might help people who can't use their hands because of disabilities etc, to game/control other things. Don't think I'd want to use it though. I get enough immersion in my gaming already with my KB+Mouse/Controller and Monitor setup.

    BCIs could be used for something as simple as sensing if a player is getting bored and tweaking game challenge levels.
    This is the dumbest use for this! I can determine if I get bored of a game or if the difficulty is not right and adjust appropriately. Don't need someone wasting coding hours to figure this out!
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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    Great Gabe. Where is Half life 3?
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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    I think this is the second time I've mentioned the OCZ NIA. Tried and failed miserably. These things usually need significant training of both machine and user. Great if you're stuck in bed and a BCI will allow you to communicate or use artificial limbs - that's a proper goal and people will spend hours a day on such things.

    It took a few years of programming and fiddling to get my implant to work properly with my nervous system. You can't take one system and do one size fits all like that. Think of all the different shapes of just a computer mouse there are out there. Different switches for keyboards. But trying these out and finding what works isn't quite as invested as training something to recognise your EEG.

    The issue with such things is gamers don't usually want to spend months or more sucking at a game whilst they train this thing. And they'll probably get banned from competition because some will get a huge advantage and others won't be able to use it at all.

    The training sessions for such things tend to be unrepresentative as they are done in a "quiet" environment. You thinking "KILL DEM ALLLLLL!" for shoot is going to look very different in a training session to during a game where the EEG is immersed in chaos due to near saturated inputs. This is different to the act of controlling an arm or a cursor around your house.

    As for invasive stuff - NO. You do not want companies that can't even make a game not crash playing with your brains. This is a silly idea by a silly person. I've been on the receiving end of bad programming by a sloppy user. It hurts and causes really weird sensations in areas of the body totally unrelated to what is being zapped. Overstimulation can also damage nerves.

    Maybe when we know enough about this stuff from medical use and have developed a one size fits all, safe approach, we could look at a commercial technology. But right now, people with about 5 degrees and a lifetime spent perfecting their craft can't get this stuff to work right without massive trial and error on every individual. Sure if they want to release a passive box to play with, fine, but I expect they'll do the same as OCZ and EOL the product in short order. But there is no way they should be allowed to release anything actively directly affecting your neurons. They aren't competent, and I'm sure they'll end up withdrawing it after the first seizure. The difference is our bodies have protective mechanisms for normal stimuli. If a mouse is made of razor blades, it hurts and we react to limit the damage. It is entirely possible to cause serious damage without knowing it using this kind of kit.

    And if he thinks this will be able to induce sleep.... proof he isn't leading a company qualified to be doing this. You can't just hit your brain with something and make yourself sleep (unless it's a hammer). It's something that involves every system in your body including endocrine and neuroendocrines. And if he can make something that affects those systems on that scale, it's effectively the same as a strong prescription medication and needs to be controlled as such. Farcebook has found how to play with people's neuroendocrine systems and has no problems doing it on a massive scale.

    Do you trust a company like this when their motive is "you're getting bored of the game, let's detect that normal response to something that is occupying too much of your time and fiddle with the inputs to keep the dopamine running and you playing"?

    That is called directly promoting addiction.

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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    If it is not compatible with the Tesla chip, who care.

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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    As someone with a great interest is BCI I try to test these systems as they come out. The OCZ NIA system was complete garbage, Nextmind is just as useless. We're 25 years away from something usable.

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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    Quote Originally Posted by Scryder View Post
    Macross Plus future here we come (controlling fighter jets with a brain interface)??? Or is it Ghost in the Shell (with the brain hacking)?
    Not forgetting Cyberpunk 2077, Remember Me, and many other titles that I've not personally played.
    But then we have all the other media too, such as PsyCorps from Babylon 5... cor, Lyta was so hot, wasn't she!!

    Furthermore, the potential for BCI experiences goes well beyond gaming, according to the Valve CEO.
    The potential is an entire world delivered direct into your brain via implants. You'd never leave your Herman Miller gaming chair...

    He forecasts an early application being a sleep app where you can program the BCI to deliver x many hours of slumber.
    Or the government can just put you to sleep, and so quell the rebellion in an instant...

    Such a powerful sensory reader/writer could be misused, hacked, and would thus need stringent safeguards in place
    People will still find ways in. Nothing is unhackable... Not even a Mac!!
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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    Quote Originally Posted by maxopus View Post
    As someone with a great interest is BCI I try to test these systems as they come out. The OCZ NIA system was complete garbage, Nextmind is just as useless. We're 25 years away from something usable.
    Aye, I agree. I think we need far better methods of data acquisition. Obtaining an EEG that is of decent quality is a specialist job (using done by strange people who hide in darkened rooms) and the "slap on electrodes and see what comes out" jobbies are used in theatres to produce a single number which is a guide to the anaesthetist to how much white stuff they need to squirt in.

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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    It's all fun and games until suddenly everything goes full "Sword Art Online"...

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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    At the dawn of Half-Life, valve were years ahead of the time with this technology:
    https://www.extremetech.com/wp-conte...o-bald-guy.jpg

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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    Quote Originally Posted by GravJunk View Post
    At the dawn of Half-Life, valve were years ahead of the time with this technology:
    https://www.extremetech.com/wp-conte...o-bald-guy.jpg
    Don't know if you remember, but there was another one; with the valve in his eye socket.

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    Re: Valve boss discusses Brain Computer Interfaces for PCs

    I am hopping we see non-invasive BCI in our life time, I am guessing that we need to have invasive tech develop at the forefront however.

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