Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
Unless they're giving away $300 of mechanise those prices are going to have to come down if they want to seriously challenge AMD and Nvidia, while there will undoubtedly be people willing to spend that to be an early adopter i personally wouldn't spend that sort of money on something that's undoubtedly going to have issues.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
Well, my first reaction to that is "Manufacturer cashing in by maximising profits" shock. But .... if they can, why wouldn't they?
Ultimately, I guess, the issue is .... what will buyers pay, and in what quantity? In large part, that'll depend on what alternatives there are, and what they cost, and we all know the current state of that situation.
Maybe my perspective is skewed by having spent most of my adult life either self-employed or running a small business. What I had to sell was essentially time and experise which, by definition, is in limited supply and hard or impossible to increase in quantity. So if I can't 'pile it high and sll it cheap', my income depended directly on maximising profit from each unit (hour) of what I had to sell. My pricing strategy? Whatever the market would bear.
On the freelance writing side, for example, I might have one client that paid 50p/word, and another that paid 8p/word. Allowing for the fact that, ironically, the much higher one actually needed less expertise and research/prep, guess which one I'd choose to work for, for as much hours as I could get?
In truth, and for full disclosure, the 8p/word one was actually much more fun, and interesting to me, in many ways, or I wouldn't have done it at all. That stuff wasn't just about the money. But the point remains .... I mostly went for what the market would bear, and most jobs were just that ... jobs. If one paid 10% more for the same time, than the next, I'd pick that one.
By that logic, if a manufacturer, Intel or otherwise, cannot increase quantity (due to external limits), or even if they can but make more money by charging more and selling less, why wouldn't they? They're a corporation, not a charity or social service.
The converse of that is that, currently, I am spec'ing a system and need a GPU. My thought process is .... what capabilities do I want, and can I afford to pay what it is going to cost? What is a given level of performance worth to me? If I want, say, a 3080 enough to pay what it is currently going to cost, then by definition it is worth that to me .... or I wouldn't or couldn't pay it. Would I prefer to pay 0.5x, or 0.7x? Obviously. But if I want one, now, I can either pay what it costs, wait, or buy something else.
If these Intel cards are more than "expected", that begs the question .... who is doing the expecting, and what are they basing that expectation on?
Ever bought gold? Typically, it varies a fair bit, but you can almost use it as a barometer for confidence in worldwide economies. Somewhat subject to current price, if something hits confidence, gold prices go up. If people are comfortable and happy, it may go down a bit. Graphics cards aren't quite as commoditised as gold (and certainly not as linked to confidence) but the same basic supply and demand rules apply. It's how the world works ... and probably always will until some Utopian Star-Trekian future where money, and any substitute, have been eliminated and I don't see that happening until supply of basically everything becomes unlimited. I'm not holding my breath for that.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Originally Posted by
Corky34
Unless they're giving away $300 of mechanise those prices are going to have to come down if they want to seriously challenge AMD and Nvidia, while there will undoubtedly be people willing to spend that to be an early adopter i personally wouldn't spend that sort of money on something that's undoubtedly going to have issues.
That's true, providing the Intel cards aren't significantly better/faster. and, critically, people (in quantity) can actually but the AMD/nVidia alternative.
I really want some unicorn manure for my veg plot, but as it seems to be a tad tricky to get, I might have to settle for what i can buy. :D
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
I wonder how different the EUs are to those in the 11th gen mobile parts. Supposedly 96 in my laptop so not that far from the entry level (power budgets permitting, of course).
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Corky34
Unless they're giving away $300 of mechanise those prices are going to have to come down if they want to seriously challenge AMD and Nvidia, while there will undoubtedly be people willing to spend that to be an early adopter i personally wouldn't spend that sort of money on something that's undoubtedly going to have issues.
To be fair they could be giving away merchandise with a $300 value, they're likely not worth $300 but the 'rrp' they can add whatever value they like lol. Just think how much a replica football top costs these days (around £80-£100)....and that's basically the same as the intel t-shirt.
It also depends on what they give away, maybe they're giving away a branded pcie ssd in the package... t-shirt, cap etc is likely a given but sometimes you get other products they make/sell too in prize packages.
Or it's just Intel being Intel and thinking their brand means they can price things too high for their performance because 'non tech' people won't know any better than it's made by Intel.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
Yea, i agree. $300 worth of merchandise (@rrp) is certainly a possibility, companies do tend to overvalue exclusive merchandise so i could certainly see Intel thinking a t-shirt with ARC branding is worth hundreds of dollars.
Either way they're going to need to price them well under comparable graphics cards if they expect people to buy them as i suspect no matter how powerful the hardware is it's going to be the software that's going to let them down, at least initially.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
Merch is irrelevant, they need decent stock, and then they can be slower than the current crop of AMD/NVidia stuff that you cant buy and they'll sell.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Originally Posted by
Saracen999
I really want some unicorn manure for my veg plot, but as it seems to be a tad tricky to get, I might have to settle for what i can buy. :D
I hear if you get it right you grow some magic beans.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
Raja knows how to design for Crypto mining...
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Originally Posted by
[GSV]Trig
Merch is irrelevant, they need decent stock, and then they can be slower than the current crop of AMD/NVidia stuff that you cant buy and they'll sell.
Their merch might be relevant provided a given user actually wants it. Things like branded t-shirts, to me, are worth zero. If you catch me wearing one, which is rare, it's probably because I'm gardening, decorating or maybe working on the car, and don't want to ruin a shirt I actually care about. It'll also be one I ended up being given at a trade show somewhere.
Even beyond merch, to other 'freebies' with a product, it's rare for me to place much value on them. One of the few excptions to that was buying a pretty expensive food processor, and getting a pretty impressive bundle of extrs to go with it that would have cost me quite a bit to buy separately. As some of them I was planning to buy anyway, that did add significant extra value to me, and was what triggered 'probably getting one' into 'order now'. But some other bits I wouldn't have bought if I had to pay for them and at least one, several years later, I have yet to use.
I guess whether merch or other bits, it's a very individual thing what you would or wouldn't value, and would or wouldn't want. But most 'merch'? Not for me.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
If they can sell every piece they make then shareholders will be asking why they didn't charge more...
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Originally Posted by
Corky34
Either way they're going to need to price them well under comparable graphics cards if they expect people to buy them as i suspect no matter how powerful the hardware is it's going to be the software that's going to let them down, at least initially.
Merch or pricing aside, I think this will sum up the state of play for a vast number of potential customers. Regardless of how well these may bench comparable to the incumbent peers, it'll be the software side of things that really ends up being the deciding factor. How well Intel do in this area is something that the more tech savvy customers will watch.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Originally Posted by
kalniel
If they can sell every piece they make then shareholders will be asking why they didn't charge more...
And such is the problem with shareholders, everything goes by figures...
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
It wouldn't need a very big Optane drive included in the merch to skew those values like hell ;)
They can slap any value they want on a GPU atm, and it wouldn't seem out of place.
I was browsing the Currys web site yesterday (yeah, I know) and was amused to see a 3080ti for £1700 with a big "Save £200!" banner next to it. Cheapest card they have is an RX6600 at £430. Generally looking around the etailers there is stock out there even if I don't like the price atm, which is an improvement on a few months ago.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
When they move onto the four thousand series people will probably consider a %50 increase in MSRP good value what with people buying cards at %100 of their MSRP.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Originally Posted by
[GSV]Trig
And such is the problem with shareholders, everything goes by figures...
Well there are occasional activist groups who try to get enough votes through for other agendas so if you do want to influence a company to change and act altruistically rather than for profit say then you can always buy shares and try to do so. But you'll be going up against a lot of other people who have bought in order to make a profit.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
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Originally Posted by
kalniel
Well there are occasional activist groups who try to get enough votes through for other agendas so if you do want to influence a company to change and act altruistically rather than for profit say then you can always buy shares and try to do so. But you'll be going up against a lot of other people who have bought in order to make a profit.
Yup. Buying a share or two in order to get access to AGMs, etc, is one thing but in order to actually use shareholder influence to affect strategic decisions, well, you're up against institutional invstors, like pension funds, unti trusts etc, with million invested. I would suggest that actually getting that level of shareholder influence is a non-starter, unless conceivably there are a very large number of 'protest' shareholders indeed, acting in a coordinated way. Personally, I don't see it working.
Re: Intel Arc Alchemist graphics cards may be pricier than expected
Once I heard Intel was using TSMC 6NM and the die area was probably going to be at least 400MM2,I suspected prices might not be that hot! :( Intel is quite clearly throwing the kitchen sink at these GPUs,ie,the best node they could get access to(TSMC 6NM) and 16GB of GDDR6,which is more than what the RTX3070 and RX6700XT,so I expect costs are not great either. But being Intel they also like large margins too,although did half expect they might drop margins to get one up on Nvidia/AMD,but I suspect if they can actually keep to RRP it might not matter.
