Legal team get involved in WOW's gay rights issue

[Steven W]

A legal team have approached Blizzard to get the gay guild issue sorted out once and for all.

Check out this Headline for more info.

[Mimp]

Exactly what I wanted to say, just worded better. Can't see how Blizzard have a leg to stand on, banning people from telling others that they are gay implies there's something wrong with it.

Although Blizzard is well within its rights to insist that players avoid referring to other gamers in an “insulting manner,” Blizzard cannot issue a blanket ban on any mention of sexual orientation or gender identity. There is nothing “insulting” about identifying oneself as gay, lesbian or transgender, nor does the announcement of a guild for LGBT gamers constitute “harassment” in any sense of the word. If other players react insultingly to the mere presence of LGBT gamers, then Blizzard should discipline the harassers, not attempt preemptively to silence the potential victims of harassment.

[Shazbot]

Well it was only a matter of time before Americas litigation legacy crawled it's way into a new arena.

I don't understand why people would want to drag real life issues into an online game and it's a fact that many of the companies want to avoid purely because of the trouble it can cause.

All players when they sign up to an online game accept the terms and conditions of play (what do you mean you skip reading that bit?) and yes that means Blizzard sets the rules.

In all sense and purposes this could explode into a preverbial can of worms. If this action succeeds then every other online game is going to get similar writs made against them because the players are shouting that their sexual or religious beliefs aren't being addressed and accepted.

Then what are you going to get? isolated groups fragmented in a virtual world that mirrors the real world.

I've played online games (yes with gay people too!) and never once have they held up their (virtual) hands shouting they're not being allowed to express themselves. They were open about it but they didn't actively force the fact and as such mixed socially as much as anyone else.

Heck following this we will probably find little virtual lawyers wandering around online waiting around for someone to be harrassed or injured so they can tout their services. "I fell off a dragon at work and the accident helpline won me 100,000 gp". Yes, this is made in jest but you get the idea.

Where will it all end?

[directhex]

look ai it this way - it *is* a singleing out. how about banning players from stating their gender, in case it's used as a basis to cause offense? or ban people from speaking anything but esperanto - so nobody can determine countries of origin (offensive as they are)

of course, there are floodgate issues, but it's certainly not a clear cut "stop whining" issue

[TiG]

Thats the thing that annoys me about this, its Nothing to do with them being gay, its to do with them advertising a gay guild. (as per the other hexus thread). I have no problem about gay/gay friendly guilds being in the game. But i do object to the fact that advertising of gay or gay friendly guilds will instantly result in huge amount of spam, insults and abuse. It is the advertising of the guild that causes the problem and as such is the cause of the problem and is stopped for the point of making the game manageable.

I don't see what colour/creed/race/sexuality/political concerns has got to do with a game. Advertising a guild based on any of the above is just not on. Only thing i think is acceptable is guilds based on foriegn languages. Being in a guild where you can actually understand what the other members are saying.

TiG

[Steven W]

Thats the thing that annoys me about this, its Nothing to do with them being gay, its to do with them advertising a gay guild. (as per the other hexus thread). I have no problem about gay/gay friendly guilds being in the game. But i do object to the fact that advertising of gay or gay friendly guilds will instantly result in huge amount of spam, insults and abuse. It is the advertising of the guild that causes the problem and as such is the cause of the problem and is stopped for the point of making the game manageable.

I don't see what colour/creed/race/sexuality/political concerns has got to do with a game. Advertising a guild based on any of the above is just not on. Only thing i think is acceptable is guilds based on foriegn languages. Being in a guild where you can actually understand what the other members are saying.

TiG

Yeah, my stance has swayed on this issue, it's Blizzard's game after all, and if it was in their policy from the outset, then people should know what they wre stepping into. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes though.

Maybe they should create a version just for homosexuals.

[Syd]

OMG What is next!!!!! If another charachter calls my dwarf shorty or fat boy can I try and sue him for deformation of charachter, if my rogue gets called a ninja unfairly is that liabellous. It is this kind of issue thats gonna turn people like myself off playing in the first place, Hell one of the reasons MMORPG's are so popular is that it's escapism - that means not like RL.

[mike_dowler]

I assumed the problem was the exclusivity of it - after all, a 'straight' guild would be objected to on the basis that it was discriminatory against gay people - so why should a 'non-straight' (for want of a better blanket term) guild be allowed.

[Steve A]

Tbh

Who cares,

"There the only gays in the village"

[Syd]

Tbh

Who cares,

"There the only gays in the village"

[YorkieBen]

the flip side of the coin is that is someone starts a 'straight only' guild, or starts creating guilds that only allow one type of race/religion etc

[Syd]

I can imagine the yells now(a possible example) - "Established Guild now recruiting for new members, we are a helpful guild who encourage character growth, assistance and trading, raids are regularily arranged and new characters are welcomed along with more experienced players, Please whisper Borat or UberN00b for an invite.....................Only white males aged between 12 and 30, no offense"

[Paul Adams]

I side firmly with Blizzard on this.

Their T's & C's, as quoted in the article and letter, are not singling out a particular group of people to discriminate, but saying that all mention/advertising of any such distinction is not permitted - so "everyone" is being "discriminated against".

To promote a positive game environment for everyone and help prevent such harassment from taking place as best we can, we prohibit mention of topics related to sensitive real-world subjects in open chat within the game, and we do our best to take action whenever we see such topics being broadcast. This includes openly advertising a guild friendly to players based on a particular political, sexual, or religious preference, to list a few examples.

They are not saying "gay is wrong", but "sexual preferences should not be discussed on our servers".

The rules are there to prevent tensions as it is a virtual world and real-life colour/race/gender/gender preference/disability should have no relevance in it.

[Steven W]

A female point of view:

http://www.gamegirladvance.com/archi...ir_guilds.html

Raiding with your Gay-Lesbian Guild would be so much more fun. Hugs all around afterwards!
Let's face it, straight boys in anonymous games are annoying
Plus, gay boys are more likely to be supportive of you. A shoulder to cry on.

Hmmm, I can hug just as well as a homosexual. The idea that homosexuals have more feelings, or are more in tune with their feelings than a straight person is downright rubbish, we're all the same. There are agressive gay people and aggressive straight people.

Anyway I'm getting off this subject now as the missus is wondering why I'm typing 'gay guilds' into google

[Nick]

I have to question what the point of a gay guild is all about.... I mean, why bother?

Does anyone work in an office where the homosexuals and lesbians have all gathered over in one corner to do their work?

Is there a segregated canteen with signs above the table saying 'The Pink Corner' or 'No carpet munching on the tables'?

I can't see what all the fuss is about... so what, you're gay... well done... Now let's get in there and take on the mobs...

What's that? You're a woman who wears comfortable shoes? Right, at least if we meet in the real world that saves me trying to buy you drinks and chat you up all night... now can we get on and take down this bloody great monstie please?

The point is, once again, that if straight AND gay people BOTH truly wanted to act as normal, civilized human beings, this would even BE an issue, becuase no-one would actually care.

There is such a thing as self-segregation... and, just like having a pub called the Pink Punter, for gays, lesbians and transexuals, having a gay guild does nothing but serve to reinforce the idea that gay people are 'different' in more areas than their sexuality, which, to be frank, they're not.

[Mimp]

There is such a thing as self-segregation... and, just like having a pub called the Pink Punter, for gays, lesbians and transexuals, having a gay guild does nothing but serve to reinforce the idea that gay people are 'different' in more areas than their sexuality, which, to be frank, they're not.

I can see your point, but i can't agree with it.

The reason there are gay pubs and clubs is becasue if two men or women were to go into a lot of places in this country and start kissing each other they would stand a fairly high chance of getting some abuse. Calling a pub the pink punter indicates it's a safe place for gay people to go and shows anyone who doesn't like the idea to keep clear. It doesn't mean straight people can't go there or will be frowned upon, just that the place is gay FRIENDLY, just like this guild. I'm straight, and when i've been to gay pubs/clubs noone has ever had a problem with it. On the other hand I've known people shouted at in the street simply because their clothes looked a bit camp.