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Thread: Coffee machine for an occasional user?

  1. #145
    ALT0153™ Rob_B's Avatar
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    Re: Coffee machine for an occasional user?

    I bought 3 bags (all with a roasted on 6th Dec date)
    We have only opened one so far (light roast, Ethiopian, Mengesha Ayu) and its OK, nothing special to be honest and not convinced I'd be able to tell it from some of the bog standard beans we've had before. Fingers crossed the medium roasts I have are a bit more out of the ordinary

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    The Irish Drunk! neonplanet40's Avatar
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    Re: Coffee machine for an occasional user?

    Aww sorry to hear that
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    ALT0153™ Rob_B's Avatar
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    Re: Coffee machine for an occasional user?

    On a bag of medium roast now, Yayu Wild Forest (Ethiopia) much nicer than the first lot, bit more punch and flavour.

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    Re: Coffee machine for an occasional user?

    Glad to hear that. I haven't had that one but most of the ones I have are medium roasts. I do like the revelation blend though as well. However, I mostly drink latte's. So usually need something that cuts through the milk.
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    Re: Coffee machine for an occasional user?

    Quote Originally Posted by Saracen999 View Post
    Pretty sure I haven't mentioned getting it before, and it's pretty recent. So much so that part is yet to arrive. I did say I was thinking about the Sage (Breville outside UK and/or some of Europe) Oracle Touch, but in the end I went for the standard Oracle (i.e. no touch-screen controls) and a Niche Zero grinder (the bit I'm waiting on). Yes, for those that know the machine, the Oracle has a grinder built in, but the Niche is distictly and upgrade on that, and is for V60, Clever Dripper and Aeropress too.
    Looking at getting a Niche myself, or at least going on the waiting list to get one. Wish I had got onto the original crown funding, have been following its development for years. Currently using a converted commercial grinder that I have modified to single dose, but its not ideal. Also want to upgrade my DIY PID Gaggia classic, trying to decide between a Sage dual boiler or a Lelit Elizabeth.

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    Re: Coffee machine for an occasional user?

    Well, my Niche sould be getting close to imminent arrival now, but currently, I'm still waiting.

    As for the Sage DB v Lelit Liz, I think there are a number of factors to that, one of which is certainly preference for styling. The Sage (obviously) is styled in typical Sage fahion, and visually at least comes over as a typical high-end consumer device. The Liz is, well, as you know .... how do I put this, a bit more like an industrial process control unit more suited to a factory shop floor, and Mrs Saracen nix'ed that right quick. My prejudices for appearance may be showing a bit there, and of course, YMMV, but one appealed to me more than the other. And another 'of course' is that, of course, the appearane is pretty secondary to brewing capability to anyone looking at buying either.

    So I went though an .... ahem .... fairly lengthy research and assessment process, and ended up trying to decide between a Proiftec 700/ECM Synchronika or the Sage, tending towards the ECM. I was pretty close to pulling the trigger on the ECM when two things happened: the wife expressed a very negative view of the 'traditional' styling of ECM/Profitec etc, and I spotted a deal on the black version (which suits our kitchen re-design better) of the Sage Oracle at £1300, as opposed to the usual £1700-£1900. The Sage standard price was already part of what had been holding the back from the ECM, but at that price, a rather tasty £1000 saving over the ECM, well, that did it.

    That, of course, is the Oracle, but from what I can make out, the difference between the Oracle and the DB are almost entirely in the semi-automation features of the Oracle (built-in grinder, auto-tamping, auto-steaming, etc.) So unless they matter, the Oracle and DB are, functionally, pretty much equivalent.

    A couple of things to bear in mind that you might not have come across. Despite the apparent disparity between the Liz being a 'proper' coffee machine and the Sage DB being a 'consumer device', don't sell the Sage short. The Oracle was a surprise to me in how solidly built it was, I was expecting it to be a bit flimsy and plasticky, but not a bit of it. The box it comes in has "Heavy - two person lift only" stickers all over it. Lightweight, it ain't. I doubt the DB is much lighter, though obviously, the tamper etc aren't there.

    Perhaps more importantly, the DB is more upgradeable than you might think. If you haven't already, check out some of the mods that can be done, including for pressure profiling.

    Ultimately it depends on exactly what you're looking for, I guess, but my view is that the Sage is a bit of a dark horse, often dismissed a bit too casually by some of slightly elitist coffee enthusiasts. I think they're missing a bit of a gem, possibly because it looks like a consumer machine not a 'proper' espresso machine. It is just my opinion, and to be honest, it isn't an opinion with a lot of expertise to back it up, but I think it's better built than many (that probably haven't actually used one) give it credit for, and you certainly get a pretty high concentration of features for the price.

    Put it this way. What put me off most was that 'consumer device' label it is given, but so far, and re: the Oracle, I think that is rather unfairly dismissive of it. Stick the DB in a 'conventional' shiny chrome and stainless steel case and chassis, and put an Italian-style name on it, and I suspect the price would close to double.
    Last edited by Saracen999; 05-01-2022 at 10:13 AM.
    A lesson learned from PeterB about dignity in adversity, so Peter, In Memorium, "Onwards and Upwards".

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