OpenVPN?

[Allen]

Hi all,

I'm wondering if I can get a little assistance. I'm working on a little project for work, but only have limited knowledge of VPN as few of our customers use it and those that do use expensive solutions like Fortinet etc.

What my problem is, we have a main "shop" with all of our servers and computers located in. We have just procured a new office for some of us to work from, but the servers are staying on the "shop" due to there being a small air conditioned room at the back used to keep the servers cool. So, we need a quick and cheap way of allowing us to stay on the domain from the new office.

I know that we could just setup VPN's from the machines at the new office to the server at work, but then they wouldn't be on the domain. I need to know if there's anything we can use (that's cheap as chips, we're a small business) that can keep a connection between the server in the shop and the network in the new office so all of the machines can connect to the domain without dialling up?

So I have had a quick look around and seen OpenVPN mentioned a few times, but I'm not sure if it's what I need. Their website seems to severely lack information about what it can do (either that or I'm tired and can't see it).

Is there any other solutions which could help? Any assistance or pointers in the right direction would be greatly appreciated.

[Jay]

I would use a draytek router at both ends, its quite easy to setup and not very expensive. OpenVPN is good but if you have never used it before its not really best to start in a production environment.

[Allen]

I would use a draytek router at both ends, its quite easy to setup and not very expensive. OpenVPN is good but if you have never used it before its not really best to start in a production environment.

Cheers for the advice Jay. Why Draytek out of curiosity? Do other routers not do VPN as well? Or are they reasonably cheap and do a good job?

[Jay]

Draytek are just really good for low end VPNs etc, we tend to use 2820s

[Allen]

Thanks mate, will check 'em out.

[gss03]

Another vote for using Drayteks for VPN endpoints.
The 2820's have come on a long way since the old 2600 series, which could do them, but had a tendancy to drop a lot (well for me anyway!)

[Allen]

Just had a look around (and at other routers which have VPN options on them) and they're all pretty expensive. I know £150 isn't a lot to get what we want but we really do need to keep costs down at the moment.

I had a look at the routers that we have (DG834's) and the technical specifications mention VPN pass-through and "permits secure access to your office or corporate network and enables you to host VPN services". Could we use these DG834's in the interim? Obviously they wouldn't be as good as alternatives costing 3 times as much, but for a small connection (literally 3 computers and a VoiP phone server in one location and 6-7 servers in another location) like ours would they suffice?

I can't say I've ever tried to get VPN working with my old DG834, will have to look into it tomorrow now as going to bed with a Lemsip.

[Jay]

passthrough means you would still need a VPN server behind the router.

[gss03]

<rant> You can if you have the time and energy to fart about with netgear routers, but think of this another way.
If this connection goes down - how many staff are affected by this downtime? - how much lost productivity could be lost ?

2 * £150 routers that do the job and do it well works better than a couple of £40 routers with OpenVPN on the servers at either end.

So yes you can do this the cheap way, but it will come back to bite you later. </rant>

[Jay]

<rant> You can if you have the time and energy to fart about with netgear routers, but think of this another way.
If this connection goes down - how many staff are affected by this downtime? - how much lost productivity could be lost ?

2 * £150 routers that do the job and do it well works better than a couple of £40 routers with OpenVPN on the servers at either end.

So yes you can do this the cheap way, but it will come back to bite you later. </rant>

I agree, keeping the business up and running is key for the sake of a few quid its worth the investment.

[Allen]

I also agree... but it's not my business, nor is it my money.

I will try and convince him tomorrow. Oh, and looking thouroughly through the DG834 manual, it looks like you don't need OpenVPN on a server at either end, it doesn't just do VPN pass-through it will actually create the VPN tunnels between the two routers and enable you to ping machines either side that are attached directly to the router.

According to the Netgear website, this was only possible on business style routers until recently. I guess we can try it and see how it goes? If it falls down, we can just RDP onto the terminal server to work, I just don't like using it all the time as I work too fast for it to keep up.

And ugh, Lemsip's are horrible!

[badass]

(that's cheap as chips, we're a small business)

And with that attitude, the business will remain small. Or even die.
I bet they also don't believe in paying for staff training. If I were you, I'd be constantly looking for another job

I hate pikey businesses. I've worked for a few in the past. Resigned from one without another job to go to. Best thing I ever did.

[madman045]

Small businesses is our client base and all of them use Draytek routers, we are slowly upgrading them from 2600/2800 to the 2820's mainly as the routers have come a long way, but also a lot have the option of ADSL2
Setting up a VPN with two Drayteks is very simple, I have a 2820 at home with an IPSec tunnel to our office from when I work from home.
As already mentioned, for a reliable and simple site to site VPN, Drayteks are easily worth their money.

[Allen]

And with that attitude, the business will remain small. Or even die.

I hate pikey businesses.

Wow, that's a bit harsh...

You don't know anything about our business, so please refrain from making judgements about us. Just because I'm trying to keep costs to a minimum (especially in this current financial climate) doesn't mean we're a bad business. Thank you.

[peterb]

I haven't used two Drayteks back to back, but as a client to network VPn, they really do work well. From the point of view of ease of set up, they are also worth the money.

Currently it is possible to buy 2820s at about £120 (I assume that you'e business is VAT registered). Offset that expense against corportaion tax (if you are a limited company) and thsat effectively reduces the cost of 2 to £200 for 2.The other features that may be of use include using a 3G dongle for backup, which you may want to factor into a business continuity plan.

Netgear to make good routers, but you are essentially looking at using a domestic consumer product in a business environment.

I can understand your need to reduce costs, but how much is it compared with the annual cost of your internet connection.

You really need to sit down and write a good business case. Look at the alternatives, the costs, and the risks, and if you can, do a cost/benefit analysis. That will inform your recommendation, and the decision of your boss.

[Allen]

You really need to sit down and write a good business case. Look at the alternatives, the costs, and the risks, and if you can, do a cost/benefit analysis. That will inform your recommendation, and the decision of your boss.

Thanks, I'll certainly try and do that, coz I can see what the benefits would be.