Building a HTPC (SFF Build) Some advise please !!

Hello,

I am planning to build as stated above a SFF (HTPC) and have narrowed it down to the following :

1st. Build

- Silverstone SST-SG01-B Black
- Abit AN-M2HD Socket AM2
- Zalman CNPS8000 Socket
- AM2 Athlon 64 6000+ Dual Core
- Samsung SpinPoint T 500GB
- Corsair TWIN2X2048-6400 (2GB)

Roughly costing me about £397.00 and even cheaper if i go for an OEM AMD CPU...

2nd. Build

- Silverstone SST-SG01-B Black
- ABIT Fatal1ty F-I90HD Socket 775
- Zalman CNPS8000 Socket
- Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66 Ghz
- Samsung SpinPoint T 500GB
- Corsair TWIN2X2048-6400 (2GB)

Roughly costing me about £423.00..

Now my dilemma begins because initally i was bent on getting the AMD CPU but from what i have seen so far the (1.) E6750 out performs the AMD in nearly every respect.

(2) So do i spend a bit more or keep with the cheaper price (Money isnt that much of an issue atm)

(3) Due to me being keen on the AMD initially i know the mobo i have chosen is pretty decent but for the intel one i sort of chose it on the fly but have seen some decent reviews (with some minor issues)

Are there any better S775 mATX mobos out there...

(4) Besides not getting a stock cooler with the OEM package is there much of a difference between the AMD retail pack and OEM pack..

(5) Best price so far i have found for the E6750 is around £115.00 from YoYoTech you guys aware of any better deals..

(6) The PSU i will be using is a fairly new Akaka 400W so thats sorted but i haven't chose a graphics card either as i haven't done much extensive research on whats a good HDMI card. Also i will be planning to add iMON VDF which will bump up the price a little..

Thanks in advanced for any replies...

If you do choose the e6750 you'll want a G33 chipset motherboard.

http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...Thumbnails=yes

If this going to be your main pc for games etc..?

If so the 8800GTS fits in the SG01 if not then the boards in question have onboard graphics which are fine for desktop applications and the mobo you picked out for the AMD has onboard HDMI from memory.

Thats cooler although im sure it will do the job may struggle with the AMD as the 6000+ is borderline as far as the AMD chip its based on can be pushed.. im sure it will work though.

The intel chip of the G33 boards will actually overclock to further out do the AMD if you wanted to.

Difference between OEM processor and retail is perhaps the warranty? as well as the cooler as mentioned

Just out of interest whats makes the G33 chipset mobo a better choice, because i was looking for a mobo with an HDMI output...(as both mobos i listed below have HDMI output)

Yeah the PC will be my main PC which i may play the odd game (not a hardcore PC Gamer more into consoles)

Also does the 8800GTS have any HDMI output as i cant see it anywhere from what i have searched

Lastly you stated that "If so the 8800GTS fits in the SG01" (Is that to say most PCIx16 Graphics will have a hard time fitting in the SUGO, as this was the case with the cooler because i had to settle for a low profile one)

Thanks Again...

Lastly AMD or Intel - lol....:juggle:

well the G33 has native 1333mhz fsb support (the e6750 has 1333FSB) the ATi board I believe only supports 1066mhz so you may have trouble getting the e6750 to work at all. Thats no big loss as the e6600 will work and is better imo than the 6750 but will cost £15 or so more.

the 8800GTS is the longest card that fits the sg01 without removing the Hard Drive cage. The GTS is pretty much as long if not longer than almost every other graphics card currently avaliable except the 8800GTX/Ultra so you wont have trouble finding one that fits :)

The 8800GTS doesn't have a HDMI out, but you can buy a DVI to HDMI convertor for about £20 i think.

Cheers for the swift reply..

Hmmm £15 it does bump up the price considerably than the AMD is there much of a difference between the e6600 and e6750..

You aware of any graphics card with HDMI output direct from the card because one direct from the mobo does sound tempting. (But i am looking to generally build one without a dedicated graphics card initially, than add one later when it falls a bit cheaper)

Or does a direct HDMI output not matter that much..

Can't think of anything else to add but anything you could enlighten me upon from my first post would help or some better alternatives..

well am2 boards are supposed to support the next offering from AMD so you won't be short of upgrade potential afaik.

Another Idea would be to get something like the E4400 and overclocking it with the ATi board. that would save you a fair bit of moeny and will overclock to 3.0ghz and beyond with a decent cooler.. I'm not sure what you would get out of it with the cooler you specced.

I think my money would be on the AMD to be honest. If offers you everything you are looking for and is the cheapest option.

The 6000+ is comparable at stock speeds to the E6600 so it will be nipping at the e6750's heels anyway.

Haven't a clue about overclocking so i will stay well clear of that :O_o1:

I was reading a review about e6750 : hexus.net/content/item.php?item=9323&page=5

and it seems the e6750 almost rips apart the AMD 6000+

Money isnt too much of an issue but i doubt i will douse into the realms of getting the e6600 but would stretch for the e6750 with the G33 motherboards (from the scan link you sent me which would be the best mobo)

Lastly the AMD 6000+ would there be any cooling issues with it as i read recently that generally AMD's run at a higher temp and than intel's anything to take into consideration for the SFF pc....

yeah i think i mentioned it in the first place that the 6000 is at the amd's limit so temps will be high.

With regard to the G33 board i would normally recommend the asus board but i dont know much about that particular one.

http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...oductID=605384 this is the one to go for imo as it has all solid capacitors so should be very reliable.

When it comes to the perfomance you wont see much difference between the two day to day.. only if you're benchmarking or doing lots of video encoding etc would you find any difference..and the amd is still going to be good even if the intel is better.

You seem to get more choice for HTPC's with AMD as you've found with the abit HD boards.

"When it comes to the performance you wont see"...
Very Good point its true i wont be doing a lot of encoding anyways...

Temperature wise do you think it would be dangerously high not something that would instantaneously damage the CPU but would not be "healthy" so to speak...

Atm it looks like you got me leaning to the AMD even performance wise is slightly lacking but everyday job wise it will more than suffice just the temp issue..

With the retail HSF i believe it runs around 50 degrees which is tolerable but not fantastic.

I think this HSF fits in the sg01 which should keept it nice and cool (check the dimensions first though lol)

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Thermaltake/BlueOrb2

EDIT: Most places say its 66mm high and you have 78mm to play with so its would be fine.

thanks, 140 x 66 mm

Which ones the height as on custompc when they reviewed the SUGO, ST stated the HSF shouldn't be taller than the 78mm.

So thats why i went for the Zalman my only concern with buying anything else would be that it would block the RAM slots this might occur with the Zalman as well but i don't see myself putting anything like 8GB /16GB of ram lol...2GB for now and 4GB maybe laaaaaaaaaater on....

http://www.frostytech.com/articlevie...id=1991&page=4

zalman looks good actually.

Cool looks like i am going for the AMD lol..hoping the Zalman will keep it cool..

If you were me would go for the AMD or Intel just of curiosity..

Since i will save a bit with the AMD could you advise me of a graphics card with HDMI output which i could keep my eye on as knowledge on graphics cards is my weak point

I just see the memory and i am like...yeah that looks good lol...:mrgreen:

It's difficult. If I wasn't buying a dedicated graphics card i'd have the AMD becuase i prefer the mobos you can get..

with a dedicated graphics card I would get an intel with a g33 motherboard but i would probably overclock as well.

I wouldnt mind having the amd though as i quite like using my brothers x2 3800 amd.. its very nice to use.

I think the latest ATi graphics card have hdmi but i cant be sure if its just a dvi to hdmi convertor thrown in..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by staffsMike

It's difficult. If I wasn't buying a dedicated graphics card i'd have the AMD becuase i prefer the mobos you can get..

with a dedicated graphics card I would get an intel with a g33 motherboard but i would probably overclock as well.

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But i would be getting a AMD and a dedicated graphics sooner or later lol....

Do you think i should kick up much of a fuss with a graphics card with HDMI output...also if i didnt would the 8800 GTS (you were referring to the 320MB version one right ??) suffice

Last thing sound wise a HDMI cable would output both sound and video from the mobo but i have a creative audigy 2 ZS PCI card (7.1)

Do you 1. think that my card is now outdated compared to the onboard 7.1 sound or
2. if not when i default my sound driver to the creative one the audio would come from my card and video from the onboard HDMI port right ?

Last Last thing lol...the 8800 GTS which one do i get because the price varies from like £80 to like £170+...and i would be looking to spend like £100 max on a graphics card..

Mike,

Many thanks for the help but its time i get some ZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz's so speak to you soon..!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by x2dazee

Last thing sound wise a HDMI cable would output both sound and video from the mobo

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I'd be interested to know if that's correct. Also are there any PCI-E graphics cards (now or in the pipeline) with HDMI that also output audio?

Quote:

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Last Last thing lol...the 8800 GTS which one do i get because the price varies from like £80 to like £170+...and i would be looking to spend like £100 max on a graphics card..

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Are you sure about that? £180 seems a typical price from what I can see.

I am pretty sure HDMI outputs both sound and video from the same port, then again i could be wrong..

Oh yeah price on the card is a bit expensive £80 ??..must have been sleepy been it all like 12 in the evening/morning

Quote:

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Originally Posted by x2dazee

I am pretty sure HDMI outputs both sound and video from the same port, then again i could be wrong..

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It certainly can - the audio forms part of the data stream in between each video frame aiui. I just don't know if gfx hardware is using this possibility.

Yeah the Ati cards state they support HDMI video and 5.1 audio.

So in essence if i get a graphics card thats is HDCP/HDTV compatible and just use a DVI to HDMI connector i should be all set to go right ? In terms of getting HD output..

One more thing...i read somewhere if i was to get a 8800GTS it would be advisable to get at least a 500W+ PSU as a minimum is there any "truth" or advisable reasons to adhere to this.

Thanks..

Yeah that the way to do it

Getting the HDMI / DVI connector or the PSU...or both...:mrgreen:

If you are not a hardcore PC gamer, then the 8800 seems rather over the top.

The hard part to find on a cheap video card is HDCP if you want to show hi-def video via Windows. I presume given you call this an HTPC you want it quiet as well? That implies passive cooling rather than the monster fans on high end cards.

Perhaps something like this 8500GT card would do the trick for you for 55 quid. Graphics cards with audio in still seem very rare, so separate audio connection is still required to the tv.

From what you have said so far, integrated AMD video sounds like the most sensible option.

Good point it would save me splashing out on a 500w+ PSU obviously would be nice to have a top graphics card but like you rightly said i am not a hardcore gamer.

The card you pointed out looks pretty nifty lets say i was to push my budget up to like £80 for GFX card you got any other suggestions for a passively cooled card.

"integrated AMD video sounds like the most sensible option" - True say but i would splash out on a gfx card sooner or later as this would reduce the load on the CPU right...

The gigabyte one always makes me shudder..its looks horrible and the cooling on it sucks as well

I thought you were doing lots of gaming..my mistake lol

http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...oductID=615617

i have this one in my silent pc. Stays very cool (around 45 degrees) and looks to part to :p

http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...imilarProducts

Is that any good, from the scan website it puts a X in the HDCP Tech specs does that make it HD incompatible or just there is no HD Copyright protection. (talking about the Gainward)

Also does having more memory i.e. 512 necessarily make it a better graphics card.thanks.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by staffsMike

Yeah the Ati cards state they support HDMI video and 5.1 audio.

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Interesting. Are they effectively an integrated video/audio solution, or do you still need an audio card/mobo audio to feed them, with the gfx card effectively just multiplexing the audio into the video stream?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by x2dazee

from the scan website it puts a X in the HDCP Tech specs does that make it HD incompatible or just there is no HD Copyright protection. (talking about the Gainward)

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It means no High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection, so if you have a protected movie on HD DVD or Blu Ray (not all will be protected), you won't be able to watch it at high resolution, unless you subvert the protection methods. Unprotected content at high res isn't a problem.

In case it isn't obvious, to watch HDCP material without hacks, you need a gfx card with supports HDCP & a display device which supports HDCP.

Quote:

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Also does having more memory i.e. 512 necessarily make it a better graphics card.thanks.

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No. It means, in part, it has the capacity to cope with higher resolution displays. It's not something you need to worry about unless gaming on high spec monitors of typically 24" plus. In this context high res means significantly higher than a 1080p HD movie, so if you're using either a smaller or cheaper monitor or an HD tv, most current gfx cards will have enough memory for you (ie around 256MiB).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by staffsMike

The gigabyte one always makes me shudder..its looks horrible and the cooling on it sucks as well

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I know it looks a bit Fugly, but Gigabyte passive cards used to be cooled by Zalman who are generally trusted to get it right. My 6600GT certainly was Zalman cooled. Have they changed that?

The few reviews i could find for it were very negative, as were those for the asus passive 8500gt. The gainward or leadtek passive ones are the way to go imo.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by staffsMike

The few reviews i could find for it were very negative, as were those for the asus passive 8500gt. The gainward or leadtek passive ones are the way to go imo.

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Is that the case with the 256MB Sapphire HD2600XT PCI as well.....

I found the following Club 3D 8600GT Passive Heatpipe Gfx card..what are your thoughts.

http://www.club3d.nl/index.php/produ...phics/item/276

So difficult getting a gfx card that is quiet (prefably passively cooled) and wouldn't die playing a few odd games i.e. good frame rate etc...

I dont know anything about that one.. looks alright but id still have the gainward i think..just personal preference and they have good CS

Only thing stopping from me investing in the Gainward is that there is no support for the HDCP..will the Gainward be pretty good for games...

Also do you know of any cards (sorry about this) that cost in the regions of £80 - £100, which are passively cooled have HDCP and good for games

So that i could get it later on when the price falls..thanks