New System Please Advise on spec

[Snake007uk]

Hi Guys,

I am looking to setup a new system from scratch and I need some help. I have never in the past overclocked a CPU.
This is however going to change with this setup.

I was looking to buy a quad for a simple reason, I do some video encoding, and picture editing, also I want to cover
my self buy getting a quad as I know in the future next 6 months to a year most applications will be threaded to
some extent therefore utilising multi core cpu's, so why not get one which is a quad core and very fast

Another note is I am going to buy 8GB of memory (Yes I will be running Vista 64bit). I have had 2GB in my
current system and I am hitting it constantly, also getting 4gb would be good, however since I always
have alot of apps open constantly I thought it would better just to get as much memory as possible and its cheap so why not?

The system was thinking of building was as follows:

Intel Q9450

Corsair 4GB DDR2 XMS2 PC2-6400C5 TwinX (2x2GB) * 2 (recommended my
Overclockers.co.uk) was going to buy OCZ

Abit IX38 QuadGT Intel X38 (Socket 775) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard (recommended my Overclockers.co.uk)

Arctic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro CPU Cooler (Socket LGA775)
Western Digital Raptor 150GB 10000RPM
Tagan TG900-U88 900w BZ-Series Modular PSU
Asus HD3870 GDDR4 (This is temp until june/july when some new more powerful graphics card come out
Antec Nine Hundred Ultimate Gaming Case


I am now thinking is it worth spending extra £100 on a CPU which has not been revied? So I dont know the overclockability
of the cpu? Also Since I could always upgrade if I really wanted to why not by a cheaper cpu now (E8400) until I
need to get a quad, and I am sure when the Nehelem processor comes out these socket 775/771 will go down in price?


I was thinking about phenom but it looking more and more like bang for buck, Q6600 beats the phenom, but with
E8400 (although dual core) can be overclocked with air cooling to 4Ghz. This would help in my games:

Command and conquer 3
Company of heroes (if I ever stop getting NAT Error)
Call of duty

Starcraft 2 (when it comes out)

So my dilemma is, should I wait to see the reviews and pay the extra now and get the Q9450 or get the E8400?
I dont want to stuck with a cpu (i could sell on ebay but probably wont get much money back).

Im not intrested in Q6600 because E8400 would better for the same price, since it would give 45nm and more cache,
which would be more usefull.

Also I would like comments on which motherboard to buy, in the past I have bought ASUS boards (its more hit and miss
with Asus). Abit board which I own have been rock solid for me. Which would be good buy?

Also is Asus hd 3870 best one to get? or is another brand better?

Basically is what I am buying good for overclocking? is the cpu cooler good? is there anything else I should get/know
about?


Im sorry for the long post, I was trying to cover everything, please feel to ask as many questions as needed, i watch
these forums 24/7 and refresh like every 10 secs

Just a side note, my current system is:

AMD 3500+
2GB OCZ platinum memory
Asus motherboard
Nvidia GF6600GT
Nvidia GF8400GS (I have a triple monitor setup)

I have forced my self to stay with this setup, because at the time my games under XP and my apps were ok, now its
really beginning to bug me, I could probably last another month or two MAX before someone get hurt LOL

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

[Webby]

If you go for the Q9450 then you are going to need faster Memory if you plan to overclock, I would personally go for a Q6600 instead should clock up to about 3.6GHz but will depend on the chip, then 800MHz memory will be fine

You do not need anything like a 900w PSU a Corsair HX520w should be more than ample for your setup.

I would also personally get 2 slower hard drives over the raptor, utilising a small partition on one drive for the OS and then another drive for everything else this should give you good access speeds for the OS and will mean that the OS drive will not get cluttered and slow down. I would go for 2 WD AAKS quiet and fast

Finally if your serious about overclocking a quad core I would say you need a better CPU cooler, look at the Thermalright Ultima 90 or Ultra 120 Extreme or the Scythe Ninja or Mine, all more expensive than the arctic cooling freezer but all are quieter and substantially better at cooling.

[Snake007uk]

cooling wise I was going to chnage that to the Scythe Ninja,

however the Q6600 over 8400 I am not sure, because the benefits of E8400 currently with apps not taking advantage of quad/dual core. It will run games faster etc....

Memory wise I was going to go for OCZ 4GB (2x2GB) PC2-8000C5 1000MHz ReaperX HPC Enhanced Bandwidth Edition Dual Channel DDR2 (OCZ2RPX10004GK), however it was recommended to stick with the corsair as they would hit 1000MHZ?

I would be happy with 3.6ghz overclock, as antyhing over 3ghz games do not benefit and its starts becoming the Graphics cards issue. Which I will address once something that can play crysis at very high settings comes out.

I like the Tagan power supplies and I am just covering my back just incase i get a super duper graphics card later etc....

Normally I just use raptor for OS and Progs, and a second drive for downloads, games and swap partition. This normally works fine for me

[Biscuit]

for the price of raptors you can get much much bigger drives and run them on raid which would give you far faster access speed than raptors anyway. An added bonus to this solution is you would lose the airplane like sound that comes from raptors.

Tagen power supplies are good, but what webby says still stands and 900w is way overkill unless you plan to run 2 9800 GX2s and raid. To give you plenty of room for the future the very furthest i would push is 700w bu i would probably be happy with the corsair HX620

The benefits of the Q6600 over the E8400 is a common question at the moment and rather than dipping into the debate again your probably better off just reading other peoples threads http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-hardwa...-oc-games.html
http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-hardwa...160-q6600.html

To cut a long story short... most people go for the Q6600, just seems the sensible option bang for buckwise

[Snake007uk]

So you agree i should not jump the gun and get Q9450 just yet?

Raid is good solution, I dont mind the drive noise soo much, howver running at 10k rpm does have its benefits, considering I will run games off seperate drive, and I still have my 36gig raptor, I could do

36GB raptor OS, and main utils only
150GB raptor, Progs and Games
500GB downloads and other rubbish

[Biscuit]

lol well its your call but i would have

2 x 500GB raid - op sys and games
500GB downloads and other rubbish. I dont see really how the 10000RPM drive does benefit it myself

http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-hardwa...confusion.html there is a thread discussing it

As for the CPU question, if your considering the Q9*** quads over Q6600 and you have the money to spend then yeah i suppose its worth going for the newer ones so you can utilize the SSE4 features (i reckon this may play more a part in video and image editing) however, their lifespan is apparently quite greatly reduced with increases in voltage so whilst they can overclock its probably best not too.

Oh and another point, dont bother witht he OCZ reaper ram witht he crazy heatsinks, totally unnecissary and will just get in the way of CPU coolers. Go for the corsair stuff

[Blitzen]

Hi Guys,

I am looking to setup a new system from scratch and I need some help. I have never in the past overclocked a CPU.
This is however going to change with this setup.

I was looking to buy a quad for a simple reason, I do some video encoding, and picture editing, also I want to cover
my self buy getting a quad as I know in the future next 6 months to a year most applications will be threaded to
some extent therefore utilising multi core cpu's, so why not get one which is a quad core and very fast

Another note is I am going to buy 8GB of memory (Yes I will be running Vista 64bit). I have had 2GB in my
current system and I am hitting it constantly, also getting 4gb would be good, however since I always
have alot of apps open constantly I thought it would better just to get as much memory as possible and its cheap so why not?

The system was thinking of building was as follows:

Intel Q9450

Corsair 4GB DDR2 XMS2 PC2-6400C5 TwinX (2x2GB) * 2 (recommended my
Overclockers.co.uk) was going to buy OCZ

Abit IX38 QuadGT Intel X38 (Socket 775) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard (recommended my Overclockers.co.uk)

Arctic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro CPU Cooler (Socket LGA775)
Western Digital Raptor 150GB 10000RPM
Tagan TG900-U88 900w BZ-Series Modular PSU
Asus HD3870 GDDR4 (This is temp until june/july when some new more powerful graphics card come out
Antec Nine Hundred Ultimate Gaming Case


I am now thinking is it worth spending extra £100 on a CPU which has not been revied? So I dont know the overclockability
of the cpu? Also Since I could always upgrade if I really wanted to why not by a cheaper cpu now (E8400) until I
need to get a quad, and I am sure when the Nehelem processor comes out these socket 775/771 will go down in price?


I was thinking about phenom but it looking more and more like bang for buck, Q6600 beats the phenom, but with
E8400 (although dual core) can be overclocked with air cooling to 4Ghz. This would help in my games:

Command and conquer 3
Company of heroes (if I ever stop getting NAT Error)
Call of duty

Starcraft 2 (when it comes out)

So my dilemma is, should I wait to see the reviews and pay the extra now and get the Q9450 or get the E8400?
I dont want to stuck with a cpu (i could sell on ebay but probably wont get much money back).

Im not intrested in Q6600 because E8400 would better for the same price, since it would give 45nm and more cache,
which would be more usefull.

Also I would like comments on which motherboard to buy, in the past I have bought ASUS boards (its more hit and miss
with Asus). Abit board which I own have been rock solid for me. Which would be good buy?

Also is Asus hd 3870 best one to get? or is another brand better?

Basically is what I am buying good for overclocking? is the cpu cooler good? is there anything else I should get/know
about?


Im sorry for the long post, I was trying to cover everything, please feel to ask as many questions as needed, i watch
these forums 24/7 and refresh like every 10 secs

Just a side note, my current system is:

AMD 3500+
2GB OCZ platinum memory
Asus motherboard
Nvidia GF6600GT
Nvidia GF8400GS (I have a triple monitor setup)

I have forced my self to stay with this setup, because at the time my games under XP and my apps were ok, now its
really beginning to bug me, I could probably last another month or two MAX before someone get hurt LOL

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

1. iX38 QuadGT - Great choice and very easy to overclock. DONT buy it from OCUK though. Its about £20 cheaper at Yoyotech (i bought mine from there a few months back. See the board here: YOYOtech . People will try and put you off this board and tell you to go with an IP35 or such like. Dont let them Its a great board.

2. The E8400 is decent yes. To get a GOOD overclock though you have raise the voltage a little too high for comfort. This, in turn will DRAMATICALLY reduce the life of the core. For £130-150 its poor value. I have had my Q6600 at 3.4ghz without touching the voltage at all.
Quad, whichever flavour, has a better lifespan and is very stable on this board. If anyone says that the E8400 should run cooler aswell, just ignore them. At a decent overclock the Wolfadale will definitely be hotter than the Quad.

Also...you must remeber, the E8400 will definitely not give you better performance in game. One a multi core CPU hits 3ghz, it will make absolutely no difference. A point to consider though is that some games are now being optimized for quad core. Look at UT3 for example. Runs better on a Quad than a dual core. There is however no game that runs better on dual core. Make of that what you will.

3. The OCZ memory is fine. Corsair isnt a good overclocker and its over priced. Im not saying the Corsair is worse than other brands, but the fact is its DEFINITELY no better than Geil/OCZ/G-Skill/Crucial. This: OCZ 2GB (2x1GB) PC2-6400C4 Dual Channel Platinum Revision 2 XTC Series DDR2 (OCZ2P800R22GK) is an EXCELLENT buy and 2 sets of this (4gb) would run very nicely - I cant believe this is so cheap. I paid £120 for this RAM in MArch last year

4. Consider this as a cooler: Computer hardware and software at amazing prices, available online from Scan Computers UK . Its a fantastic cooler. Good for overclocking. Cheaper than most and does very well in all tests. I can personally vouch for this cooler as mine keeps a Q6600 @ 3.4ghz under 43 degrees load.
The Artic cooler is ok but its noisy and not a particularly good performer. Its icheap though.

5. Raptor = Waste of cash imho. A good larger HD with 16 or 32mb of cache will perform practically aswell. It will be cheaper also and have alot more room.

[Snake007uk]

Cheers for the advice

The HDD point I have taken into consideration, the CPU, if it is not safe to overclock 45nm because you reduce the life span, I might just leave them stock (still Q9450 will be faster )

SSE4 will help me with some video/photo editing i do.. so Now the decision is which

[Blitzen]

Cheers for the advice

The HDD point I have taken into consideration, the CPU, if it is not safe to overclock 45nm because you reduce the life span, I might just leave them stock (still Q9450 will be faster )

SSE4 will help me with some video/photo editing i do.. so Now the decision is which

The Quad will also be better at video editing.

The 45nm CPUs are safe to overclock, but only to a point. 45nm technology isnt designed to have big voltage increases put through it. Once you start hitting the bigger overclocks, this is what will cause the damage.

6 weeks ago i had EXACTLY the dilemna you are having.
Choices being:
1. Wolfdale
2. Hold for the Q9450
3. Q6600

Decisions made because:
1. Wolfdale is overpriced and only a good overclocker/hit the high clocks if you are prepared to stick half the national grid through it.
2. Q9450 - Almost decided to hold on but apparently, from alot of the reviews, it wont do anything more than a Q6600.
3. Q6600 - The decision was made for this because of the good price point. Also, seeing the points above, i couldnt justify another £100 for a Q9450 that wont really outperform it noticeably.
In the same token, i wasnt prepared to spend £130-150 on a dual core CPU. Whatever way its dressed up, thats ALL it is....just another dual core.

[Snake007uk]

1. LOL, I didnt think there would be much in the board however some people do have there preferences ps, its the same price at overclockers.co.uk just checked

2. My concern about voltage increase is valid then, I dont want to reduce the life of a cpu for just a overclock. I agree a quad core will definatly be better, the question now is, if I am going to get quad should I even bother with the Q6600 when the Q9450 is round the corner?

3. OCZ memory it is then I only changed my mind becuase Overclockers suggested this memory, I did say to them I was looking at Q9450 unless i put Q6600 accidently

4. That is the cooler I will be getting

5. I dont agree here, I think 10krpm makes a big difference, the problem mostly is people put everything on there main drive, this is where issue is. The 150gb raptor comes with 16mb cache, I will use it as my programs drive, and my 36GB drive as my OS and utils drive and my 3rd drive will be my downloads and swap drive althought with 8GB of memory I think i could turn swap off

[Blitzen]

1. LOL, I didnt think there would be much in the board however some people do have there preferences ps, its the same price at overclockers.co.uk just checked

2. My concern about voltage increase is valid then, I dont want to reduce the life of a cpu for just a overclock. I agree a quad core will definatly be better, the question now is, if I am going to get quad should I even bother with the Q6600 when the Q9450 is round the corner?

3. OCZ memory it is then I only changed my mind becuase Overclockers suggested this memory, I did say to them I was looking at Q9450 unless i put Q6600 accidently

4. That is the cooler I will be getting

5. I dont agree here, I think 10krpm makes a big difference, the problem mostly is people put everything on there main drive, this is where issue is. The 150gb raptor comes with 16mb cache, I will use it as my programs drive, and my 36GB drive as my OS and utils drive and my 3rd drive will be my downloads and swap drive althought with 8GB of memory I think i could turn swap off

Ahhh...the board was £150+ a few weeks back.

On your HD point...i have just set up 2 x 500GB Samsung Spinpoints and in HDTach its quicker than a single Raptor. Thats 1TB of storage for just £110. Good value im sure you will agree. Some things though, im sure the Raptor will be quicker at. Not much though.
(And the Raptors are bloody loud )

AS far as the memory goes, i cant think why OCUK would tell you that unless they have a shed load of it which i suspect.
That OCZ, for £23 is INCREDIBLE value.

[Snake007uk]

Blitzen, you have made some valid points

I am seriously considering the Q6600 at this point, the power supply tagan over a corsair 620, will this be enough to run

Q6600
8GB mem
AMD 3870XT
(next gen graphics card, lets just say 9800GX2 for now)
raptor 36gb
raptor 150gb
WD 500GB SATA
2 * DVD RW

This is a rough setup

[Snake007uk]

Ill stick with OCZ since I have always used them and they are great plus lifetime warranty

I know what your saying about the 500GB, but my experiance as a Linux Sys SA who plays with Fibre channel vs scsi RPM does have a factor, I think it depends on loads of things, however your right in that it may not be much is it worth buying raptor over that? I dont know, ill check some more review sites.

[Snake007uk]

check out this review

Western Digital Raptor X 150GB Review at ExtremeTech
WD1500AD Raptor X-Tends Performance Lead | Tom's Hardware

its only in raid configs that drives start catching the raptor, (im not big fan of non hardware based raid setups)

[Blitzen]

Blitzen, you have made some valid points

I am seriously considering the Q6600 at this point, the power supply tagan over a corsair 620, will this be enough to run

Q6600
8GB mem
AMD 3870XT
(next gen graphics card, lets just say 9800GX2 for now)
raptor 36gb
raptor 150gb
WD 500GB SATA
2 * DVD RW

This is a rough setup

Personally, im not a fan of Tagan. Then again, im not a fan of Corsair either tbh Scan wil warranty the Corsair units but imho thats just not good enough. I want direct RMA with the manufacturer when things go wrong and unless you are prepared to send a faulty unit to the USA you will not get that with Corsair. Hence, they dont deserve European customers.
However, those new Tagans look amazing and the modular connections look like someone has actually thought about them which is good. Tagans have a very chequered history though and that would put me off until these have been out a while (very new units in the range).

If i was spending £100 on a PSU today i would buy this: Computer hardware and software at amazing prices, available online from Scan Computers UK

These new Enermax PSUs are bloody lovely (im ordering one on Tuesday when Scan opens after the bank holiday).
I saw one the other day and it absolutely oooooozed quality.
Enermax have a fantastic RMA in the UK aswell.

check out this review

Western Digital Raptor X 150GB Review at ExtremeTech

its only in raid configs that drives start catching the raptor, (im not big fan of non hardware based raid setups)

Yep.
I always RAID 0 my drives (I know...i know....im asking for trouble )

[Snake007uk]

I have had good experiance with Tagan, when i did once think i had an issue even though i did not have a reciept or box, they said just send it back we will replace it