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Lo,
I knew someone was going to start one of these eventually so it might as well be me right?
The only place I can find a GTX 280 ATM is eBay @ http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Zotac-NVidia-G...QQcmdZViewItem
If anyone knows of anywhere else I'll add it to the list.
1) eBay.co.uk
2) SCAN
3) Overclockers.co.uk
This is probably better in the shopping section, but scan and overclockers uk have them too.
Call it the e-peen thread. No reason to buy the over-priced poop that I can see.
Did someone say e-peen thread? Where shall I empty my bank account?
That's what I read too :laugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by SiM
Scan have them now!
http://www.scan.co.uk/Product.aspx?WebProductId=827835
Sorry if it's old news but didn't see it anywhere.
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by SiM
I have to agree though the GTX280 is for 1 of 2 kinds of people. 1. someone who needs the biggest epeen or 2. an nVidia fan boy who couldn't care about price.
There is no logical reason or even a remotely rational explanation for purchasing the GTX280 or what I like to call it: the dept maker...
Ebuyer have some 280s for £400.
Great site, as I am sure you all know!
Buy at your own peril. ;)
Very narrow-minded view of things.Quote:
Originally Posted by ExHail
I've been following these releases for a while as the lowest res my monitor supports is 1920x1200. There are a couple of games I cannot play that I would like to because of this. The GTX280 was a potential candidate for resolving this, alas its still a bit too slow for my liking.
You also must realise that everyone has a different amount of disposable income. What seems prohibitively expensive to one person, can be pocket change to another.
Basically, anything is worth it if it does what you want and you can afford to buy it. Anything else and compromises have to be made somewhere :)
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/145852
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/145888
I command you to find 280's for a cheaper price on launch day!
I have the money for this card but its just that Id much rather get good value for money on a card than be ripped off.
Sure, the card is twice as fast per board as the last generation and this is worth celebrating but it still doesn't justify the exorbitant cost...
I just don't know what I am going to buy instead...
The ATi's?Quote:
Originally Posted by FifthFreedom
Unless you want to game at 2560 x 1600 then don't bother with this thing.
This may be true but the actual price to power ratio is poor compared to even a much older card such as the 8800gt.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
I suggest you upgrade your monitor then... The dell screens (24 and 30 inch) work fine with lower than native resolutions...Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
In your situation, why not get a 9800 GX2 instead then? It will perform about the same in most games (even beating the GTX 280 in some).
Lol I just bought a 1900 x 1200 res Dell 24FS08 so I need something reasonable to power it.
I'll just wait for all the contenders to enter the ring and take my pick of the ones which can handle 1900 x 1200 and are good price to performance ratio.
So people actually think that the ATi cards might be better though? Or just better price to power ratio?
just better price to power ratioQuote:
Originally Posted by FifthFreedom
Well if the leaked results are anothing to go by the Hd4850 is percetly resaonable for 1920 x 1200 so the HD3470 will be prefect for it.
Unless you absolutely need to run everything with full AA all the time then there is little point spending all that money, it doesn't makes sense even if you are richy rich and can afford to.
They won't be better no, but they will be plenty good enough.
Yeah, and I'd rather spend half the money and upgrade twice as often.
Then you always have the upper hand.
Lol I guess I just hate waiting...
I have all the other parts now, so there just sitting there waiting for pixels.
I can tell my Antec 1200 is unhappy... ^^
Well even if you do want the nvidia, assuming the ATi cards are what we think they are.. nvidia will have to lower their prices to be competetive for the bulk of the market.
Having the best card is great.. but not if you ask as much as they are for it when ATi are doing a decent enough job at half the price lol
Anyone know if graphics cards such as the GTX280 are actually making use of PCI-E 2.0? I.e. is having a PCI-E v1 mobo going to start bottlenecking these things?
I doubt it. Doesn't seem to affect the GX2.
Narrow minded? Is that why you fit into one of the categories? Being rich doesn't mean you have to be stupid at the same time you know. Just having money to spend shouldn't necessarily mean you should through it away on items that aren't worth it.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
Precisely. At a high resolution there is no need for AA and some could even argue that AF could be turned down as well because the higher resolution naturally does these things already. The whole point of AA is to make lower resolutions looks as good as higher resolutions because of the lack of pixels to produce a smooth picture. Your resolution produces smooth pictures by default so AA is wasted power tbh as it basically smooths already smooth lines. You don't require a card that can turn everything to full at higher res because it looks better with higher res already.Quote:
Originally Posted by staffsMike
I haven't noticed any reviews comparing the two tbh so wouldn't really know. My guess is that it would have more of an effect on the GTX280 than the 9800GX2 because of its higher bandwidth and likewise for the other cards with high bandwidth. The thing is we aren't really sure what those gains would be yet as I haven't seen them get tested.Quote:
Originally Posted by staffsMike
From what I read some time ago I grant you, PCIe 8x was pretty much enough to run 8800's to within the high 90%'s of what PCIe x16 could.
So i'm pretty sure PCIe x16 has some life in it yet.
Good point. Was it an article on crossfire by any chance as I seem to recall something similar myself, you jogged my memory :DQuote:
Originally Posted by staffsMike
I guess from that you could safely say PCI-E2.0 wouldn't hold much of an advantage, it might be slight but nothing any one would notice anyway.
Smells like a bit of jealously on this thread. Price aside the GTX280 is the fastest single GPU card on the market. If you need the extra performance, can't or don't wish to use SLI (includes GX2) then what other options are there? I read talk about bang for buck and price/performance ratio. What's the point of having a good price/performance ratio when the game you want to play at a certain resolution and setting only runs at 10fps?
Sure, if you don't need it and you just want the latest and greatest for ePeen reasons then knock yourself out. However, there are plenty of gamers around with the disposable income and desire to run their games faster. Power to them.
What is worth? If you spend £500 on something that is slower and inferior in every way to something that's £300 then yes, that's arguably stupid. If you're spending £500 on something that's better in almost every way, except price to something that's £300 then the worth is subjective and relative to the user. You might think it's stupid for someone to spend double the amount for 25% (just random numbers) extra performance but for them the extra 25% could be the difference between enjoyable and annoyance.Quote:
Originally Posted by ExHail
It's not jealousy from my point of view. I could happly afford one of these if I wanted one.
The fact of the matter is, the 8800/9800GTX offers the bangs you need for 1920 x 1200.
The HD3870x2 and 9800GX2 offer way in excess of the bangs you need for 1920 x 1200.
The 280 just takes the piss. Not many people need that sort of power right now. In a year or so it might be different but in a year or so it might be at a reasonable price.
http://anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3334&p=11
http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.ph...1&limitstart=8
In both these reviews above the Gx2 is better at high res, granted early drivers etc but for a card thats considerably more expensive than the Gx2 it is still a bit daft to spend that much money on the new one !!
Wait untill the new ATI cards are out if only to see if the prices drop.
Firstly, I am FAR from being rich. Secondly, I am FAR from being stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by ExHail
In fact, you are the only person in this thread to show stupidity.......So, perhaps you need to go away and have a think about how the world can be viewed differently by different people. Your view on things is not the be-all and end-all of everything. Seriously, get over yourself.
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
When have I said my view point is the be all and end all? My view point is mine and mine alone and I don't expect you to understand it nor accept it for that matter.
That's a pretty broad statement and far from "fact". Crysis anyone? Even the ancient WoW won't run at 60fps+ all the time at 1920x1200 with a 8800GTX (I have one and play WoW regularly at that resolution) with everything on maximum, although it's not far off. I would say the 9800GX2 is a good match for 1920x1200 but excess would be a stretch. My 8800GTX struggles with some CNC3 battles, although that could be due to the game's rendering engine too.Quote:
Originally Posted by staffsMike
EDIT: I bought the 8800GTX when it first came out and paid over around £400 give or take for the privilege (sarcasm). At the time I thought it was overkill for anything I wanted to play and it was partly true. Over a year and a half later and extensive gaming it's still kicking along. Even in hindsight I think it was money well spent, all things considered.
The sheer fact that you cannot accept that this card is useful/worth it to someone shows that you do not accept any view but your own.Quote:
Originally Posted by ExHail
You've made your mind up and everyone else is wrong.
Why do you need it to run over 60FPS? 30FPS is playable and of course you may have to lower settings slightly in some games. But I'm yet to see a game that refuses to be played at 1920 x 1200 on an 8800/9800GTX other than perhaps the obvious one.
I don't get the whole having to run games maxed out thing though so if you are like this deffinatly don't listen to me :D
Assume this question was for me? To be honest, the FPS meter in the WoW mod I use may be wrong. Let's assume it's just an indicator. From a gaming experience when this number drops under 45-50 I really notice a "jitter" that I find extremely annoying. Once it drops under 40 I find it unplayable (yes, I'm fussy). Sure, games will run and run decently on those cards but there are some people who don't find that acceptable. My friend plays WoW at a lower resolution at 20-30fps and has for over a year. I simply wouldn't bother playing in those conditions. Then again, I'm willing to spend the cash to "fix" it.Quote:
Originally Posted by staffsMike
Do I think the GTX280 is good value for money? Hell no. Will I buy one? Not inclined at the moment until I see what ATI have to offer. The only reason I'm waiting for ATI is because I use a Crossfire motherboard that I really like. The last 780i motherboard I tried was a nightmare.
You must have the multisample set pretty high in WoW.
Mine is set to 2x with everything else maxed @ 2560x1600 and never drop below 45ish. 95% of the time I am sat at 60FPS. It appears to be a few specific effects (normally fire or fire-like) that cause the FPS to drop below 60.
At higher multisample settings, the framerate drops significantly.....and I honestly do not see that much of a difference between them at these high resolutions.
No. What I've done is categorise what you term useful/worth into words that describe your version of logic which is of course my own logic and personal view which does not have any bearing on anyone else. I have not neglected the fact that it is useful to others. Quite the contrary I have accepted it is but have said that from my point of view its not a very good logical decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
I have allowed you to keep your view but you continually tell me to bugger off with mine... seems your description of me fits you pretty well from where I am standing.
Show me where I told you to shove your view? Where do I disagree with you? I said you were narrow-minded, nothing else.Quote:
Originally Posted by ExHail
Care to explain how that is anything other then narrow-minded or childish?Quote:
I have to agree though the GTX280 is for 1 of 2 kinds of people. 1. someone who needs the biggest epeen or 2. an nVidia fan boy who couldn't care about price.
No logical reason or even remotely rational explanation.......Care to explain the logic behind that statement?Quote:
There is no logical reason or even a remotely rational explanation for purchasing the GTX280 or what I like to call it: the dept maker...
So, because someone can afford to spend £400 on a graphics card they are suddenly rich and stupid. Care to explain how you reached that conclusion?Quote:
Narrow minded? Is that why you fit into one of the categories? Being rich doesn't mean you have to be stupid at the same time you know. Just having money to spend shouldn't necessarily mean you should through it away on items that aren't worth it.
You have done nothing in this thread but prove you are a bigot.
Personally, I'd never buy a card that costs me more than £230
So far the most expensive was £200 and thats my sweet spot TBH.
Still annoyed at that one as I bought it at exactily the wrong time and I could have waited for a couple of months and got an 8800 GT thats better in every way and cost £50 less.
However, for £450 I can easily see someone justifiably buying a GTX 280. It is still the fastest single GPU card available and it has access to a proper amount of memory as well.
Anyone that can't see that has the blinkers on.
Mind you, I still think its mad that a graphics card alone costs more than any console!
Anyway, I'm waiting to see performance and pricing on the ATI Radeon 4870
I'm sure everyone will agree that this is the best single gpu card. No one can really argue there.
It's more to do with actually requiring that amount of power, as most don't. So there is little justification buying the card regardless of cost but espeically as it's double or more the price of the cards that can do the same job for most people :)
Yes, I have my multisample set 2-3 from the bottom (maximum). You are correct, there is little difference in the visual quality at a cost of a notable drop in framerates for the last 2-3 notches. I've compromised by turning it down but it's still a compromise in my book :). I'd say 95% of the time it isn't a problem but the remaining 5% annoys the hell out of me!Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
Like many IT contractors I get significant tax offsets for any PC hardware I buy so the "equivalent" cost compared to say a PAYE employee is a lot less. What others see as a £450 card is a lot less in real terms. For instance, I don't have to pay VAT which is an instant 17.5% saving. Then the card is written off as a company expense over 3 years. No NI or higher income tax is applicable either so suddenly the price/performance ratio is very different.
Exhail and shaithis could you both just agree to disagree, everyone has different opinions and thats what makes a good discussion but it has just got a bit out of hand and is bringing the thread down a tone.
Generally i think the biggest gripe people have with this is the fact that the price is a bit steep for what you are getting and this has been exagerated by its relation to the GX2. If it were even £399 then i think people would see something slightly different, its just the big 4 there (and the extra £50 or so ontop :P) that to most people is atleast half the cost of their entire system.
Some people will find it acceptable:
There are plenty more to this list but there are just a few valid reasons why people will buy it, they may not seem valid to you but then another mans rubbish is another mans gold.
- Those who simply want the best performance they can get (some don't agree with this on what you pay but its just like overclocking, some people want the most they can get, doesn't N20 cooling seem a little nuts aswell :O_o1:)
- Those who want a card to last them a very long time without having to upgrade in the future
- Those who just like to have new technology
- Those who want to run everything on super high (even though to some this isn't important, to others it is incredibly important)
- Those who want to compliment a very strong rig with an equally strong graphics card, along the lines of why gimp out my computer when everything else can do what i ask of it
In my opinion it is better to wait and see the offering from ATI, it is only about a week away and hey if the ATI offerings can supply more to you then you have just saved yourself loads of hassle and probably money too. In waiting it might also see the price of the GTX 280 drop a bit, even if by £10, thats still some beer to drink with your new card :P, and the supply of the GTX 280 will be better so that you can probably get the exact card you want instead of a different one because its the only one available (even if this is for the sticker on the card or more so that the warranty of another is better).
Do these not constitute you telling me I'm wrong in a nice way?>Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
To me these are saying, in a very subtle way, that I am wrong and you are right so I should just keep quiet and leave the argument. I may be wrong but that is the feeling I receive from those posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
My reasoning is that I have yet to find a valid reason for paying that sort of money for an item that does its job no better than an earlier edition card that costs far less. Therefore from my point of view only people with money to waste and those that want the latest and greatest equipment could possibly rationalise the purchase of the card. To me those are not valid reasons to purchase a card, just because you have money doesn't mean you should spend it. You could easily buy 2 GTX260's and put them in SLI and they would out perform the GTX280 while still being cheaper. There are other options to the GTX280 that make more sense... that is my view and is where I derive that statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
In all this healthy debate you have yet to give a reason to spend that much money on the GTX280 that has not been countered by a perfectly logical reason that proves(in my view) that it isn't justified. My cousin plays all his games at 1920X1200 with a 8800GTS 640Mb without any lag and most the settings on the highest(the ones that actually make a difference in the games overall appearance). As I have said earlier in this thread at such high resolutions some settings are actually pointless because the whole point of the setting itself is to provide high resolution quality for lower resolutions.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
From my point of view I don't accept having to have every little setting on absolutely maximum at the highest possible resolution a valid reason for needing a GFX card. Nor do I accept the fact that having the money means you should be spending it.
I never reached that conclusion you incorrectly deduced that from my statement. My statement simply means that having money to spend is not a valid argument for purchasing an expensive product. Its the same as what staffsMike has said on numerous occasions just put it in a different way. Unfortunately you misunderstood what I meant by the statement so hopefully that clears it up for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
Why do you have to continually belittle me by either calling me names or making derogatory statements like "get over yourself".Quote:
Originally Posted by shaithis
Honestly have I called you names in this thread... I think not. So why do you have to call me names? Its rather unsporting and rather rude of you to do this. Before now I was under the impression we were having a healthy debate but it seems you aren't taking it the same way since you resort to name calling and otherwise derogatory statements being made towards me.
I can completely understand why you make your posts and I also understand your reasoning behind wanting to purchase a GFX for such a high price. All my view is that I do not think your reasons are justified from my point of view. StaffsMike has said the same and so have others. I accept your view but why do you continually fight my view scrutinising every little word I post as if I am evil and you need to get rid of me.
What utter rubbish. If you cannot see the difference between your posts and StaffsMikes, then there is very little hope for you in society.
Have a nice day,
Saw your post to late... my bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by ikix
I won't pursue the issue further, I was just hoping to provide some clarification as to why I said those things so my actions were explained.
It didn't help him calling me a bigot either :(
I do not wish to take away from your discussion, thanks for letting me know I was getting a bit out of hand though. If you never said something I was quite happy to continue, I enjoy debating a little too much :D
/me Offers his hand to shaithis for a curteous end to the debate
Most of those are valid. "Those who want the card to last for a very long time" is however, not. Far better to get a card at half the price and 75% of the capability and spend the same again in half of that very long time. Overall you will get a better experience. Unless you think it's valid to make a bad purchasing decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by ikix
Lol, love debating to, usually get carried away but end up looking like an idiot :DQuote:
Originally Posted by ExHail
I understand your point and it is probably what most would do in that situation now thinking of it but in my time (not exactly old enough to justifiably say that :embarrassed:) i have come across some who will stick to the best they can get because they feel they wont have the money in the future to upgrade (simply because they have itchy fingers and want to spend the left over cash :P)Quote:
Originally Posted by Thorsson