Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

  1. #1
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked
    0 times in 0 posts

    Lightbulb Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Hello people, new kid on the block

    I start this thread cause...well, after cheking some recent technologies, new products & the like, and wishing- daydreaming about the "future" and coming stuff a possible super duper custom rig, I came with some questions, ideas, crazy thoughts etc etc etc; so I decided to finally post'em on a forum to share'em and exchange ideas and info. Maybe I won't post'em all in the first post, but I will try to post all my wacky stuff.
    With that being said, here we go....

    Starting with the "heart - mind &soul" of a PC, nehalem is here with us, anice piece of sillicon and gulftown is coming soon and good MoBos, however there's been a "drought" on the X58 front, furthermore, theres plenty of stuff that I would like to get improved/implemented on their platforms. I will try to elaborate and be more explicit.
    Good examples I'll try to "conect", ASUS, MSI, EVGA.
    The "supercomputer" series of Mobos by ASUS & their good implementation of something "unusual"- the multiple PCI-E x 16 lanes.
    MSI with their "genie" and the support and inclusion of the HYDRA chip.
    EVGA now, with the XL-ATX platform, joining the fray with the innovations and fresh air for the computer world. But, here's my great point and question- What about someone(either one) combining all these nifty characteristics?
    A MoBo- on XL-ATX form factor, a "genie" that manages to handle in real time the power load so as to not use everything at 100% when unneeded and pump "juice" when it is really needed, which also happens to include...say...a couple HYDRA chips to help with the badwith AND improvement of Crossfire/SLI. Wouldn't that be really neat? Wouldn't that be AWESOME to see and even have? You know it is; so, What is preventing such an outstanding piece of hardware from showing up? (and no please, no capitalistic, marketing, sales shares, financial stuff here, throw all that as far away as you can, and lets try to focus on the technical-manufacture side of what is preventing that) What is so big and complicated that would be preventing such a killer hardware??? Furthermore, SKULLTRAIL was announced-or more like hinted- the last summer, What's preventing it too? Heck, imagine all of these combined: genie, HYDRA, skulltrail 2 plenty of PCI-E lanes.
    Some minutes ago I got a glimpse at a new EVGA MoBo. the 4 way SLi & not only that but saw the DUAL LGA - 1366, nifty, cool & quite possibly a step in the right direction (or at least the direction we are dealing with here) So, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, What about that? pounder that for a minute, ok?

    Very well, after that minute, let me continue, and go a little bit beyond on this visionary
    /insane proposition. Why also limit the amount of RAM to 24 GB??? All X58 platforms are pretty much "limited" by that; sure, there's not many kits out there that can reach that amount, with MANY rather than ANY the key word here, by saying so come immediately to my mind for example CRUCIAL, the folks at crucial memory have already 24 GB tri-kits, such as:<go find'em yourselves, the forum is telling me I can't post URLs, sorry guys>
    Expensive? SURE, but there are for the taking, so exactly WHAT is preventing any of the aforementioned players ( + the ones not mentioned) from upping the bar from the 24 GB limit right up to 48, 50, 60 GBs ???

    There's also some articles/news on here at techpowerup & some other places reporting "improvements" and "increased yields" on nand flash, So what about an increase in these mentioned densities in production and in reaching DIMMs of 10 GB ??? Can you imagine instead of "only" being able to stick 24 GB of RAM be able to stick 60 !!!! ????

    And last but not least with all these PLUSES, what about polishing and standarazing the XL-ATX , with MoBos that instead of only having at most 7 slots, go way up to 8 or even 10?
    No cases? No problem, they can be made, case builders just need the excuse to make'em, actually Thermaltake already have a case with up to 10 pci slots (armor or kandalf??? can't remember).

    So what do you think guys? I know what Im posting is extreme, perhaps borderline madness, but certainly it is not impossible to achieve. What do you guys think?
    Please share your ideas, opinions...dreams on the matter. Im really looking forward for people with great knowledge to post, give their input, so maybe we can all come with some neat platforms....and maybe the manufacturers will pay attention and decide to give the leap.

    Thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    jim
    jim is offline
    HEXUS.clueless jim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Location: Location:
    Posts
    11,457
    Thanks
    613
    Thanked
    1,645 times in 1,307 posts
    • jim's system
      • Motherboard:
      • Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z
      • CPU:
      • i5 2500K @ 4.5GHz
      • Memory:
      • 8GB Corsair Vengeance LP
      • Storage:
      • 1TB Sandisk SSD
      • Graphics card(s):
      • ASUS GTX 970
      • PSU:
      • Corsair AX650
      • Case:
      • Silverstone Fortress FT03
      • Operating System:
      • 8.1 Pro
      • Monitor(s):
      • Dell S2716DG
      • Internet:
      • 10 Mbps ADSL

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Quote Originally Posted by gallinazo View Post
    What is preventing such an outstanding piece of hardware from showing up? (and no please, no capitalistic, marketing, sales shares, financial stuff here, throw all that as far away as you can, and lets try to focus on the technical-manufacture side of what is preventing that) What is so big and complicated that would be preventing such a killer hardware???
    You've effectively answered your own question there - it's perfectly plain to see why nobody would be particularly keen on designing a gut-wrenchingly expensive board with dual-1366, 4 double-slot PCI-E slots, 2 PCI slots, more PCI-E x1 slots and hydra and whatever else you want plonked in there too.

    The amount of R&D required would never be cost-effective... even Skulltrail, expensive as it was, was just a bastardised version of a server board - remember everyone moaning about the cost of FB-DIMMs? So to suggest that a ground-up approach, a consumer dual-1366 board, would be even remotely economically viable is just silly. Someone might do it in the same way that VW made the Bugatti - a non-profitmaking exercise, but that will be it, and you can bet your bottom dollar that in that situation you'd never see any for sale.

  3. #3
    Headless Chicken Terbinator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    7,670
    Thanks
    1,210
    Thanked
    727 times in 595 posts
    • Terbinator's system
      • Motherboard:
      • ASRock H61M
      • CPU:
      • Intel Xeon 1230-V3
      • Memory:
      • Geil Evo Corsa 2133/8GB
      • Storage:
      • M4 128GB, 2TB WD Red
      • Graphics card(s):
      • Gigabyte GTX Titan
      • PSU:
      • Corsair AX760i
      • Case:
      • Coolermaster 130
      • Operating System:
      • Windows 8.1 Pro
      • Monitor(s):
      • Dell Ultrasharp U2711H
      • Internet:
      • Virgin Media 60Mb.

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Quote Originally Posted by snootyjim View Post
    Skulltrail, expensive as it was, was just a bastardised version of a server board.
    Oh, how i lol'd.
    Kalniel: "Nice review Tarinder - would it be possible to get a picture of the case when the components are installed (with the side off obviously)?"
    CAT-THE-FIFTH: "The Antec 300 is a case which has an understated and clean appearance which many people like. Not everyone is into e-peen looking computers which look like a cross between the imagination of a hyperactive 10 year old and a Frog."
    TKPeters: "Off to AVForum better Deal - £20+Vat for Free Shipping @ Scan"
    for all intents it seems to be the same card minus some gays name on it and a shielded cover ? with OEM added to it - GoNz0.

  4. #4
    Banhammer in peace PeterB kalniel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    31,023
    Thanks
    1,870
    Thanked
    3,381 times in 2,718 posts
    • kalniel's system
      • Motherboard:
      • Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra
      • CPU:
      • Intel i9 9900k
      • Memory:
      • 32GB DDR4 3200 CL16
      • Storage:
      • 1TB Samsung 970Evo+ NVMe
      • Graphics card(s):
      • nVidia GTX 1060 6GB
      • PSU:
      • Seasonic 600W
      • Case:
      • Cooler Master HAF 912
      • Operating System:
      • Win 10 Pro x64
      • Monitor(s):
      • Dell S2721DGF
      • Internet:
      • rubbish

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Quote Originally Posted by gallinazo View Post
    maybe the manufacturers will pay attention and decide to give the leap.
    You're asking manufacturers to ignore the fact they're part of a free market and to just create things for technical reasons regardless of the fact they wouldn't be able to sell enough to make it worthwhile at the cost? The reason they don't make desktop rigs that take 48+gb of ram is that there's no need for it in today's desktop market. Given the choice between a motherboard that takes way more RAM than needed and another one that also takes way more RAM than needed yet costs 3x as much, 99.9% of the buying public would go for the former over the latter.

    It's fine to dream about technical oddities - but it's more important to focus on economically viable features so that you get the rig that you want for a price that you want as well - and so that the companies actually remain in business to be able to provide such.

    Going back to the dreaming - what difference would it actually make to your own personal use of the equipment to have such features? Would you be able to take advantage of 60gb RAM? Can you think of technical features that would actually make a difference?
    Last edited by kalniel; 05-01-2010 at 12:42 PM.

  5. #5
    Moosing about! CAT-THE-FIFTH's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Not here
    Posts
    32,039
    Thanks
    3,910
    Thanked
    5,224 times in 4,015 posts
    • CAT-THE-FIFTH's system
      • Motherboard:
      • Less E-PEEN
      • CPU:
      • Massive E-PEEN
      • Memory:
      • RGB E-PEEN
      • Storage:
      • Not in any order
      • Graphics card(s):
      • EVEN BIGGER E-PEEN
      • PSU:
      • OVERSIZED
      • Case:
      • UNDERSIZED
      • Operating System:
      • DOS 6.22
      • Monitor(s):
      • NOT USUALLY ON....WHEN I POST
      • Internet:
      • FUNCTIONAL

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    This motherboard can take two socket 1366 processors:

    http://en.inpai.com.cn/doc/enshowcont.asp?id=7487

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    512
    Thanks
    17
    Thanked
    24 times in 17 posts
    • jetfire's system
      • Motherboard:
      • tyan s7010
      • CPU:
      • 2x E55230 2.4GHz quad
      • Memory:
      • 24gb ddr3 1333mhz
      • Storage:
      • 2tb
      • Graphics card(s):
      • ati hd5850+hd4350
      • PSU:
      • 1200w be quiet dark power pro nuclear power plant
      • Case:
      • custom built
      • Operating System:
      • win 7 ultimate 64bit/32bit
      • Monitor(s):
      • 2 24inc dell e248wfps 1 hp zr24w 37inc sharp aquos tv
      • Internet:
      • 20mbps virgin ubiquiti unifi wifi 300mbps netgear gs724t

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    this can also take 2 1366 cpus and has 4 pcie x16 slots.


    http://www.tyan.com/product_SKU_spec...&SKU=600000040

  7. #7
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked
    0 times in 0 posts

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Yeah, but remember when i told you to throw out of the window financial reasons, no matter how important in the end, just throw'em & focus on the tech side, the possibilities.
    "amount of R&D" ??? common, is not like they would have to invent the wheel, more like finding a way to get the 4 WHEELS togetther on a chassis and make it move. Yeah, Im not saying it would be an easy task like 2+2=4, but neither is going all the way frm scratch up.
    Theres people like would benefit from somethin like this other than getting uhber bragging rights, people that work from home for example or even in studios getting to do some tough high calculation stuff; like...say IL&M or PIXAR, platforms like this would be very welcomed I pressume, and with GPGPU getting more and more improvements and presence it can only help more.

  8. #8
    YUKIKAZE arthurleung's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Aberdeen
    Posts
    3,280
    Thanks
    8
    Thanked
    88 times in 83 posts
    • arthurleung's system
      • Motherboard:
      • Asus P5E (Rampage Formula 0902)
      • CPU:
      • Intel Core2Quad Q9550 3.6Ghz 1.2V
      • Memory:
      • A-Data DDR2-800 2x2GB CL4
      • Storage:
      • 4x1TB WD1000FYPS @ RAID5 3Ware 9500S-8 / 3x 1TB Samsung Ecogreen F2
      • Graphics card(s):
      • GeCube HD4870 512MB
      • PSU:
      • Corsair VX450
      • Case:
      • Antec P180
      • Operating System:
      • Windows Server 2008 Standard
      • Monitor(s):
      • Dell Ultrasharp 2709W + 2001FP
      • Internet:
      • Be*Unlimited 20Mbps

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    There is no point doing say, a dual socket 1366 board to get 12-Cores when you can get 3 computers each with 4 cores for less. Get 9-Channel of memory bandwidth across 3 computers with 12GB kits and you can get 96GB of ram for less than a quarter the price of a 24GB kit.

    If the task is not multi-threaded then both will run at the same speed. If the task is multi-threaded, it will run on the 1x12 system faster, certainly not 3 times as fast though. If the task is distributable, it will certainly be as fast if not faster with 3x4.

    Jobs can be split into many pieces. For example for PIXAR they could split a film which is say 200000 frames long, into 1000 pieces of 200 frames and run on 1000 quad core computers, with each CPU rendering 50 frames.

    If you increase the number of CPU cores in one computer you will most likely run into memory bandwidth limit which choke the CPU making it idle most of the time. Or it could be there is too much stuff to be off-loaded from memory to harddrive (say if you have 64GB of memory).

    Unless you task is inherently single-system only (say an ancient piece of custom-made software that there are no alternatives available) there is no reason to go for an extremely high-end rig. You would either go for a large number of slower rigs with best performance/cost and/or performance/watt, or a couple cabinets of blade servers if you don't have much space. Much easier maintenance and better uptime.
    Workstation 1: Intel i7 950 @ 3.8Ghz / X58 / 12GB DDR3-1600 / HD4870 512MB / Antec P180
    Workstation 2: Intel C2Q Q9550 @ 3.6Ghz / X38 / 4GB DDR2-800 / 8400GS 512MB / Open Air
    Workstation 3: Intel Xeon X3350 @ 3.2Ghz / P35 / 4GB DDR2-800 / HD4770 512MB / Shuttle SP35P2
    HTPC: AMD Athlon X4 620 @ 2.6Ghz / 780G / 4GB DDR2-1000 / Antec Mini P180 White
    Mobile Workstation: Intel C2D T8300 @ 2.4Ghz / GM965 / 3GB DDR2-667 / DELL Inspiron 1525 / 6+6+9 Cell Battery

    Display (Monitor): DELL Ultrasharp 2709W + DELL Ultrasharp 2001FP
    Display (Projector): Epson TW-3500 1080p
    Speakers: Creative Megaworks THX550 5.1
    Headphones: Etymotic hf2 / Ultimate Ears Triple.fi 10 Pro

    Storage: 8x2TB Hitachi @ DELL PERC 6/i RAID6 / 13TB Non-RAID Across 12 HDDs
    Consoles: PS3 Slim 120GB / Xbox 360 Arcade 20GB / PS2

  9. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked
    0 times in 0 posts

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Maybe....<sigh> still daydreaming & wondering....IF ???

    By the way nice pic of the Mave.

  10. #10
    Banhammer in peace PeterB kalniel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    31,023
    Thanks
    1,870
    Thanked
    3,381 times in 2,718 posts
    • kalniel's system
      • Motherboard:
      • Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra
      • CPU:
      • Intel i9 9900k
      • Memory:
      • 32GB DDR4 3200 CL16
      • Storage:
      • 1TB Samsung 970Evo+ NVMe
      • Graphics card(s):
      • nVidia GTX 1060 6GB
      • PSU:
      • Seasonic 600W
      • Case:
      • Cooler Master HAF 912
      • Operating System:
      • Win 10 Pro x64
      • Monitor(s):
      • Dell S2721DGF
      • Internet:
      • rubbish

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Quote Originally Posted by gallinazo View Post
    Yeah, but remember when i told you to throw out of the window financial reasons, no matter how important in the end, just throw'em & focus on the tech side, the possibilities.
    okay. *concentrates for a micro-second*. Done. I've just imagined a really silly machine with no practical advantage over what's out there at the moment. There's no point me explaining it further because it really is silly and there's no reason anyone would ever make such a thing.


    Theres people like would benefit from somethin like this other than getting uhber bragging rights, people that work from home for example or even in studios getting to do some tough high calculation stuff; like...say IL&M or PIXAR, platforms like this would be very welcomed I pressume, and with GPGPU getting more and more improvements and presence it can only help more.
    Nope they wouldn't.

    You could, with enough R&D and money, turn a Fiat 500 into something that could go around a track as fast as a Ferrari. But people would look at you and say 'if I want a Ferrari, I'll buy a Ferrari'.

    There are already solutions for HPC which give far better performance for your investment than banding together desktop components and paying out oodles in licensing fees for all the competing technologies which won't actually help you get the job done. If I want a render farm then I'll buy/rent a tesla rack server for instance.

    So back to my first question to you: if you're going to dream, what features would actually make a difference to you gallinazo?

  11. #11
    jim
    jim is offline
    HEXUS.clueless jim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Location: Location:
    Posts
    11,457
    Thanks
    613
    Thanked
    1,645 times in 1,307 posts
    • jim's system
      • Motherboard:
      • Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z
      • CPU:
      • i5 2500K @ 4.5GHz
      • Memory:
      • 8GB Corsair Vengeance LP
      • Storage:
      • 1TB Sandisk SSD
      • Graphics card(s):
      • ASUS GTX 970
      • PSU:
      • Corsair AX650
      • Case:
      • Silverstone Fortress FT03
      • Operating System:
      • 8.1 Pro
      • Monitor(s):
      • Dell S2716DG
      • Internet:
      • 10 Mbps ADSL

    Re: Wondering/dreaming of a Xtreme rig

    Quote Originally Posted by gallinazo View Post
    Yeah, but remember when i told you to throw out of the window financial reasons, no matter how important in the end, just throw'em & focus on the tech side, the possibilities.
    "amount of R&D" ??? common, is not like they would have to invent the wheel, more like finding a way to get the 4 WHEELS togetther on a chassis and make it move. Yeah, Im not saying it would be an easy task like 2+2=4, but neither is going all the way frm scratch up.
    Theres people like would benefit from somethin like this other than getting uhber bragging rights, people that work from home for example or even in studios getting to do some tough high calculation stuff; like...say IL&M or PIXAR, platforms like this would be very welcomed I pressume, and with GPGPU getting more and more improvements and presence it can only help more.
    That's what I said in the first place - it's like saying to somebody "Explain to me why NASA hasn't sent a probe to Alpha Centauri, but don't mention it being expensive or pointless." You already know the answer to your question, so there's no point asking.

    There is no technological reason why they can't do it, the issue is financial. Your assertion that it wouldn't be that expensive is completely ridiculous - take my example of Skulltrail. That was hideously overpriced, and as I put it was "a bastardised version of a server board". So how much do you think it would've cost if they'd have designed it from the ground up? You want them to take the QPI design from the dual-CPU workstation sector, and then mesh it with the standard DDR3 design from the consumer sector, then program in Hydra, SLI and Crossfire support, add loads of PCI-E lanes as well, and then test this brand new chipset for perhaps a year to find all the flaws and correct them. Well by that time they've got a potential market of about 25 customers, because each motherboard would have to cost about as much as a studio flat, which in turn is why they've got so few customers, resulting in a massive company loss and a pounding from the shareholders. It's utterly stupid.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. New Gaming Rig - self build
    By PubZombie in forum PC Hardware and Components
    Replies: 34
    Last Post: 09-01-2010, 12:06 AM
  2. Minor but irritating issue with my beloved 3XS rig
    By Bismark in forum SCAN 3XS Systems - After Sales Support
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 31-12-2009, 06:21 PM
  3. Building A Gaming Rig - A Living Document. (A HEXUS Project)
    By Stewart in forum PC Hardware and Components
    Replies: 188
    Last Post: 06-09-2008, 04:19 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •