Soundcard to use with Sharkoon X-Tatic 5.1 digital headphones

[JimNastics]

Can anyone recommend a soundcard, primarily for gaming, that will give me 5.1 sound whilst gaming through my X-Tatics? The X-Tatics have a Toslink SPDIF optical connection. I keep seeing comments about how some cards only output stereo over SPDIF, or that you can't game in 5.1 but DVDs will be fine because the signal is already encoded in 5.1... that would annoy me as I only bought them for 5.1 gaming!! Any help appreciated

[Uriel]

For 5.1 gaming you will need something with Dolby Digital Live. This encodes 5.1 over SPDIF in realtime.

If you'll be using them with older games in Vista or 7 you will also need something that can emulate DirectSound3d, which was the main system for providing surround sound in XP. Microsoft removed this for the later operating systems and left it to the soundcard guys to get it working. IMO there are only two solutions worth relying on, Creative's Alchemy, and Asus' DS3D-GX. Other solutions are available from Realtek and C-Media but they're not as well developed. Realtek 3DSoundback is little more than a beta. C-Media's version is basically an old version of the one Asus uses. That limits you to X-Fi or Xonar cards really.

For gaming with the X-Tactics I'd recommend a minimum of a Xonar DX/D1 or X-Fi Titanium. Other cheaper cards with Dolby Digital live will work with some games but older games won't have 5.1.

I should mention that both these cards support surround virtualisation over stereo headphones that I think work rather better than the multiple driver surround used in the X-Tactics. The Xonar has Dolby Headphone. The X-Fi has CMSS-3D headphone. I haven't used my Speedlink Medusas as surround headphones since hearing Dolby Headphone on Xonar. The Medusas have a very similar design to the XTactics but with analogue rather than digital connection - I believe they may even be from the same OEM. If you do get an X-Fi or Xonar I would at least try the stereo surround virtualisation. I'm not precluding anything but if your ears are anything like mine I wouldn't be surprised if you end up selling the Sharkoons on and just sticking to stereo.

Edit: If you can track down an OEM X-Fi Xtreme Music or Xtreme Gamer with optical out ports (not all OEM versions have them), that might save you some money (the retail Xtreme Music didn't have them and needs an adaptor for SPDIF, the Retail Xtreme Gamer is a half height card where the optical out and the microphone are on the same jack hole so you could't use it for multiplayer). They're coded SB077x - where the x is any number from 0 to 9. They might be called something like Dell or HP OEM X-Fi. They don't come with Dolby Digital Live but you can pay an extra $5 US to Creative (on their US web shop only) to have it enabled.

[JimNastics]

Brilliant post thanks Uriel! Though I didn't like the sound of the last sentence, having only received the Sharkoons yesterday I will be using them with my 360 as well so maybe that's a pro in their favour?

Anyway, I shall go on a hunt for the cards you suggested. What's your opinion of the cheaper X-Fi cards, such as the Xtremegamer/music?

[Uriel]

Well yeah, using them with the 360 is a plus. If you find that Dolby Headphone floats your boat there are options that will work on the 360. I don't find CMSS-3D headphone quite as effective as Dobly Headphone although the X-Fi cards have a number of other advantages in games (but most of them only work up to 4.0 not 5.1). I actually use an X-Fi with 4.0 Dolby Digital Live optical out to a Dolby Headphone decoder and stereo headphones. Obviously the decoder could work with 5.1 from the 360.

I'd rather you try what you have though - and hopefully you'll be impressed. An interest in audio stuff can develop into a nasty case of upgraditis (I dread to think of the number of soundcards and headphones I've been through in the last couple of years).

[Terbinator]

Is it not game dependant in regards to DD 5.1 support. If the soundcard is 'encoding on the fly' then surely it is encoding a stereo or other signal into 5.1 - not passing the signal straight to the SCU of the X-Tactics.

[Uriel]

It's game dependent as far as the game needs to support surround sound. This is usually via a 3rd party API like Directsound3D or OpenAL. PC Games that don't support surround sound have been very rare for the last 5 to 10 years, as long as you have a capable soundcard. You just set the soundcard and game to however many speakers you're using and the gaming sound environment is rendered across those speakers. AFAIK all 360 games support 5.1.

Windows Vista and 7 have complicated matters slighly for DirectSound3d, hence the need for AlChemy and DS3D-GX for older games.

Edit: So in practice games don't need to be support 5.1 or 7.1. If 10.2 (as found in some THX certified cinemas) becomes the de-facto standard in future you would theoretically just need a 10.2 souncard with a decent OpenAL or DS3D driver and your game audio will be rendered in glorious 10.2! The exception is games that don't use a 3rd Party API. Half Life 2, for example, has it's own software audio engine that tells each speaker what to do. Games like that won't magically upscale to 10.2 without some additional programming.

[Terbinator]

I'm talking about Dolby Digital 5.1 - Not 5.1 in general. If the SCU doesn't recieve an AC3 soundtrack then you get Pro Logic BS instead.

[Uriel]

Yes but that's what Dolby Digital Live does. It endcodes 5.1 on the fly so you get discreet 5.1 sent as an AC3 signal over optical. None of your pro-logic rubbish.

DTS Connect does pretty much the same thing but for DTS isn't compatible with the Sharkoons that the OP was asking about.

PCs have been capable of this since the old nforce 2 soundstorm days. It's the same sort of system that the original xbox used to get 5.1 in games (whereas the Playstation II and Gamecube had to support pro-logic II in game). The Xbox 360 does something similar but it's encoded by the CPU rather than a separate audio chip.

[Uriel]

. What's your opinion of the cheaper X-Fi cards, such as the Xtremegamer/music?

Missed your question there. For Gamer and Music - you need to make sure they have Optical out. The retail Xtreme Music will take a SPDIF output adaptor but Creative no longer supply it. Retail Xtreme Gamer is low profile and the optical and mic jack is shared, so you would need to use the mic fom a different sound device (maybe USB?) I wouldn't recommend a full USB soundcard or onboard for the Mic as Alchemy can behave strangely with other sound devices installed. The main cheap X-Fi to avoid is Xtreme Audio. It's basically an Audigy in disguise so is missing most of a proper X-Fi's gaming features and it can't be upgraded to Dolby Digital Live so is stuck with stereo over optical.

Most of what you pay for the more expensive X-Fis is related to analogue quality, which will make no difference as you'll be using a digital connection. Some of the more expensive X-Fis have onboard X-RAM but it doesn't really seem to help anything.

[shaithis]

I am currently using that headset with an Asus Xonar D2X.

Any of the lesser creative or Asus cards with DDL support would suffice though.

Just hope you can adjust to them better then I have, nice sound, shame they start to hurt your ears after prolonged usage though

[Uriel]

I am currently using that headset with an Asus Xonar D2X.

Any of the lesser creative or Asus cards with DDL support would suffice though.

Just hope you can adjust to them better then I have, nice sound, shame they start to hurt your ears after prolonged usage though

Have you trie the D2X with stereo headphones and Dolby Headphone? If so, which headphones and what did you think in comparison with the Xtatics?

[shaithis]

I have used it with a pair of thin Plantronics, plus Seenheisser PC-131 and PC-161 (think those are the right numbers).

I do prefer the sound on the Xtatics but as I said, the long term comfort of them is shockingly bad, at least for me.

[Terbinator]

After my usual 8 hour stints my ears do get sore.

[JimNastics]

Edit: If you can track down an OEM X-Fi Xtreme Music or Xtreme Gamer with optical out ports (not all OEM versions have them), that might save you some money (the retail Xtreme Music didn't have them and needs an adaptor for SPDIF, the Retail Xtreme Gamer is a half height card where the optical out and the microphone are on the same jack hole so you could't use it for multiplayer). They're coded SB077x - where the x is any number from 0 to 9. They might be called something like Dell or HP OEM X-Fi. They don't come with Dolby Digital Live but you can pay an extra $5 US to Creative (on their US web shop only) to have it enabled.

I snapped up one of these OEM X-FI XtremeGamer cards on eBay last night for £22, which I think was a good price. So hopefully with the DDL activation from Creative, I'll be good to go all for around £25

[Uriel]

Nicely done. Excellent price. Hopefully it should work well.

[JimNastics]

Got the card, all looks good, now to install it! I'm running Windows 7 64bit. What are the best drivers to use, just the official ones? Or are there some hacked ones that perform better?