How much performance can I expect from upgrading an i5-2500 to an i7-6700K in gaming?

I'm finally at a point where I can upgrade my computer - I've done the GPU (670s to a 1060..I've never had such a leap in performance before,as I used to upgrade more regularly, it's mind-blowing), but as there is still slowdown in some games, which I've found out is due to my weak CPU, I was thinking of doing that too.

The problem is the cost is disgusting. I'm looking at at least £500, and closer to £600, for what will be in my mind just a performance boost in certain bits of certain games.

The main reason for it is Civ VI, turn times are HORRENDOUS (15-20s in later game), and Just Cause 3 has lots of slowdown too during the bigger explosions. These are just 2 newer games I've noticed it happening in, I've not tried a lot of titles yet.

My CPU is a none-K (K was out of stock when I went to buy the parts), so I was thinking it might be better to just buy a 2700K and OC it. Or am I just delaying the inevitable ?

Turn times have always been bad in late game Civ. A 6700 is only about 50% faster so they should drop to 10-15s. Not bad, but it's not exactly going to save you from drumming your fingers.

I think this is best in Hardware :)

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Originally Posted by Tunnah

My CPU is a none-K (K was out of stock when I went to buy the parts), so I was thinking it might be better to just buy a 2700K and OC it. Or am I just delaying the inevitable ?

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You'd be able to get a 4770/90 in your board wouldn't you?

A fair bit, aside from the PCIe bandwidth bump, '1080p range' of resolutions frequently sees the CPU bottlenecking the framerate. If you want to save a hundred quid, go for an i5-6600K instead and give it a modest overclock with a CPU multiplier bump. Hyperthreading wont help much with current games.

Honestly? I'd probably just get yourself a 2500K / 2600K / 2700K from CEX and overclock to 4.5Ghz (assuming you have a suitable motherboard, RAM and heat sink)....


i5 2500K @ £72.00 with 2 year warranty
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...A#.WCt0lPmLQtg

i7 2600k @ £130.00 wth 2 year warranty
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...K#.WCt0vvmLQtg

i5 3570k @ £100.00 with 2 year warranty:
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...A#.WCt1l_mLQtg

i7 3770k @ £195.00 with 2 year warranty:
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...K#.WCt16vmLQtg

All are socket 1155 so should work, check motherboard compatibility for the 3*** options to double check it supports them (or at least update your BIOS before installing them)

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Originally Posted by Terbinator

You'd be able to get a 4770/90 in your board wouldn't you?

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No, haswell switched to socket 1150 so aren't compatible only 2*** (sandy bridge) and 3*** (ivy bridge) will work with the current motherboard.

Just Cause 3

https://translate.google.co.uk/trans...rks-1179397%2F

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Overall, the game scales well with existing processor cores without showing any special features. The minimum requirement of a nimble quad core processor seems to us to be slightly exaggerated in the face of the measured values. Just Cause 3 can also be played properly with a Core i3 of the 4000 series (Haswell), if it has SMT alias hyperthreading. Even if it has only 2.5 GHz as in our measurement - real core i3-4xxx chips usually run with more than 3 GHz turbo, an average of 62 fps is possible. If SMT is missing, for example at the Pentium Anniversary, the fps drop significantly and the minimum values ​​in the partial critical 40s range. However, this can be countered by means of a high core clock, around 4 GHz is even with two Haswell cores all in the green range.

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http://www.pcgameshardware.de/screen...aling-pcgh.png

http://cdn.overclock.net/2/29/700x10...-jc3_proz.jpeg

Civ6

http://www.dsogaming.com/pc-performa...ance-analysis/

http://www.dsogaming.com/wp-content/...-CPU-Graph.jpg

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In order to find out how the game scales on various CPUs, we simulated a dual-core and a quad-core CPU. We also tested the game via the in-game benchmark tool as it features a really demanding scenario.

Our simulated dual-core system was able to run Civilization VI with framerates ranging from 30fps to 80fps. However, there was severe freezes when the game was calculating all the available moves. Our simulated quad-core system was able to offer a better experience, with a minimum framerate of 44fps. And while the freezes were significantly reduced, they were not completely eliminated.

Our hexa-core system was able to completely eliminate our freezes, however it appears that the game suffers from some performance issues. As you can see in the following comparison, this particular scene from the benchmark ran exactly the same on our simulated quad-core and hexa-core systems. What’s really interesting here is that both the CPU and the GPU were underused on our hexa-core system.

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http://gamegpu.com/images/stories/Te...VI/s6_proz.png

http://gamegpu.com/images/stories/Te...VI/s6_inte.png

I would be looking at a Core i7 - the Core i7 3770 and 3770K also have PCI-E 3.0 capability too.

CEX also do the Core i7 3770 non-K for £150:

https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku=SCPUINTI73770

You can use all cores Turbo and make it run at 3.9GHZ instead.

How does that Civ benchmark work? If this is anything like earlier games then really, you want a benchmark from end-game where there is a ton of stuff going on to keep the AI busy and the game runs "end of turn" something like 10 times. It is a turn based game not a frame based game, so frames per second doesn't seem relevant. Turns per minute would be way more interesting as that is game quality not eye candy quality.

Upgrading from 2500K to 6700K buys about 20% average frame for all that money? That is barely noticable, but if the turn time shown by those frames halves then that might be worth it.

Odd that a franchise that used Mantle didn't launch with Vulkan/DX12 which again you would hope would lower eye candy CPU usage to divert that grunt into the AI for better turn speed.

The Civ5 benchmark was late game. AMD is rumoured to be bundling Civ6 with the RX480 soon,so I expect we might see the DX12 patch in the next month or two.

Edit!!

I posted a Civ5 in that APU competition I won:

http://forums.hexus.net/reader-revie...ml#post2548989

Oh weird, I never received a notification that this thread had posts, I thought it had gone unnoticed ha.

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Originally Posted by EndlessWaves

Turn times have always been bad in late game Civ. A 6700 is only about 50% faster so they should drop to 10-15s. Not bad, but it's not exactly going to save you from drumming your fingers.

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The problem is, it's a none-K, I'm locked to 3.3ghz, even if I just upgraded to the K I'd add like, 20-30% on that alone

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Originally Posted by Zak33

I think this is best in Hardware :)

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Sorry mate, didn't think.

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Originally Posted by Terbinator

You'd be able to get a 4770/90 in your board wouldn't you?

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Nay, socket limitations

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Originally Posted by aidanjt

A fair bit, aside from the PCIe bandwidth bump, '1080p range' of resolutions frequently sees the CPU bottlenecking the framerate. If you want to save a hundred quid, go for an i5-6600K instead and give it a modest overclock with a CPU multiplier bump. Hyperthreading wont help much with current games.

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That's still £500 for what amounts to bugger all

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Originally Posted by cptwhite_uk

Honestly? I'd probably just get yourself a 2500K / 2600K / 2700K from CEX and overclock to 4.5Ghz (assuming you have a suitable motherboard, RAM and heat sink)....


i5 2500K @ £72.00 with 2 year warranty
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...A#.WCt0lPmLQtg

i7 2600k @ £130.00 wth 2 year warranty
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...K#.WCt0vvmLQtg

i5 3570k @ £100.00 with 2 year warranty:
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...A#.WCt1l_mLQtg

i7 3770k @ £195.00 with 2 year warranty:
https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku...K#.WCt16vmLQtg

All are socket 1155 so should work, check motherboard compatibility for the 3*** options to double check it supports them (or at least update your BIOS before installing them)

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I didn't realize the 3770k I think I'll go for that! I have been trying to contact this guy for days on ebay, he has a 2700k from Costa Rica for 178, but would take less for cash & pickup, and he's only down the road, I literally am ready to put the money in his hand, but he's ignored my 3 emails. Wow that worked out in my favour. Thanks mate.

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Originally Posted by cptwhite_uk

No, haswell switched to socket 1150 so aren't compatible only 2*** (sandy bridge) and 3*** (ivy bridge) will work with the current motherboard.

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Yupyup, as I'm just learning from this thread, it seems I can get an ivy bridge.

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Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

Just Cause 3

https://translate.google.co.uk/trans...rks-1179397%2F

TRIMMED


I would be looking at a Core i7 - the Core i7 3770 and 3770K also have PCI-E 3.0 capability too.

CEX also do the Core i7 3770 non-K for £150:

https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku=SCPUINTI73770

You can use all cores Turbo and make it run at 3.9GHZ instead.

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Ya the benchmarks are with K models, usually OC'ed. The massive problem is my 3.3ghz lock. Just getting a K would give me like 20-30% alone. But ya as I'm finding out, the 3770k is an option. As for PCIe 3.0 that doesn't matter to me. Plus, it'd mean buying a new mobo, which I just don't need to do.

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Originally Posted by DanceswithUnix

How does that Civ benchmark work? If this is anything like earlier games then really, you want a benchmark from end-game where there is a ton of stuff going on to keep the AI busy and the game runs "end of turn" something like 10 times. It is a turn based game not a frame based game, so frames per second doesn't seem relevant. Turns per minute would be way more interesting as that is game quality not eye candy quality.

Upgrading from 2500K to 6700K buys about 20% average frame for all that money? That is barely noticable, but if the turn time shown by those frames halves then that might be worth it.

Odd that a franchise that used Mantle didn't launch with Vulkan/DX12 which again you would hope would lower eye candy CPU usage to divert that grunt into the AI for better turn speed.

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Ya the Civ benchmarks are about graphics but I care about the actual turn times - I turn on quick combat and movement, I just want their turns to be over as quick as possible, and even with 4 AI and 6 city states, it takes donkeys years with my current one

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

The Civ5 benchmark was late game. AMD is rumoured to be bundling Civ6 with the RX480 soon,so I expect we might see the DX12 patch in the next month or two.

Edit!!

I posted a Civ5 in that APU competition I won:

http://forums.hexus.net/reader-revie...ml#post2548989

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No comment on this post, it just seemed rude to leave only yours out ha.


So ya thanks all, it looks like I'm getting a 3770k!

Looks like the DX12 patch for Civ6 has landed.

BTW,the Core i7 3770K only has a 200MHZ clockspeed advantage over the Core i7 3770 non-K.

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Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH

Looks like the DX12 patch for Civ6 has landed.

BTW,the Core i7 3770K only has a 200MHZ clockspeed advantage over the Core i7 3770 non-K.

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I'm going for the 2700k anyway, turns out my mobo doesn't work too well with Ivy Bridge. Not too much of an issue, the performance difference is quite small.

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Originally Posted by Tunnah

That's still £500 for what amounts to bugger all

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Yup, it's difficult to justify CPU upgrading to modern platforms when the only real advantages is the platform itself and updated I/O. The added instructions per clock is nice, but it's not the end of the world to not have it either, especially when on a tight budget.

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Originally Posted by aidanjt

Yup, it's difficult to justify CPU upgrading to modern platforms when the only real advantages is the platform itself and updated I/O. The added instructions per clock is nice, but it's not the end of the world to not have it either, especially when on a tight budget.

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Aye, honestly if I had the K version of this I reckon I'd get at least another 3 years out of it, hell longer than that if the next console cycle sticks to 4 cores, as it's the consoles what dictate it, mostly.

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Originally Posted by Tunnah

I'm going for the 2700k anyway, turns out my mobo doesn't work too well with Ivy Bridge. Not too much of an issue, the performance difference is quite small.

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Didn't know there were problems with Ivy Bridge compatibility - is it BIOS or what? If I may ask.

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Originally Posted by Bonebreaker777

Didn't know there were problems with Ivy Bridge compatibility - is it BIOS or what? If I may ask.

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From what little research I've done (read: googled it, looked at 2 things, gone "yup that's enough for me"), while Ivy Bridge does work, it seems OC'ing is disabled. Now, what I couldn't find (read: couldn't be arsed finding out) was if this applied to all boards, as it seemed that some people think it only applied to the B2 boards (if you're not familiar with this mobo - there was a recall due to the chance of dodgy SATA ports, known as B2 boards. I use all mine, so I experienced it, so mine was replaced).

I used Anandtech Bench to check the 2600k (no 2700k in their benchmark) vs 3770k and there isn't much difference. Plus, I heard the 2700k OC's better, which is the reason I'm doing this upgrade

Also I'd be remiss if I didn't say, earlier in this thread I mentioned a guy on eBay ignoring me. He got back to me, my emails were going in his spam folder (happens to me all the time as I have my own domain/email server), he wasn't ignoring me at all, and he's giving me an awesome discount on his eBay listing price. I know I didn't name him, but if it was reversed, and I came across this, I'd be peed off ha.

Are you the same Tunnah who visited noobgroup a few years back?!?

Did you go from SLI'd 670s or just a single?

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Originally Posted by mozzer51

Are you the same Tunnah who visited noobgroup a few years back?!?

Did you go from SLI'd 670s or just a single?

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Hahah yes I am mate, how you doing ? I actually recently got back into BF and for the life of me couldn't remember the name of the group, is it still going ?

And ya SLI'ed

EDIT: Oh and for anyone still watching this, I got the 2700k, and it is bloody glorious. The last time I received this much of a boost from a CPU upgrade was when the Core2duo first came out!

ya those are both still great CPUs - and especially if you overclock them. I've got the 2700k and Vs something like the Skylake You'd probably notice a 20% or so performance differential in games (depending on the game and how much you OC of course.)

I'm quite surprised how my SLI'd 670s are holding up in witcher 3, rise of the tomb raider and the like. I've got an i5 2500k - second hand when I bought it but it's nice and happy at around 4.5GHz on stock voltages!

I'm good, celebrating my first Christmas with my girlfriend in our own house so haven't been playing all that many new games but I'm keeping pretty busy!

The group had a hard time after battlefield 4 came out, there were so many issues with the game but it's still going and seen a resurgence of people playing bf1 though.

Aye I signed in after you gave me the name I'd forgotten hehe

Are your 670s 2 or 4GB ? The performance is great, but mine being 2GB was starting to give me grief, plus I hate not being able to just whack everything on full and not have to fiddle finding the right settings for the occasion. I had a 2500, non-K, that was holding me back quite a bit too.

Good to hear about the house!

And ya speaking to Yupster yesterday he said pretty much the same thing. I've not even tried the game yet. Gonna buy BF1 in the next few days

Of course, if you do sell your 2500, I'll give you £30 for the chip.

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Originally Posted by Dashers

Of course, if you do sell your 2500, I'll give you £30 for the chip.

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Mate I'd let you have it for free if it wasn't already promised to someone else.

With my original idea of doing a whole new rig, I was going to give my sis and brother in law my old parts, all they'd need is peripherals, a case and a PSU. So they're expecting a PC and I've kinda shafted em haha. I'm gonna source some cheap second hand bits (I'm swapping my 2x2gb RAM sticks for 2x4, I have a GPU, SSD, HDD, so it's really only a mobo), get a basic case & PSU, I've got a spare Razer DeathAdder *spits* so they only need to get a keyboard. Also this way I can get a microATX or ITX board as the BIL wanted to use it for work, so it'd need to be mobile

My GTX 670's are and were 2Gb versions - the primary one failed on me last night! :(

I\'m thinking of going to a 1060 6Gb after christmas as a replacement 670 would be about £80.

I should be able to get most of the money for the 1060 back on the working 670 and water blocks

I highly recommend the 1060, however if you wanna keep the 670 choo-choo train rolling shoot me your address I\'ll send you one of my 670s.

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Originally Posted by mozzer51

My GTX 670's are and were 2Gb versions - the primary one failed on me last night! :(

I\'m thinking of going to a 1060 6Gb after christmas as a replacement 670 would be about £80.

I should be able to get most of the money for the 1060 back on the working 670 and water blocks

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Originally Posted by Tunnah

I highly recommend the 1060, however if you wanna keep the 670 choo-choo train rolling shoot me your address I'll send you one of my 670s.

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An RX470 or an RX480 is also worth a look too:

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum...ed-review.html

I think it essentially boils down to what deal you can get on the day TBF!!

Someone posted elsewhere on the forum that AMD have turned the performance on the ex 480 around with mature drivers - the ex 480 nitro is very attractive compared to the 1060 when its and extra £20-30 to get a card with water cooling potential ( loop is already in place from the 670s)

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Originally Posted by mozzer51

Someone posted elsewhere on the forum that AMD have turned the performance on the ex 480 around with mature drivers - the ex 480 nitro is very attractive compared to the 1060 when its and extra £20-30 to get a card with water cooling potential ( loop is already in place from the 670s)

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Part of the problem is the reference cooler was meh and then by the time the non-reference cards were launched,Nvidia had launched the GTX1060 cards. It meant non-reference GTX1060 cards against the reference RX480 as they were quite close in price anyway.

I mean that test is before the new ReLive drivers too:

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/...eLive_Drivers/

Like I said it also comes down to what price you can get a RX480,RX470 or GTX1060 on the day,but still the RX470 and RX480 are worth considering IMHO OFC.

Cheers Cat-the-fifth! I'll definitely keep my eye on the rx 480 pricing (it's a shame no-one's doing waterblocks for the Sapphire 480 nitro :( )

In other news my previously dead 670 is back to being the main card in the SLI'd pair and working again !?!?!?!?

would def wait till the 13th to see what the results of zen are, could be worth waiting for zen so there is some competition.

the i5 is still definitely a good CPU and if you can wait it might be worth while