Core Duo 2 Conroe/Merom

[darrensen]

All,

As most people here will know there is a new Duo cpu due soon.

From the research i've done there will be a new Core Duo 2 next year as well. Codename Santa Rosa, it will have a different socket design.

I would like to stick with AMD but from what i hear this new duo cpu blows the doors off the AM2.

What will you do?

[aidanjt]

Core 2 hands down, not sure if a new socket will make a difference to it, I don't see why they don't just make a socket with 1100 odd pin outs, I'm tired of all these socket changes. If there's positive core architecture changes then yay.. otherwise i don't give a toss.

[kasavien]

i'll be sticking with my current setup as long as i can, at least until i finish uni.

[FatalSaviour]

With AM2 for instance, they've changed the pinout, not because they had to per se, but to avoid the risks of people plugging in a new AM2 CPU into an old Opteron S940 board.
DDR and a DDR2 memory controller don't get on too well together , and there could also be differing voltage requirements, but I agree in principle, it would be nice if they stuck to a certain pinout...

[darrensen]

Well the only reason i would wait for the new socket is then i know i've got the latest thing and wont have to worry about socket 775 being phased out.

I'm really unsure what i'm going to do.

[Spud1]

I'll wait and see, but i'm waiting to see what the new intel powermacs are like first...they will likely be core duo 2 based, and could be a decent replacement for my PC box

[schmunk]

I might upgrade to a s939...

[-ChEM-]

just bought a 939 rig, hopefully it wont be much worse than a 2.6ghz conroe

i just graduated so i thought i should just buy it now and pay it off then ill be done for a while

except for graphics, more hdds, blu ray etc etc

[[GSV]Trig]

I think somehow my x2 4400 is plenty fast enuf, my next upgrade will most likely be gfx but the x800 I have plays BF2 and IL2 so it'll do for a while yet until something new and interesting comes out...

[spazman]

I was looking to get a whole new system this summer but after seeing the scores Conroe has been getting i may go for one.

[darrensen]

I'll wait and see, but i'm waiting to see what the new intel powermacs are like first...they will likely be core duo 2 based, and could be a decent replacement for my PC box

Same here, looks like they will be out in Aug!

[DanceswithUnix]

If I bother to upgrade (there is a good chance I will just stick with 939) then it will almost certainly be to the AM2 socket.

1/ I will only upgrade if I can at least double my performance. If Conroe gives ~20% over AM2, that is not significant.

2/ The future roadmap for AM2 is long. Intel change socket pinouts constantly, so I don't trust them to maintain a stable platform.

3/ I run a 64 bit Linux install for work. In current hardware the AMD 64 bit support is faster than Intel by some margin (ie the gap widens compared to 32 bit speeds). I have not seen any 64 bit benchmarks for Conroe; it can do 64 bit, can't it?

[-ChEM-]

some musings:
1. we are gpu limited
2. but we are progressing towards a point in the easily-conceivable future where our 2ghz A64 chips will be too slow
3. when we get to that point, games will be multithreaded, so anyone with a dual core will still have massive amount of power left over
4. so we will still be gpu-limited for quite a while longer
5. there is only one generation of gpus left before they will fail to function without being a lot more efficient
6. this should slow down progress of gpu research at least to SOME extent by simple maths of R&D budgets
7. we will therefore be gpu limited for a while longer
8. games are using physics now which takes processing power
9. physics will be dealt with by a PPU soon
conclusion: we wont be cpu limited for a long time
appendix: quad cores will be out by then too

the diverse peoples of the world:
a. rich people
...will buy conroe because its the best and they dont have to worry about a stupid thing like money

b. people who want to browse the internet
...will buy whatevers cheap, the semprons/celerons of the time

c. people who benchmark and overclock because its the only place the have found joy
...will buy conroe because otherwise they will lose everything thats important to them

d. people who want to play games and know about hardware and dont mind splashing out a bit of cash
what we have so far is the small categories A & C buying conroe and the large category B buying some cheap crap that happens to exist at the time (perhaps most of the A64 chips lying around), so basically everything comes down to category D, which is pretty much everyone here (although we may have a bit of A, B and C in us all)

now of all the D people how many have the money/need to buy a whole new computer and how many will just be upgrading, the first lot will get conroe unless theres some horrible hidden downside but the second lot? nearly all the upgraders will have an single core s939 so their choice will be between getting a CPU, mem & mobo when it wont make any difference to their games without a new GPU aswell, or getting a low price athlon X2 chip and new GPU which will make them fly? (the games that is)

intel is back on top but does it really need to be at a time when we dont really need faster chips? and given their reliance on complicated FSB coordination, what chance does the equivalent quad-core chip (kentsfield) have against a HT-based quad AMD (both are dual-dual-cores not actual quads hence linking and master/slave issues)? what about when K8L comes out and AMD can keep up with core2 AND avoid FSB issues?

edit: btw i know i missed out the mid-range oem buyers which is a big market but that seems to all be politics at the moment so god knows what will go on there

[Pie_uk]

1st gen duo 2 (conroe)

since i shall be working full time over the next year , i can afford what i like. i shall sell my socket 939 to my girlfriend then buy the best conroe chip and motherboard along with water cooling and 2gb of corsair ddr2 epp memory

but socket 939 prices will be dropping soon so there is no reason for not building a really good 939 system . its all down to money and if you really want/need to upgrade

[aidanjt]

With AM2 for instance, they've changed the pinout, not because they had to per se, but to avoid the risks of people plugging in a new AM2 CPU into an old Opteron S940 board.
DDR and a DDR2 memory controller don't get on too well together , and there could also be differing voltage requirements, but I agree in principle, it would be nice if they stuck to a certain pinout...

Yea, it's understandable in AMD's situation, since AM2 based CPUs changed memory controllers to DDR2, and the pinouts for DDR2 sockets are different.

But Intel.. their CPUs perform partically all data transactions via the Northbridge chip.. and Intel went through 3 different sockets for the P4 family, the P3 family had 2 sockets (well, Slot2 doesn't really count imo, so that makes 1).. It wouldn't kill them to think forward a bit and have appropiate pin layouts for their chipsets/CPUs to give room to grow..

Although probibly some other new technology will rear its head and there'll be another new socket next year

[aidanjt]

some musings:
---

Good lord, myths myths and more myths.

1. x1900XT?.. them things are still CPU limited, especially in Crossfire mode.
2. That day is already here, there are countless programs that need more CPU power, especially network related and heavy duty media. Also, more and more programs are being written in scripted and/or inturprited languages, more crunching power means the overhead involved with JIT compilation is less of a concern.
3. no they wont, why do you think they invented a PPU?.. you need to free up physics processing a) so they do a proper job with physics calculations, and b) free up CPU time so games developers can make the CPU do other tasks in engine development.. the Creative labs X-Fi also has it's own APU (audio processing unit), freeing up the CPU more.. all these things are needed because CPU ticks are like gold dust.
4. GPUs aren't limited, in fact most GPUs are so underused that even nVidia (the company behind in GPU performance atm) are proposing to add Physics subsystems to their GPU drivers. And even being used to accelerate MPEG4 encoding.
5. GPUs are incredibly efficent and dedicated graphics processors.. In fact, I'd say GPUs outperform even conroes in general mathematical calcualations, and absolutely destroy them in graphical equasions.
...
I got bored..
...
a) conroes aren't expensive.