I believe we can ask 200 to try and save 15 now. or 200,000 in a few years time.Originally Posted by TiG
I'm not an advocate of war, but you cannot allow ourselves to be attacked repeatedly and allow that country to believe we wont respond. This will lead to far more deaths.
Do you think you could find 200 soldiers who wouldn't take this mission?
thats what it boils down to.......thankyou
the mind boggles how you can take any "support what everyone says or leave the country" statements seriously. they're about the most hypocritical, backwards, and just plain retarded comments anyone could make.
the very BASIS for improving a democratic society comes from making your voice heard
Blair knew the country didn't want to join his phony war, and Labour will lose the next election as a result
Your statement makes zero sense.the mind boggles how you can take any "support what everyone says or leave the country" statements seriously. they're about the most hypocritical, backwards, and just plain retarded comments anyone could make.
On another note, i have found that people that use words such as 'retarded' are often the dimmest people around as, by using those kinds of words, obviously struggle to express themselves.
My statement makes perfect sense. Lets's break down No.72's, one section at a time. You might understand it in slow motion.
I support my country. The majority of my country, as shown by poll after poll after poll, supported not getting involved in a pointless war on the basis of lies
My government is supposed to make choices for the good of my country. Failure to do so is practically treason, and certainly reason enough to dispose of said government as farcical
Greatful for what, exactly? "Oh please mister Blair, I do so love seeing my taxes wasted on other peoples' fathers' leftover wars. Do it some more, I'm close to orgasm!"
Please. There is absolutely nothing to be grateful for where Iraq is concerned
"some group" being the Iraqi government? Iraq was irrelevant. A relic. As much a danger to the Western world as Cuba is to the US. There was NO LINK between Iraq and any terrorist groups trained by the US government to fight communists. None.
Eliminate the Iraqi government? Why is that, again? Which specific threats are we talking about?
France invented democracy as we know it. When the French people disagree with stupid acts by their government, then they damn well act upon it. Any suggestion that disagreement with the government should lead to deportation is at best a call for Fascism, and at worst treasonable.
And on another note, my OWN experience is that boorish xenophobic racists are usually quite stupid as well. Make of that what you will.
Blitzen in very simple language, your comment sounds like you want to go and live in a dictatorship. You seem to ignore free speech is part of democracy, leaders are elected and at the end of the day public opinion can change things.
You agree with no72, that if anyone threats our way of life eliminate them, sorry but i'm with DirectHex in saying that comment is just crazy.
TiG
-- Hexus Meets Rock! --
Not the sharpest tool in the box....
Anyway, we seem to be moving particularly slowly on this one. I'm suprised that Iran would do anything to actively provoke a conflict, and yet it looks like that's exactly what they're trying to do.
I wonder if things would have moved as slowly as this had public opinion (Blitzen excluded of course) been so set against more military involvement overseas. Surely we'd all be steaming into the Gulf with missles primed by now had a similar event occured in more peaceful times...
sig removed by Zak33
I once heard a story from a squaddy mate of mine about Saddam.
Apparently a high ranking member of Al-qeada arranges a meeting with Saddam and bluntly told him that they wanted this and that and were going to set a camp here and Saddam was going to help and protect them.
To which Saddam responded by going in his desk draw, pulling out a pistol and shooting the guy.
He may have been a power crazed and evil despotic dictator, but those are 5 for a £1 in some parts of the world, but he considered terrorism below him. Most likely believing that he could beat America in an armed standoff.
'course I'm just re-telling the story, but it has a ring of truth to it.
I have to agree there in public opinion this is just another 15 soldiers lost in Iraq, I don't think most people separate the 2 places in their mind.
Had we not been at war in the region for the last few years and this happened then half the SAS would be blowing holes in Iranians right now. People would of been outraged, appalled and calling for blood.
An example of this is the Embassy staff in South Africa recently. Apparently not state backed, but no-one ever confirmed that til after it was announced that a large number of special forces were just a couple of hours away. If it was made clear that diplomacy was going to be the only option, like now, I bet it would be a different story.
whoa, the French invented democracy as we know it? please could you expand on this?
on the issue of the Iraq war being pointless, I do not totally adhere to that. Just because Saddam was not being a threat to us does not mean we should not intervene.
For example in the former Yugoslavia, should we not have intervened there? We were not threatened in anyway - and if anyone mentions the UN, I'll shoot them. The UN's role in that conflict was shameful
Can you not grasp why????I support my country. The majority of my country, as shown by poll after poll after poll, supported not getting involved in a pointless war on the basis of lies
Its because you were drip fed information by the opposition parties and tree-huggers.
What if they were wrong???
You had no evidence to the contrary did you? Or are you some kind of special agent?
Im neither xenophobic or racist. For you to make that assumption shows you for what you really are.And on another note, my OWN experience is that boorish xenophobic racists are usually quite stupid as well. Make of that what you will.
Why not try a few facts instead of opinions as you are making yourself look very stupid resorting to flame tactics as you arguments are very weak.
People with even limited intelligence know that France is one of the most facist countries in Europe.France invented democracy as we know it. When the French people disagree with stupid acts by their government, then they damn well act upon it. Any suggestion that disagreement with the government should lead to deportation is at best a call for Fascism, and at worst treasonable.
Do you ever look outside your window?
Last edited by Blitzen; 28-03-2007 at 09:57 AM.
I'm with Blitzen on this one. It not fair to call someone xenophobic or racist just because they have a different opinion to you. I don't think this is the case at all and you undermine your own argument by saying such things.
The main opposition party supported the war, publicly and in Parliament. I would suppose that "tree-hugger" would be your generic term for people who disagree with you, but probably shouldn't include the UN weapons inspectors who didn't find evidence of a WMD program in 10 years of looking.
Well, they weren't, were they?
Given that the "special agents" in this instance elected to rely upon the sole source of a man with drink and money problems who was desperate to provide something with which to buy his extraction from Iraq, it's probably quite a good thing that he isn't. We had evidence from a decade of weapons inspections that found nothing; and the years since the invasion have confirmed that that's because there was nothing to find. So yes, he did have evidence. My error was in giving the government the benefit of the doubt and assuming that they must have some extremely hard evidence to counter that, even if they weren't making it public. We now know that that was an unwarranted assumption.
Unless we're talking about the French, apparently.
In the light of your own zero-fact-content posts, that's a bit of a sticky wicket you're standing on. So far, you have provided no facts to counter anything that directhex has said, just a load of "what-ifs" and name-calling. You don't actually HAVE any arguments.
While the rest of us who aren't in the special needs class are familiar with people like de Montesquieu.
Do you ever read a newspaper? I mean the bits with words in?
What, as opposed to constant comments insulting the French? Get a grip.
This bit i'll reply to - nichomach has done his usual fantastic job of replying to the rest (and Blitzen's latest tirade)
We didn't invade Iraq for humanitarian reasons - we were told categorically by our government that Iraq could fire weapons of mass destruction at us within a 40 minute window - a flat out lie.
If we had invaded on the basis of EXTREMELY belated humanitarian actions, then I might have been somewhat more supportive - but we didn't, we invaded on the basis of a succession of lies.
I wholeheartedly support swift action by our military forces for humanitarian reasons - I don't support bombing a country daily for 10 years, then turning around and saying "omg teh bombs" because the US has decided they need to bolster their economy and make themselves feel better
Bingo. You know, one of the ironies of this is that Blitzen was apparently sent to Iraq; and he was sent there on the basis of a tissue of falsehoods, vested interests and unwarranted assumptions. The people that he's so keen to vilify are the ones who are saying "Hang on; before we send people like Blitzen in harm's way, we want a damned good reason. We don't want our servicemen and women to have their lives risked or indeed lost on the basis of a bunch of lies." Ah well, no good deed goes unpunished, eh, directhex?
Oh come on. We're English, its our duty to insult the French!
Only joking before you all jump on your bandwagons!!!
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