holy thread revival batman!
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holy thread revival batman!
Look who's been thread mining :lol:
Ok.
I've read everyone's opinion in here and disagree completely (on the whole).
I've had quite a good theory on why the so called "educated" liberal left are so against capital punishment it's quite simple. They've never been a serious victim of crime.
How many people against the death penalty have had someone close to them murdered? I'm guessing it's VERY low. I don't know about you, but if someone murdered me, I'd want their life ended, the thought of them living in Butlins, I mean jail for 7 - 10 years then going straight back to normal horrifies me.
And as for someone killing a Police Officer (Whilst on duty - very important) someone who dedicates their life to protecting and supporting YOU is even worse. I don't want to hear "They're no better than me" - they are. They're serving the public, risking their life on a daily basis, for not a lot of money. How many of you would rush into someone else's house and stop a 6 foot tall smack head assaulting his wife. Say what you want but the answer is not many. (I've been in that position myself and was VERY relieved when the Police came and took over). So yes, increase the sentencing for people who assault/murder Police. But don't stop there.
I'd suggest a massive increase in sentencing power for judges to use on ANYONE assaulting, threatening or murdering any public servant - Police, Fire, Nurse, Doctor that is on duty - or is deemed to be premeditated whilst NOT on duty.
Now, I know I'm fighting the tide here, but before you skim through and look for 4 lines you can counter argue with, read what I'd propose.
Firstly - restructure jails.
Remove the majority of "treats".
I think the re-offending rate has proven that the carrot alone does not work. Time for the stick.
Allow prisoners to EARN their treats.
Super Nanny our prisons, what works for kids will invariably work on adults.
Every incident where they're deemed to have done wrong, remove one of their benefits. TV/DVD/Outside time etc. Once the cons understand that these things are PRIVILEGES and not RIGHTS the attitude would (hopefully) change.
Set up job training.
They get their outside exercise of course, and can go to courses. (Going and completing these add to their treats) and will help them find a real job when back outside. Short NVQ's, ECDL and the like.
Jail Sentences need to be completely re-looked at.
I would personally have a 25 year sentence for ANY Gun crime.
Owning, threatening with or shooting. The people who use the guns need to have this in the back of their head. Add an Add campaign showing an 18 year old and a 43 year old version of the same person. Show the parents dying and kids growing up. Get them thinking, they don't want to miss their glory years.
Same for knives but 10 years.
As for the death penalty. Yes.
I'd have a life sentence as 30 years.
I'd also differentiate between a crime of passion and pre-meditated murder.
Even an 18 year old would end up as a 48 year old. The best part of his/her life gone. Forever.
Now the death penalty would come in, ONLY when the sentence is 3 life sentences, and their is 0% doubt. If there is even 1% doubt, they can rot in jail, but if, it can be proved WITHOUT doubt that they've done what is accused and it deserves 3 life sentences or more, it's time for the injection.
Crimes against public servants on duty - sentencing would be doubled. So yes, after killing 2 Police officers - you're going to be injected.
I am all for the death penalty. But why should it apply only to police killers. There are other acts which I would rate as "pure evil" even more than shooting cops.
A policeman's life is worth no more than a teacher's or a bus drivers. Taking a life is taking a life. Each should be punished equally.
I'm definitely not anti-death penalty though. Far from it. I'm just sensible enough to know that in most cases it's unworkable. I'd rather be sent to prison wrongfully for 20 years than killed wrongfully. If it can be proven 100%, then by all means go for the death penalty.
I'd happily be the one pulling the trigger/flicking the switch/turning on the gas, etc.
The profession of an individual should have no consequence on how a criminal is punished if that professional is murdered. Imo, killing a police officer is less of a crime than the London tube bombings a few years back (I am assuming no police officers were killed there).
This may sound harsh, but being attacked as a police officer is just a risk of the job, which comes with many jobs. Pilots have an increased risk of cancer through being closer to the upper atmosphere, fire fighters can be killed or injured in fires, etc etc. I'm sure you could say that the risk to police officers is more 'human' because it's caused by man, but then members of the army and other military professions have the same risk. Why should police officers be any different?
How can you say a somebody assaulting/killing a Police officer (who IS on duty) isn't worse than assaulting a normal person. ANYONE serving the public deserves more protection.
It would be interesting to see how many of you would vote for higher sentences for people who assault Nurses/NHS staff.
As I said before:
Anyone serving the public deserves increased protection from the law. End of.Quote:
And as for someone killing a Police Officer (Whilst on duty - very important) someone who dedicates their life to protecting and supporting YOU is even worse. I don't want to hear "They're no better than me" - they are. They're serving the public, risking their life on a daily basis, for not a lot of money. How many of you would rush into someone else's house and stop a 6 foot tall smack head assaulting his wife. Say what you want but the answer is not many. (I've been in that position myself and was VERY relieved when the Police came and took over). So yes, increase the sentencing for people who assault/murder Police. But don't stop there.
Surely not the Community Support Officers, because you have consistently despised them in previous posts. "Fake Plastic Police" - hilarious. End of.
And on the subject of hypocrisy, how do you reconicle your statements with your publicly saccharine religiosity, also consistently proudly exhibited? It is not possible to be both a christian and pro-death penalty. End of. Look at Anthony Walker's mum as an example, then decide which conviction you want to hold in future and which you want to discard.
On the subject of convictions, I'd be interested to hear how your proposal for 10 years imprisonment for knife ownership would be workable, because I own probably two dozen knives which I recklessy keep in my cutlery drawer.
In fact far from '4 lines that I disagree with' there's so many howlers in your tirade against the Global Liberal Conspiracy above that I don't have time to pick them out just now. :rockon2:. End of.
EDIT: in fact "Anyone serving the public deserves increased protection from the law. End of." is probably the most extreme marxist communist statement ever posted on here. What you are saying you believe is; not only are state employees more noble than capitalist dogs in the private sector but they are actually more valuable as human beings, that they have additional rights to self-interested bourgeoisie, and additional protections under the law! Or maybe it's more ill-considered burbling? :)
Here we go J - I'm right no matter what because I say I am and I know everything - Preston has arrived.
Firstly. I hate the "Fake Plastic Police". They're a waste of money.
"Excuse me sir, would you mind standing there whilst I call a real Police Officer to apprehend you"
Pointless. I'd much prefer to swap those for HALF the number of REAL Officers.
HOW DARE YOU tell me what I views I can hold and what I cannot. My Christian views do not conflict with my views on the death penalty. My personal Christian views do not conform with any of the major Christian churches, cause I personally believe that groups twist the message of the Lord to their own Agenda (Suicide Bombers anyone?). The bible was placed here for us to read and understand. I've read it, I've taken what I believe it says, I've used my own judgement (that God blessed me with) and my beliefs are in place. Someone telling me what I can or can't believe - Religious, or a pompous nitwit on a computer forum can go and ####.
My personal favourite - let's take a quote out of context time! Yay!Quote:
On the subject of convictions, I'd be interested to hear how your proposal for 10 years imprisonment for knife ownership would be workable, because I own probably two dozen knives which I recklessy keep in my cutlery drawer.
If you're too stupid to realise what I meant when I wrote "Same for knives" - then I'd avoid the medicine cabinet.
Yes I am. I'm saying anyone who risks their lives on a constant basis for idiots like you deserve better protection from the state. Any one who's stupid enough to attack an on duty Police Officer deserves what they get.Quote:
In fact "Anyone serving the public deserves increased protection from the law. End of." is probably the most extreme marxist communist statement ever posted on here. What you are saying you believe is; not only are state employees more noble than capitalist dogs in the private sector but they are actually more valuable as human beings, that they have additional rights to self-interested bourgeoisie, and additional protections under the law! Or maybe it's more ill-considered burbling? :)
IIRC - In the states, Police Dogs have the same legal protection as officers - ie you kill one, you'll be on trial for murder.
They got it right.
The beautiful thing? Once again, I'm in the majority. Every single survey done on capital punishment always sways in favour of bring it back (although the gap has fallen).
From another forum I visit.here and here is the news article.Quote:
My wife worked on projects with the mother in the local junior chamber of commerce and my sister in law and her husband are co-workers of the father. I know one of the officers who arrived early on the scene and got the details from him.
The attack was totally random... the two bastards went to a weathly section of town and started trying doors... theirs was unlocked. They found the father asleep on the couch and bashed his head in with a baseball bat then attacked and raped the wife and daughters. Not even the ten year old was spared. When the bank opened in the AM they forced the woman to withdraw 15k (largest amount that can be taken out in cash without requiring a security check) and she managed to get a message to the teller who immediately called the police. When the officers arrived they found the house going up in flames. All three females were DOA and the husband was in dire need of emergency medical treatment with a massive skull fracture and a severe concussion.
The suspects were arrested just outside the scene of the crime and have confessed to their actions. Apparently they had met in jail and were released recently. No word on prior convictions but I'm willing to bet they were bad enough to be considered a threat to society.
I find it extremely hard to NOT justify capital punishment for these two unless of course it would be a punishment much, much worse. I always try to think as rationally as possible with regard to CP, but there are times when I think that it is justified. This is one of those cases. I'm sure that the families of the victims could easily pull the trigger or lever for the hanging. It wouldn't bother me either.
So Bazzlad, are you saying that me as a cashier in a supermarket deserves more protection than someone else because I serve the public? Where does it end? Why can't everyone be treated equally?
No - I'm just presenting a hypothetical situation. Assuming something should happen, why shouldn't they be punished in the same way as if it happened to anyone else? I have heard of some stores that attract a more aggressive customer base than mine however, so this may still apply, but just not to me.
You'd have the same protection as you do now, as I have, as everyone else has. However, the people who are paid and risk their lives to protect us have more protection to discourage attacks on them.
Question - Would you be against minimum sentences for people who assault nurses?