Actually that statement just does not make any sense whatsoever. If everything good I do revolves around my relationships, where is "God" involved in all that ?
As you just said, my life revolves around my relationships ... Not my relationship with God.
I am willing to concede that God may exist - but I am going to need more proof than faith. If God exists, then this is the way God made me. So I am not going to burn in Hell for something he did.
Again - End result = Religion is not worth concerning yourself about
my point was simply that one should consider God in terms of relationship, not in terms of some puppetmaster who likes to muck around with toys, or who has no idea of His purpose and therefore creates us to work it out.
sure. but IF you wanted to know Him, that knowledge would come through developing a relationship with Him. Not trying to follow a set of rules, or religious practices.As you just said, my life revolves around my relationships ... Not my relationship with God.
Yep, He made you as you are. And accepts you as you are. But the million dollar question is whether you accept Him. And I agree, I would NOT simply accept His existence because someone told me He exists.I am willing to concede that God may exist - but I am going to need more proof than faith. If God exists, then this is the way God made me. So I am not going to burn in Hell for something he did.
Each Christian in a living relationship with Him would agree that they have proof within - ie not something that can be proven outside, to a non-believer. His existence is that real, due it being a relationship, not a hypothesis. It is 2 way.
Sorry dude. Relationships do not convince me of the existence of God. If everyone had something inside them, they should be able to explain or at the very least be able to describe it.
So God's existence is still a hypotheses.
I think we should stop here, or we risk repeating ourself over and over again discussing the very same points.
No come on - I think we have a very real chance of finally settling this once and for all
we're talking at cross purposes.
Wasn't trying to use relationships to convince you of God's existence. Am simply saying that the only way to grasp God's existence is through a relationship with Him, not through some airy fairy appeal to "you must believe because you must and because I say so".
A Christian can and should be able to describe what it is like to experience God inside them, but Preston et al dismiss it as loony ravings / hallucination / indoctrination / wild fantasy.
To someone who has not experienced Him, yes.So God's existence is still a hypotheses.
For want of an example, my experience of Christ is essentially JOYFUL. I have joy in my life. A deep seated, deeply felt joy, regardless of context & circumstance -sometimes intense, sometimes simply peaceful. And it is in relationship that I experience it - we have a continual conversation. Every day.
see? raving looney, that's me.
But fuddam... People claim to have relationships about a lot of different gods. People claim to have a relationship about their imaginary friend.
Why is your experience different? If you haven't experienced a relationships about other gods, how can you say they aren't real?
Because your relationship says so?
Why do christians try to convince people that their relationship is real and noone elses?
For 'Relationship', substitute 'Delusion'.
in answer to the 3 posts above
1) I never talked about any other religion, did I? I only talked about what I know.
2) ask a Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim, Taoist, Shintoist, Anamist etc about how the daily conversation goes with their god/s. Not their side of the conversation, but that of the god/s.
3) ask people who practice those other religions to describe the nature of that relationship, AS DESCRIBED IN THEIR SACRED TEXT/S. Ask them to describe where it talks about having a personal relationship with said deities, and how that relationship can be characterised. Ask them if having a personal relationship is essential / pivotal to said religion.
4) ask them WHY their god/s want to have a personal relationship with their creation, and they should quote from their scripture (ie rather than conjecture).
note: I have not criticised those religions here, nor claimed that they are inaccurate / fallacious etc. There is no point in me saying otherwise.
In summation, the message of the gospel is one of love, expressed through relationship. I have not seen any other religious document / scripture than comes close.
No, you haven't answered a single question.
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