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Thread: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

  1. #1
    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    It's time to retire my i7 920 CPU. I'm amazed it's lasted me over 10 years as I was expecting to swap it out after a year or two for an eight core CPU but I haven't felt the need. I've added faster SSDs, bigger HDDs, added RAM and been through a few GPUs but the 920 and ASUS mobo have done well. A few years ago I built my GF, now my wife, a quiet little PC with great help from here in this thread: https://forums.hexus.net/review-my-b...ing-400-a.html . Now I'd like some help to update my PC knowledge and build myself a new system.

    One of the HDD controllers just doesn't work with windows 10 and the whole PC has started having more & more issues since downgrading from windows 7 to 10. Direct3d has failed somehow meaning I can't play any 3d games, one of my drives has failed, another is possibly failing and Windows update has started failing as well as other niggles and glitches. I could possibly buy a new SATA SSD and with a fresh install of windows it might be fine for a while but it feels like it's time, plus I have spare money. I'm willing to spend as much as about £1000 but if I can get a satisfactory result for £500 then all the better.

    It's a general purpose build for games, photo & video editing, CD ripping, music listening. I don't feel the need for the most powerful CPU & GPU any more or any watercooling and of course reasonably quiet. I used my tiny fanless PC temporarily as my desktop and I loved the silence of it. I've done a bit of research in other threads here and other reviews etc. and this is what I've come up with and my reasoning:
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    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor £175.00
    This seems like a good price performance compromise. 6 cores at 3.6 should be a good improvement over my 920's 4 cores at 3.6 with presumably better IPC as well. I like the low power consumption as well. Could possibly go with a cheaper CPU.

    CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U12S SE-AM4 CPU Cooler £49.63
    I like my existing Noctua which provided plenty of cooling for the overclocked 920, quiet with the fans turned down to 1000rpm and has lasted as long as my CPU. So hopefully I can run this one at 500rpm and even quieter.

    Motherboard: Biostar X470GTA ATX AM4 Motherboard £94.92
    I like this one as it can take my Creative XFi PCI, which I like mostly for the front panel headphone socket and volume control. Also the 470 chipset which is less expensive than the 570. Not sure if jiggery pokery will be needed to update the BIOS before fitting the CPU.

    Memory: Crucial Ballistix Sport LT 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory £69.95

    Storage: ADATA XPG SX8200 Pro 512 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive £62.99
    M.2 , NVME speeds without being too expensive and too hot?

    Video Card: Existing GTX 960 strix
    Fingers crossed this card will work in a new mobo.

    Case: Phanteks Enthoo Pro ATX Full Tower Case £99.95
    I like this case as it has lots or room, I can fit large/slow fans in the front and bottom and exiting top and rear and the hot air won't be fighting gravity. Also front 5.1/4 drive bays for my optical drive and front panel audio from my XFi. I could go with the BitFenix Comrade ATX Mid Tower White Case for about £35 which is cheaper and smaller but I prefer the Enthoo. https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product/...ccom100wwxs1rp I've considered keeping my ancient Thermaltake Tsunami Dream but I want to fit large fans in the bottom and top and that would require modding plus I'd like a white case to go with my white desk.

    Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS Gold 450 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply £55.47
    I like Seasonic and this one seems adequate. I have an X900 but it's probably time it was retired from my main PC as it's 12 years old. Good innings with no faults.

    I did look at a Platinum fanless Seasonic but I'm not sure if it's worth the extra cost.
    https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product/...upply-ss400fl2
    https://www.scan.co.uk/products/400w...edium=referral

    Windows 10 pro (existing). I could go back to win 7 but I need forward compatibility with future apps etc.

    Possibly add a couple of Noctua fans.

    £612 so far.

    This is the PCPartpicker list I'm working on: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bfgygJ
    Last edited by Ciber; 08-12-2019 at 11:07 AM. Reason: Updated with advice
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    Missed by us all - RIP old boy spacein_vader's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    Looks good for the most part. If you can stretch another £15 or so on the memory the sweet spot is DDR4-3600 for Ryzen as above that speed it operates at a split multiplier which comes with a performance cost. Price/performance thats the best option IMO.

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    Senior Member cptwhite_uk's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    DDR 3200 CAS15 is equally as good as 3600,

    If on a budget get these, Buildzoid recommends them for overclocking, would overclock to 3600 with relative ease, apparently can do 4000, but there's no point in that.

    https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product/...s2k8g4d32aesbk

    Here's a couple more useful memory tweaking guides / results:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOqhyVNPhaM&t=354s
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH3qq_mSxTM&t=540s

    Edited your list:
    https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bfgygJ

    The SSD you listed is a SATA variant, you want an NVME drive for the improved speeds, the one I've selected is 3200Mb/s read, one of the fastest outside of PCIE Gen4 variants (only supported on X570 motherboards at present and very expensive)
    Last edited by cptwhite_uk; 08-12-2019 at 12:19 AM.

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  7. #5
    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    Quote Originally Posted by spacein_vader View Post
    Looks good for the most part. If you can stretch another £15 or so on the memory the sweet spot is DDR4-3600 for Ryzen as above that speed it operates at a split multiplier which comes with a performance cost. Price/performance thats the best option IMO.
    Seems like good advice.

    Quote Originally Posted by cptwhite_uk View Post
    DDR 3200 CAS15 is equally as good as 3600,

    If on a budget get these, Buildzoid recommends them for overclocking, would overclock to 3600 with relative ease, apparently can do 4000, but there's no point in that.

    https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product/...s2k8g4d32aesbk

    Here's a couple more useful memory tweaking guides / results:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOqhyVNPhaM&t=354s
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH3qq_mSxTM&t=540s
    Thanks, I'll check that out. I did tweak the DDR3 on my 920 to within an inch of its' life but I know nothing about Ryzen memory overclocking at the moment. I might not even overclock this build, IDK, lazy these days!

    Edited your list:
    https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bfgygJ

    The SSD you listed is a SATA variant, you want an NVME drive for the improved speeds, the one I've selected is 3200Mb/s read, one of the fastest outside of PCIE Gen4 variants (only supported on X570 motherboards at present and very expensive)
    Good point, NVME for not much more money. That SSD has good reviews as well.
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    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    I've upped the PSU power as the overall power use seems to be around 300. So this is the current list:

    PCPartPicker Part List

    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor (£175.00 @ Amazon UK)
    CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U12S SE-AM4 CPU Cooler (£50.62 @ Amazon UK)
    Motherboard: Biostar X470GTA ATX AM4 Motherboard (£98.41 @ Ebuyer)
    Memory: Crucial Ballistix Sport LT 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£69.95 @ Amazon UK)
    Storage: ADATA XPG SX8200 Pro 512 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£62.99 @ Box Limited)
    Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 960 2 GB Video Card
    Case: Phanteks Enthoo Pro ATX Full Tower Case (£99.95 @ Amazon UK)
    Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS Plus Platinum 550 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£91.47 @ Scan.co.uk)
    Total: £648.39
    Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
    Generated by PCPartPicker 2019-12-08 17:58 GMT+0000

    The Biostar product page for the mobo says this:
    Please update system BIOS before upgrade your processor (CPU) to avoid system failure
    * (R) Please Ensure You Had Updated the Latest BIOS Before Install the Raven Ridge CPU.
    So will I have to buy and fit a lower CPU, update the BIOS and then install the 3600?
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    Senior Member cptwhite_uk's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    Most likely, unless you can get the vender to do it for you. CCL are offering free BIOS upgrades. I know you want some PCI lanes, hence the choice of board. But is it that crucial? I'd highly recommend the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max, for similar money, which supports Ryzen 3000 series out of the box.

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  11. #8
    Senior Member cptwhite_uk's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    If you wanted a budget GPU upgrade you should look at one of these:

    Sub £160 - RX 590 8Gb Red Dragon (more vRAM) vs GTX 1650 Super 4Gb (more power efficient and quieter)
    Sub £200 - GTX 1660 Super (Palit, single fan, should be good enough as it's only 120W)
    Sub £310 - RX 5700 8Gb Powercolor AXRX

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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciber View Post
    So will I have to buy and fit a lower CPU, update the BIOS and then install the 3600?
    The Asus B450m board I just bought had a sticker on the box saying it was 3000 series ready. Would have thought the odds were in your favour these days, but worth asking the supplier to check. Last I looked there was a steady ebay market of those old cpus on ebay for this reason, but by now you shouldn't really need to go there.

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  14. #10
    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    Quote Originally Posted by cptwhite_uk View Post
    Most likely, unless you can get the vender to do it for you. CCL are offering free BIOS upgrades. I know you want some PCI lanes, hence the choice of board. But is it that crucial? I'd highly recommend the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max, for similar money, which supports Ryzen 3000 series out of the box.
    I could consider that but I might miss my old XFi.

    I really like the front panel headphone amplifier and volume control that comes with my PCI sound card. I've had a look and there are some PCIe version for around £100 with an external headphone amp that sits on the desk. Or an external soundcard like this https://www.scan.co.uk/products/crea...ca-optical-usb and there's a whole rabbithole of which USB DAC/headphone amp to buy!
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    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    This might also be a solution: https://uk.creative.com/p/speakers/s...x-katana#specs Usb soundcard, soundbar, sub & headphone amp in one. Hmmm.
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    "Windows 10 pro (existing). I could go back to win 7 but I need forward compatibility with future apps etc."

    Aren't these upgrades going to require a new copy of Windows or am I missing something?

    (Am I the only one who actually likes Windows 10? )

  17. #13
    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    Quote Originally Posted by raygdunn View Post
    "Windows 10 pro (existing). I could go back to win 7 but I need forward compatibility with future apps etc."

    Aren't these upgrades going to require a new copy of Windows or am I missing something?

    (Am I the only one who actually likes Windows 10? )
    I should be able to use my existing windows 10 licence. Windows 10 should work with windows 7 drivers but sometimes it loads another driver and things just won't work any more. Should be fine with hardware built for windows 10 though. I don't like that we have no control over when windows downloads and installs updates and there are other things windows 10 gives us no control over.

    I've started looking at changing my whole headphone/soundcard/amp/speaker setup so I don't have to have PCI on the mobo and it's got complicated! So many options external vs internal soundcard, all in one etc. etc..
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    The lancool ii should be out soon. For a £90 it looks really good IMO.

    They have simplified over clocking since the 920 so I imagine ryzen will be a doddle.

    I was thinking about a similar upgrade. I was going to try and get a used 2600 for~£90. The asrock pro4 b450 at ~£60 (probably not much use with your sound setup) looked an available budget board and try and snag some decent ram 3000 c15 or 1.2v or 3600 c17(?) In a sale. Not sure if ram will drop much in price. An m.2 ssd look to the nuts though and would be the sequential upgrade.

    I have a 3470 and the top pcie slot died on me so I'm only a TOC tic TOC away :/ I don't need to upgrade though.

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  20. #15
    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    I got a nice email replay form Ebuyer. They are willing to update the BIOS for me.

    Hi,

    We cannot confirm the BIOs version that will be allocated to your order. However we can look to update the BIOS prior to shipping. Please let us know if you wish to do this.

    Kind regards,

    Technical Support Advisor
    So if I decide to leave upgrading my audio for later, the mobo should be no problem.
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    Senior Member Ciber's Avatar
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      • PSU:
      • Seasonic Prime Ultra Snow Silent 650W
      • Case:
      • Phanteks Enthoo Pro
      • Operating System:
      • W10 64
      • Monitor(s):
      • Asus PG329Q
      • Internet:
      • Vodafone Fibre

    Re: First Major Build In Years. Help me to future proof.

    Quote Originally Posted by Domestic_Ginger View Post
    The lancool ii should be out soon. For a £90 it looks really good IMO.
    No 5.1/4 bays and no 200mm fans means that's not for me.

    They have simplified over clocking since the 920 so I imagine ryzen will be a doddle.
    Good news!

    I was thinking about a similar upgrade. I was going to try and get a used 2600 for~£90. The asrock pro4 b450 at ~£60 (probably not much use with your sound setup) looked an available budget board and try and snag some decent ram 3000 c15 or 1.2v or 3600 c17(?) In a sale. Not sure if ram will drop much in price. An m.2 ssd look to the nuts though and would be the sequential upgrade.

    I have a 3470 and the top pcie slot died on me so I'm only a TOC tic TOC away :/ I don't need to upgrade though.
    Hope you get that sorted out
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