12 year old PC upgrade

[douglasb]

I’m currently running a Q6600 and an upgrade is long overdue!
PC would mainly be used for gaming (possibly some video recording) and work.

At the moment I’m considering either:

Intel i5 10600k & Z490 motherboard - £445 (but there’s £25 cashback available dropping price to £420)
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/asus...nderbolt-3-atx

or

AMD Ryzen 7 3700X & B550 motherboard - £470
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/asus...32-gen2-aplusc

Either CPU/mobo combination would be paired to 32GB of RAM (2x 16GB) sticks at 3000Hz and a 1TB NVMe M.2 SSD
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/1tb-...170k-240k-iops

My current GTX960 will be carried over for now. As nice as it would be to upgrade it too, Corona has reduced my income for now so it will have to wait.

My thoughts are that the Intel setup is cheaper & has the faster CPU however the AMD setup has PCIe 4.0 - is it worth paying £50 more to have a slower chip but access to PCIe 4.0?
If the new CPU/mobo can last another 12 years that’s a bonus but isn’t essential!

Thank you all for your thoughts and advice

[Xlucine]

The 3700X is a considerably faster CPU - 8 cores is better than 6, and it's got better single thread performance on top of that. In terms of cooling you'll need an aftermarket heatsink for the i5 (and you'll need to spend ~£100 to get performance comparable to that seen in reviews), while the 3700X comes with an OK one (where it'll be indistinguishable from the performance in reviews).

If it were my money I'd go for the 3700X, but then I already did last year

[philehidiot]

I'd consider doing something I ended up doing which is to reduce the RAM to 16GB and increase the speed. Increasing to 3200 gives a decent increase on Ryzen. Beyond this it's no so clear cut but I'd definitely advise anyone to get 3200 RAM as a minimum. My plan is to upgrade to 32 as and when required. There has been a noticable difference when a BIOS bug sends my RAM back to 2666MHz, enough to make to go and find out what is wrong. I have come from 24GB of RAM and I've not found a use case to provoke an upgrade as yet, despite having the funds available. Some games do want 32GB and if that's you, then I'd consider it but really, 16GB is more than enough. I run multiple virtual machines simultaneously and I have never hit a RAM wall.

I really don't think there's a case for Intel right now in this range. There are some specific workloads which do benefit but really, AMD is where it's at for us mere mortals. PCI-e 4 is a futureproofing feature which is worth the outlay for people like me and thee who keep PCs for a while after buying something beefy. It's quite possible that GPUs within the lifespan of this system will benefit from PCI-e 4.

MOAR CORES is the way forward now and your system will, in my view, have a longer life with more cores to its name.

Also, I was looking at cheaper systems but a friend saw the 3900X + mobo + RAM in a bundle which came into my budget. Have a look at these bundles which may well be more prevelant as the retailers try to clear out the X models in favour of new XT stock. Also, I'd avoid the XTs whilst the Xs are available at any kind of discount.

1TB NVMe sounds good. If you are really struggling for cash then you could get a smaller SATA SSD as a stop gap as right now, for most of us, the real world difference is marginal. For futureproofing, I'd pay the extra if you can now and go with the M2 drive, especially if you're thinking about throwing around large video files.

I have got an MP600 SSD which is PCI-e 4. For my use there is no real difference compared to running the same drive at PCI-e 3 or my SATA SSDs. The only difference is when I'm using large files (the speed is "nice to have" here) or have 3 virtual machines caning the drive at once. I run the same games on my M2 drive as I did when the system was on SATA drives and I notice no real difference in loading times. That being said, the difference will be felt as the system ages and, if you buy SATA now, you'll probably end up just getting an M2 drive down the line anyway. Still, if money is tight, this is somewhere to consider a saving if it'll enable a better CPU, mobo, etc. Myself, if a SATA SSD over M2 would enable Ryzen over Intel, I'd go with the SATA drive with a view to upgrading later.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Lower tier Z490 motherboards are not great and the Intel setup needs a CPU cooler - the Ryzen 7 3700X comes with a solid stock cooler.

Also,3200MHZ RAM is a better choice,and there are better B550 motherboards for a similar price.

The new consoles will use 8C Zen2 cores,and some of the newer engines such as Decima are showing very good scaling with more cores. However,if you can wait I would wait for Zen3,which is coming in the next 6 months.

[kalniel]

I agree with the AMD route recommendations - the 3700X is great bang for buck.

If you're comparing RAM at scan then it's only £15 more to go 32gb of 3200 both at cas 16, though I would be tempted to put up yet another £13 and get the Ryzen tuned version: https://www.scan.co.uk/products/32gb...-amd-ryzen-opt

It's not really the ryzen tuning that I'd care about, but I think these are better (and newer) underlying chips which would give you scope for pushing further using the DRAM optimiser. If you can't push out for 32GB of those then 16GB won't be a limitation in the near future.

Also agree about the SATA vs NVMe comment - worth it if you're not paying a premium and I think the Crucial you've chosen doesn't have a premium so is a great choice - it's not saturating PCIe3 yet but having PCIe4 in the build will likely be useful down the line.

That 960 is going to hold you back whatever you decide. Definitely look out for some secondhand upgrade if/when people make the switch to newer cards this autumn.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

With RAM I would avoid Corsair due to its lottery of memory chips(unless the Ryzen tuned version is more consistent). Generally speaking Crucial Ballistix 3200MHZ/3600MHZ RAM is a safer choice as it uses Micron E-die:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Crucial-Bal...5240413&sr=8-4

Regarding motherboards,I would look at the MSI Meg Mortar or Tomahawk. However AWD-IT do some really great value bundles with the Ryzen 9 3900 non-X:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html

The last bundle is cheaper with the same motherboard and a Ryzen 9 3900 non-X,than the Scan bundle with a Ryzen 7 3700X.

This Ryzen 9 3900 gaming bundle is excellent value if you are willing to give up PCI-E 4.0:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html

However,as I mentioned earlier Zen3 looks like it will move to a 8 core CCX/CCD so will definitely have improvements in games.

Also I wouldn't get that Crucial SSD as its QLC and has inconsistent performance - the WD SN550 can be had for similar money:
https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/wd-...l-shop-3501047

SATA M2 SSDs cost about the same,so if you can use a NVME one,it is a better choice IMHO.

That 960 is going to hold you back whatever you decide. Definitely look out for some secondhand upgrade if/when people make the switch to newer cards this autumn.

Fallout 4 showed the same dips in performance with a GTX960,RX470 and a GTX1080!

[douglasb]

I agree with the AMD route recommendations - the 3700X is great bang for buck.

If you're comparing RAM at scan then it's only £15 more to go 32gb of 3200 both at cas 16, though I would be tempted to put up yet another £13 and get the Ryzen tuned version: https://www.scan.co.uk/products/32gb...-amd-ryzen-opt

Also agree about the SATA vs NVMe comment - worth it if you're not paying a premium and I think the Crucial you've chosen doesn't have a premium so is a great choice - it's not saturating PCIe3 yet but having PCIe4 in the build will likely be useful down the line.

That 960 is going to hold you back whatever you decide. Definitely look out for some secondhand upgrade if/when people make the switch to newer cards this autumn.

Thank you for the recomendations Kalniel & telling me about the RAM, thank you aswell for taking the time to find a specific one to recommend too! That was exactly why I had chosen that Crucial SSD - NVMe without the price premium over SATA

With RAM I would avoid Corsair due to its lottery of memory chips(unless the Ryzen tuned version is more consistent). Generally speaking Crucial Ballistix 3200MHZ/3600MHZ RAM is a safer choice as it uses Micron E-die:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Crucial-Bal...5240413&sr=8-4

Regarding motherboards,I would look at the MSI Meg Mortar or Tomahawk. However AWD-IT do some really great value bundles with the Ryzen 9 3900 non-X:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html

The last bundle is cheaper with the same motherboard and a Ryzen 9 3900 non-X,than the Scan bundle with a Ryzen 7 3700X.

This Ryzen 9 3900 gaming bundle is excellent value if you are willing to give up PCI-E 4.0:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/amd-ryzen-9...pu-bundle.html

Also I wouldn't get that Crucial SSD as its QLC and has inconsistent performance - the WD SN550 can be had for similar money:
https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/wd-...l-shop-3501047

SATA M2 SSDs cost about the same,so if you can use a NVME one,it is a better choice IMHO.

Thank you CAT-THE-FIFTH.
The RAM is now a choice between the one Kalniel suggested and your amazon find.

I'd seen AWD-it while searching but as I hadn't heard of them before slightly discounted them when looking at where to buy from. Those bundles do look like good deals, is it much of a downgrade chosing a B550 rather than an X570?
I'd rather go for a board with PCIe 4.0 just for future proofing, yea I wouldn't be held back by PCIe 3.0 at the moment but if I were to run this mobo/CPU for another 10 years then who knows.

Nice find spotting that WD SSD! If the offer is still there when I purchase in a couple of days I'll most likely go that route.


Looking at the Ryzon 3900 vs 3900X it looks like the 3900 is an identical chip just slight de-tuned so I assume the 3900 can be overclocked to match the 3900X without too much difficulty? Or is it better to simply buy the 3900X in the first place?

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Thank you for the recomendations Kalniel & telling me about the RAM, thank you aswell for taking the time to find a specific one to recommend too! That was exactly why I had chosen that Crucial SSD - NVMe without the price premium over SATA



Thank you CAT-THE-FIFTH.
The RAM is now a choice between the one Kalniel suggested and your amazon find.

I'd seen AWD-it while searching but as I hadn't heard of them before slightly discounted them when looking at where to buy from. Those bundles do look like good deals, is it much of a downgrade chosing a B550 rather than an X570?
I'd rather go for a board with PCIe 4.0 just for future proofing, yea I wouldn't be held back by PCIe 3.0 at the moment but if I were to run this mobo/CPU for another 10 years then who knows.

Nice find spotting that WD SSD! If the offer is still there when I purchase in a couple of days I'll most likely go that route.


Looking at the Ryzon 3900 vs 3900X it looks like the 3900 is an identical chip just slight de-tuned so I assume the 3900 can be overclocked to match the 3900X without too much difficulty? Or is it better to simply buy the 3900X in the first place?

I would err with caution with Corsair,as those Crucial kits are apparently guarenteed to be Micron E-die,and ideally you want Samsung B-die or Micron E-die for Ryzen. If the Ryzen optimised kits actually have selected RAM chips specifically then I would consider the Corsair kits.

My mate got one of their Ryzen 9 3900 bundles and upgraded from their Phenom II X6 which was nearly 9 years old,so it will be a good upgrade for you.

The B550 has less connectivity onboard,ie,the X570 is better for XFire or if you want to run loads of NVME SSDs. Ryzen tends to do better with PBO activated,rather than traditional overclocking but the CPU should be fine at stock IMHO. Personally I would just put a better cooler on the CPU,and use PBO,but TBF I would just keep the CPU at stock anyway.

However,the Ryzen 9 3900 non-X and Ryzen 9 3900 have almost the same performance:
https://www.tomshardware.com/uk/revi...eview-eco-mode

I would just keep it at stock clockspeeds.

This SSD is also decent:
https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/ada...amazon-3505887

It is generally faster than the WD SN550,but RMA is not located in the UK.

[Uriel]

I got my Ryzen 2700 with Asus Prime B450 Plus and 16GB RAM kit from AWD IT. It took quite a while to arrive, but came assembled. I was pleasantly surprised to find they had used a 2700x instead of a 2700. Extremely good value for money (even if it had been a 2700) - and other than being a little bit slow I've got nothing to complain about.

[douglasb]

UPDATE

I went with the Ryzen 9 3900 and Asus ROG B550 combo from AWD-IT (waiting for them to let me know when I can come collect it) and 32GB of Crucial Ballistix at 3200Hz, both as suggested by CAT-THE-FIFTH so thank you again.

I’ve not gone for a SSD at the moment as I spent more on the CPU/Mobo than originally planned so instead I’ll be getting one over the next few months & maybe an AIO CPU cooler too

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

UPDATE

I went with the Ryzen 9 3900 and Asus ROG B550 combo from AWD-IT (waiting for them to let me know when I can come collect it) and 32GB of Crucial Ballistix at 3200Hz, both as suggested by CAT-THE-FIFTH so thank you again.

I’ve not gone for a SSD at the moment as I spent more on the CPU/Mobo than originally planned so instead I’ll be getting one over the next few months & maybe an AIO CPU cooler too

Tell us how you get on with it. My mate when they got their bundle,had the CPU and cooler pre-installed.

[douglasb]

I collected the mobo & processor bundle on Thursday (Stoke isn’t too far from me) to save the risk of postage and so I could have it sooner.
I’ve no complaints about the service from AWD-IT, they were prompt responding to emails when we were arranging collection - my only complaint is the way they’ve installed the heat sink the AMD writing is at 90’ rather than vertical which is hardly the end of the world! Eventually I’ll stick an AiO on it so it won’t be an issue but I need a new case first as all that will fit in my current one is a 120mm radiator