Microsoft puts Windows 10X plans on hold

[HEXUS]

Instead, its software development efforts are being concentrated on the Sun Valley update.

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[cheesemp]

Someone at Microsoft management needs to take a good long look at their long term plan. Microsoft are becoming worse than Google for pulling the rug out from something before it has a chance to get going. Looking at UWP/Store apps - they might have had a chance had any developers actually believed Microsoft would stick with it but Microsoft show again and again they don't (WinRT, Windows phone). I've come to the conclusion this is the difference between Apple and Microsoft - Apple just go we're now doing X so support it Devs the old way won't work much longer where as Microsoft still feel like they are more bothered about supporting Win32 than anything newer.

[Corky34]

Just what I've always wanted, more stuff rolled into Windows that seems to only be targeted at niche market segments, first it was mobile phone stuff, then it was Microsoft Store, then it was UWP, then XBOX stuff, 3D stuff, and faxing...Who sends faxes in this day and age.

I get wanting to appeal to a wide an audience as possible but Windows was never designed to be modular OS, at least not as modular as Linux, so all these additions just add to the cruft. If their code base isn't already weighed down with cruft it makes one wonder how much more it can take.

[LSG501]

Someone at Microsoft management needs to take a good long look at their long term plan.

While I won't disagree on this, I do think we need to give all companies a little slack when it comes to changing schedules, because the way people have been using PC's has changed with covid and home working etc. We need to remember that MS is more about businesses than they are home users.

In all honesty I'm more annoyed about neo possibly being axed (rumours) than I am Windows X being put on hold....

There's also a side of me which kind of thinks that MS maybe saw that the majority of windows (business) users didn't want such a cut down OS as Windows X and are now looking to just integrate the 'best bits' into windows 10 instead. In all honesty with Panos Panay in charge of both the hardware and software departments I'm hoping they finally get their act together because he does seem to understand that hardware and the OS needs to work together and look good doing it, it's part of what helps to sell Apple stuff.

[lumireleon]

with all the BILLIONS in Microsoft accounts...its not bad to experiment. Windows phone OS and the purchase of Nokia was a total failure BUT hey! they tried. Windows 10 is the best operating systems on earth for its wide support on different hardware and most important the EXTREME app support.

[Usernamist]

Good. I was extremely excited for this (partly for the spectacle of a slow death and over-support it would've gotten, as is usual for truly great Microsoft products), but shelving it indefinitely is definitely for the best. I just hope they can backport all the good ideas they had for 10X to Windows 10 proper

[cheesemp]

Someone at Microsoft management needs to take a good long look at their long term plan.

While I won't disagree on this, I do think we need to give all companies a little slack when it comes to changing schedules, because the way people have been using PC's has changed with covid and home working etc. We need to remember that MS is more about businesses than they are home users.

In all honesty I'm more annoyed about neo possibly being axed (rumours) than I am Windows X being put on hold....

There's also a side of me which kind of thinks that MS maybe saw that the majority of windows (business) users didn't want such a cut down OS as Windows X and are now looking to just integrate the 'best bits' into windows 10 instead. In all honesty with Panos Panay in charge of both the hardware and software departments I'm hoping they finally get their act together because he does seem to understand that hardware and the OS needs to work together and look good doing it, it's part of what helps to sell Apple stuff.

I see what you are saying but Microsoft does need a long term plan. They just seem to think supporting Win32 while throwing new options will eventually get something to stick but devs (like myself) just don't bother as they A) likely drop it when it doesn't take off in 3 years B) The old stuff will work for the next 10 years.

They kind of need to do an Apple hear and say this is the future of Windows App development - we will stick with it and won't change.

I'm reminded here of a comment on a website from an Apple/Web dev saying why can't Microsoft just make apps work on Arm and x86 like I can with Apple. I'm a little unsure of the details but I believe Apple just changed their binary format to contain the two different versions of the app and said to Devs you will support it if you want to run on our OS's (The xcode compiler just made it all happen). Where as Microsofts answer was to push Windows RT which when it failed to take off promptly gave up. I really dislike Apple but they do know how to ecosystem.

[LSG501]

I see what you are saying but Microsoft does need a long term plan. They just seem to think supporting Win32 while throwing new options will eventually get something to stick but devs (like myself) just don't bother as they A) likely drop it when it doesn't take off in 3 years B) The old stuff will work for the next 10 years.

They kind of need to do an Apple hear and say this is the future of Windows App development - we will stick with it and won't change.

I'm reminded here of a comment on a website from an Apple/Web dev saying why can't Microsoft just make apps work on Arm and x86 like I can with Apple. I'm a little unsure of the details but I believe Apple just changed their binary format to contain the two different versions of the app and said to Devs you will support it if you want to run on our OS's (The xcode compiler just made it all happen). Where as Microsofts answer was to push Windows RT which when it failed to take off promptly gave up. I really dislike Apple but they do know how to ecosystem.

The issue isn't so much about them being able to do it, it's more about the big businesses that pay the majority of their money not wanting to change their existing software etc, you just have to look at how slow they are to upgrade windows versions, not to mention the 'pay for extended support' that many do, so they don't have to change their 'custom built' in house software.

I'm sure MS would Love to just rip out support for legacy code and do a clean OS (with just a store, they clearly can as it's shown in windows RT/10x) but at the same time they have their main source of income (and it likely wouldn't just affect windows) saying, we need such and such for our software.

MS have also just released something that brings all the software under one roof so to speak, annoyingly I can't remember the name though lol, so it's not like MS isn't trying to make life 'better' for dev's but windows just isn't coded in the same way as unix/linux so can't just swap out base code so easily.

[cheesemp]

The issue isn't so much about them being able to do it, it's more about the big businesses that pay the majority of their money not wanting to change their existing software etc, you just have to look at how slow they are to upgrade windows versions, not to mention the 'pay for extended support' that many do, so they don't have to change their 'custom built' in house software.

I'm sure MS would Love to just rip out support for legacy code and do a clean OS (with just a store, they clearly can as it's shown in windows RT/10x) but at the same time they have their main source of income (and it likely wouldn't just affect windows) saying, we need such and such for our software.

MS have also just released something that brings all the software under one roof so to speak, annoyingly I can't remember the name though lol, so it's not like MS isn't trying to make life 'better' for dev's but windows just isn't coded in the same way as unix/linux so can't just swap out base code so easily.

I think my point is that they try these complete new ways for a bit - But the pull (and stability) of legacy is too strong so they give up. UWP is a good example - They could have just extended the traditional 'exe' (even if like apple is just hid different versions of the app in hidden folders) but they are too worried someone will try and run it on Windows 7 and complain so they went for a completely new app format that only really works on the app store!

Edit: And getting back to Windows 10X - no one would have made UWP apps for it and it would be dropped just like Windows RT!

[LSG501]

I think my point is that they try these complete new ways for a bit - But the pull (and stability) of legacy is too strong so they give up. UWP is a good example - They could have just extended the traditional 'exe' (even if like apple is just hid different versions of the app in hidden folders) but they are too worried someone will try and run it on Windows 7 and complain so they went for a completely new app format that only really works on the app store!

in a way I think that's the aim of the tool/software I was talking about, essentially bringing it all under one 'roof' but able to be built using different approaches. Found it's name now too... project reunion, whether it has the impact they want is another thing.

Edit: And getting back to Windows 10X - no one would have made UWP apps for it and it would be dropped just like Windows RT!

Windows 10x isn't just restricted to uwp though last I checked.... it basically supports all the current formats, just in their own little 'containers', which I suppose could be best described as mini sandboxed virtual machines.... If I'm honest with the pause on 10x I'm fully expecting this to be ported over at some point in the future or be the basis of a 'replacement' to the core of windows 10.

https://www.windowscentral.com/5-thi...ndows-10x-apps

[cheesemp]

in a way I think that's the aim of the tool/software I was talking about, essentially bringing it all under one 'roof' but able to be built using different approaches. Found it's name now too... project reunion, whether it has the impact they want is another thing.


Windows 10x isn't just restricted to uwp though last I checked.... it basically supports all the current formats, just in their own little 'containers', which I suppose could be best described as mini sandboxed virtual machines.... If I'm honest with the pause on 10x I'm fully expecting this to be ported over at some point in the future or be the basis of a 'replacement' to the core of windows 10.

https://www.windowscentral.com/5-thi...ndows-10x-apps

That's probably a good way to do it. I think Windows store apps are a half way house to this idea. Now Microsoft just need to stick to it as a plan!

[LSG501]

That's probably a good way to do it. I think Windows store apps are a half way house to this idea. Now Microsoft just need to stick to it as a plan!

Yeah I think the idea in MS's head is for windows to basically be the 'universal' platform with azure being the 'money maker'. Satya Nadella has been very 'cross platform with azure at the centre of it all' when you think about it. They've gradually integrated linux more and more into the OS (don't see the point personally when most will happily run in a vm) and they basically support all current 'web apps' last time I checked.... the issue is it's starting to muddy the water over what windows 10 is so to speak.