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Thread: Making a website for someone

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    Funking Prink! Raz316's Avatar
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    Making a website for someone

    I've been asked to make a website for someone. Nothing too clever, just something for them to show off their artwork and provide some information about themselves.

    First off, I'll be charging for this site so do I have to declare any earnings to the tax man? Which brings me on to my second question... just how much should I be charging for this? The site will have a database running it so the person can maintain the site themselves once it's going. I figure the upfront cost for this would be more than say, a 'hard coded' site, but obviously there will be little/no costs down the line for updates.

    Any ideas?

    Cheers!

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    Quick and dirty answers:
    Quote Originally Posted by Raz316 View Post
    First off, I'll be charging for this site so do I have to declare any earnings to the tax man?
    Short answer: legally yes. slightly longer answer: if you're earning enough already to be paying tax, then definately. If you're a student and ear less in a year than the minimum tax threshold, then still probably yes, but if they don't demand you fill in a tax return, it's no problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raz316 View Post
    just how much should I be charging for this?
    (What you want to be paid per hour x 2) x how long it takes you.

    (the x2 is for costs (electricity, rent, computer etc), and will still make you much cheaper than any real commercial outfit would be.
    Quote Originally Posted by Raz316 View Post
    but obviously there will be little/no costs down the line for updates
    Good for them but you might be surprised if you do a good job they may want plenty of improvements. Also make sure you're happy about bugfixing, if there are bugs (there will be) will you fix them for free? For ever?
    They told me I was gullible ... and I believed them.

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    Most professionals charge mimimun £50 an hour for dynamic/database driven pages, so thats something to go on already. You have to think how long its going to take you and how difficult it will be to do and then work out your costs from there, and like stytagm said, take into account your costs.
    Another thing you should think about is actual design work. How much design work are you actually doing? Are you just designing the layout and coding it up, or are you actually designing any of the content (graphics, logos etc). The more you do, the more you can charge.
    Hope that helps a bit.

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    Cheers you two,

    Sty: Yeah I work full time so I'll look into how I declare it. I hadn't really thought about it, but I figured I'd do bug fixes for free (as it's my fault). If there are any other changes outside of the original spec I'd have to consider asking for a lil bit extra

    Clock: I'll be doing the coding, layout and graphics (though obviously they'll provide the artwork images). Thanks for the cost guideline it'll give me something to go on!

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    As you already work full time, find your local tax office and just ring them up for a chat.

    Once they check your records, you may well find out that they tell you not to bother unless it's over £xxx amount - otherwise you're looking at some really long, boring paperwork!

    Either way, you'll find out and it's cost you nothing.

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    Quote Originally Posted by Raz316 View Post
    ....

    Sty: Yeah I work full time so I'll look into how I declare it. I hadn't really thought about it, but I figured I'd do bug fixes for free (as it's my fault). If there are any other changes outside of the original spec I'd have to consider asking for a lil bit extra
    Is that spec written?

    If not, you're creating a rod for your own back.

    The first rule of customers is that they don't know what they want, up-front. You're lucky if they know what it is when they get it.

    The second rule is that what they wanted will change as things progress.

    And the third rule is that they'll insist that what they want now is what they wanted back then, and that they told you that clearly at the time.


    Personally, I would not agree to do such a project as this at all, unless I was covered by a clear statement of what's expected, what they get for their money and what theydon't get for their money. That kind of clear, written understanding protects them as much as it protects you.

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    I don't understand why you would need to declare this.

    If I fix my mates car and he gives me £50, I don't need to declare it.
    If I build someone a...table (lol) and they pay me, I don't need to declare it.

    Why would you need to declare this? It's not like a job or anything, just a one off kind of thing.

    Someone explain this to me please ?
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    Re: Making a website for someone

    Quote Originally Posted by tom18230 View Post
    I don't understand why you would need to declare this.

    If I fix my mates car and he gives me £50, I don't need to declare it.
    If I build someone a...table (lol) and they pay me, I don't need to declare it.

    Why would you need to declare this? It's not like a job or anything, just a one off kind of thing.

    Someone explain this to me please ?
    It is earned income - strictly speaking you should declare it. Even the £50 you mate gave you (assuming there's profit in it). That said, we all know the difference between what's in the law and what happens in everyday life

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    Funking Prink! Raz316's Avatar
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    Re: Making a website for someone

    Quote Originally Posted by Saracen View Post
    Is that spec written?

    If not, you're creating a rod for your own back.

    The first rule of customers is that they don't know what they want, up-front. You're lucky if they know what it is when they get it.

    The second rule is that what they wanted will change as things progress.

    And the third rule is that they'll insist that what they want now is what they wanted back then, and that they told you that clearly at the time.


    Personally, I would not agree to do such a project as this at all, unless I was covered by a clear statement of what's expected, what they get for their money and what theydon't get for their money. That kind of clear, written understanding protects them as much as it protects you.
    Woops was meant to quote you!

    Nothing has been written yet, but I've been discussing it with them. I think I already have a fair idea as to what they want (and really, it's nothing too major) so I can't see any minor alterations being an issue. This is more some work for a friend of a friend than a professional approach but I'll make sure I have a written spec before I hand it over.

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    Quote Originally Posted by Raz316 View Post
    ..... This is more some work for a friend of a friend than a professional approach .....
    Which, in my experience, is an area that's potential fraught with problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raz316 View Post
    ..... but I'll make sure I have a written spec before I hand it over.
    Entirely up to you of course, but if it were me, I'd want that written spec before I started work, not once I;d done it but hadn't handed it over. By then, it's largely too late.

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    As a full time IT freelancer I agree with Saracen 100%. You may think it's all straight forward now but the chance it could explode into something more is not worth the risk. Personally I would never do it if it wasn't for a good/close friend. A friend of a friend? Written contract else walk away.

    Anything I do for friends I do for free or not at all for two reasons: (1) No consideration (ie. Payment) on their side so no binding contract, (2) I'd feel like a pretty crap friend charging them my usual day rate.

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    Re: Making a website for someone

    I don't understand why you would need to declare this.

    If I fix my mates car and he gives me £50, I don't need to declare it.
    If I build someone a...table (lol) and they pay me, I don't need to declare it.

    Why would you need to declare this? It's not like a job or anything, just a one off kind of thing.

    Someone explain this to me please ?
    Unfortunately, when you fix a company's car or a company's table, there's usually a record of the payment to you, i.e on the company's books.

    Of course, if the company find a way to "brown bag" you the payment then that's a different matter.

    Forget the Police, the Inland Revenue are some people you never want to be on the wrong side of!

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